Is this cam over ?

[Wolfdog91]

Posted about this before and noticed a few different people calling different things cam over and got a little confused. Ment to post a video then a few months back but never got around to it.
Anyhow finally fixed what I was talking about today. So what would you cont this as ? Cam over or something else?

 

[rdb8847]

raise the die in the press. run the ram all the way up and leave it up. lower the die until it touches. lower the ram. lower the die 1/8 -1/4 turn and lock it down. run the ram up and it will be in a cam over position.

 

[Diverjeff]

I've always referred to it as cam over and use this method when I'm full length resizing on my Redding T-7 press.I run my die down until it touches the ram and then a little more for a light/firm cam over,and then tighten the lock ring so the die is squared up to the ram.I'm also using the Redding Comp. shellholder set(with Comp. dies)for adjusting my shoulder bump so may be a little different setup if using a conventional shellholder.

 

[DShortt]

This should be interesting. Tagging this thread.

Got the popcorn ready.

 

[Bill K]

To me, once the ram/shell holder comes into contact with the die body, it has reached it's full stroke. From there, that extra movement in your handle is play in the toggle/s and nothing more.

 

[GLShooter]

I load a bunch if stuff that tge shell holder is never touched by tge die. I've ground tge tops of tge holders around 0.010 to deal with wildcat chambers. No problems with chambering or brass life.

 

[Intheshop]

Ask yourself.... does every press go past center?

If the answer is no.... then expect ambiguity in the response to the question of "cam over". Saying,there's better ways to frame the question.

Good luck with your project.

 

[JFrank]

Looks like cam over to me.

 

[Mulligan]

Posted about this before and noticed a few different people calling different things cam over and got a little confused. Ment to post a video then a few months back but never got around to it.
Anyhow finally fixed what I was talking about today. So what would you cont this as ? Cam over or something else?

Question: I have my Full Length Resizing Die/Body Die adjusted so that it is touching the Shellholder and I cannot push my shoulder back. Is there something wrong with my Sizing Die?



Answer: Probably not. In most instances, using Cam-Over will allow the reloader to push the shoulder back sufficiently.

To set a Full Length/Body Die up to Cam-Over:

1) Install the appropriate Shellholder into the Ram of your Press.

2) Raise the Ram so that it is in its uppermost position.

3) Screw the Full Length Resizing Die/Body Die down into the press until it firmly contacts the Shellholder.

4) Back the Ram away from the Die.

5) Screw the Die down FURTHER into your press an additional 1/8th to ¼ turn.

Note that you will feel the Ram/Shellholder contact the resizing Die before the stroke is completed. Completing the Ram Stroke will feel as though you are snapping the latch on a toolbox.

These directions apply only to standard Single Stage Presses. If your single stage press was not manufactured by Redding Reloading Equipment, please contact the manufacturer to see if using Cam-Over is appropriate for your particular Reloading Press.

Redding Reloading Equipment

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Direct from Redding.

CW

 

[Conaso]

I have an old Pacific (Hornady 007 label) press that visibly shows the ram go up to its highest point then settles down a bit when the handle goes into its final (down) resting position. That press is now relegated to decapping primers using a universal decapping dies, keeping my reloading dies cleaner.

I also have an RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme (RC IV), that supposedly has a camming action. But the ram does not go into its highest position until the handle is in its final (down) resting position. I put a very thin piece of paper on top of the shell holder, tighten the die all the way before locking it down.

I know there are proponents of 'jamming' that die into the shell holder, backing off the ram then going another 1/8 or 1/4 turn. To me that die may not be aligned anymore. Not I, I've been reloading for more than 40 years and never had a stuck case or any other issues.

To each his own...

 

[Wolfdog91]

I've always referred to it as cam over and use this method when I'm full length resizing on my Redding T-7 press.I run my die down until it touches the ram and then a little more for a light/firm cam over,and then tighten the lock ring so the die is squared up to the ram.I'm also using the Redding Comp. shellholder set(with Comp. dies)for adjusting my shoulder bump so may be a little different setup if using a conventional shellholder.

Looks like cam over to me.

Thank you

 

[jackieschmidt]

To me, once the ram/shell holder comes into contact with the die body, it has reached it's full stroke. From there, that extra movement in your handle is play in the toggle/s and nothing more.

^^^^^^

 

[K22]

Here again, taking something simple and making it complicated and mysterious.

Regardless of "what" you call it, you adjust your FL die to give you the optimum sizing of the case for that specific rifle and group of cases that are dedicated to a specific rifle. It is just that simple.

There are a few different methods to achieve that which has been detailed on this Forum numerous times, so I won't repeat them.

I use the Whidden caliber group specific bump gauges to measure the amount of FL sizing. I prefer these gauges because they are a single piece gauge with no inserts which minimizes changing interfaces.

 

[Webster]

Here again, taking something simple and making it complicated and mysterious.

Regardless of "what" you call it, you adjust your FL die to give you the optimum sizing of the case for that specific rifle and group of cases that are dedicated to a specific rifle. It is just that simple.

There are a few different methods to achieve that which has been detailed on this Forum numerous times, so I won't repeat them.

I use the Whidden caliber group specific bump gauges to measure the amount of FL sizing. I prefer these gauges because they are a single piece gauge with no inserts which minimizes changing interfaces.

I think I understand how it happens but I see no advantage to cam over. The shell holder touches the die before camover. You cannot push the case farther into the the die. The camover is just movement of the linkage, nothing to do with pushing the case into the die.

 

[M-61]

Yes

Do not ask fguffy

 

[K22]

I think I understand how it happens but I see no advantage to cam over. The shell holder touches the die before camover. You cannot push the case farther into the the die. The camover is just movement of the linkage, nothing to do with pushing the case into the die.

In order to obtain the optimum sizing for my various rifles, brand of cases, and 50+ years RCBS press, I have to screw the FL die beyond just touching the shell holder. Whether you want to characterize this as "cam over" or something else is irrelevant.

We can debate this until hell freezes over but the bottom line is making whatever adjustment to the FL die that is necessary to obtain the desire amount of sizing. If you can achieve that with your equipment by the die just touching the shell holder, then that's appropriate for your equipment.

 

[Dgd6mm]

I really like the search engine on this forum.
Also in noway shape or form I'm implying that you shouldn't ask questions if you have one.

 

[dhagerty40]

My rockchucker 2 does the same as yours and has done it since it was new 35 years ago. if you set the dies so they contact the shell holder at full stroke, you will feel the slight camming over when sizing a case.

The Redding Big Boss I had did not do this. you had to turn the die an extra 1/8 of a turn to get the same feel as the RC2. Unfortunately, The ram seized on the redding and is now in a junk pile.

 

[dcali]

"Cam over" is just a way of saying the ram goes past top dead center (to borrow an engine term). If it contacts the die in the process of doing that, metal is being elastically (like a spring) stretched somewhere to allow the ram movement. The metal is moving in several places, actually - the die, the frame, the ram, and the links all deform ever so slightly to allow the ram to move.

If your're worried about the die being squeezed by this force, you can relax. The amount of force exerted by a press on the die is actually pretty small - not enough to compress the die meaningfully.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

The caveat to the Redding die, for most factory rifles die set to touching the shellholder is MAX. So I do not start at touch with Redding dies, back a away 1/4 turn and check in the chamber or case/ammo checker.