In tune or not is the question? 6ppc

[ttfreestyle]

Ok I read where 133 goes outta tune but I'm not sure we know when it's in or out because of the load or the trigger puller or the wind or, well you get the idea. Here are two targets we shot tonight, in or out? 100 yards, calm ,hot and just put a "new" used scope on wife's gun. 6ppc, n133. Target on left is hers, right is me with same gun and load. Bottom left target is sighter target on both. Your right Eric, that dot gets under your skin! Thanks for any insight.

 

[savagedasher]

Ok I read where 133 goes outta tune but I'm not sure we know when it's in or out because of the load or the trigger puller or the wind or, well you get the idea. Here are two targets we shot tonight, in or out? 100 yards, calm ,hot and just put a "new" used scope on wife's gun. 6ppc, n133. Target on left is hers, right is me with same gun and load. Bottom left target is sighter target on both. Your right Eric, that dot gets under your skin! Thanks for any insight.

Looks like .250 would be close Larry

 

[Frankr]

I think that is good shooting..I think it's hard to tell if in tune or not on a score target due to you are moving the rifle from target to target and I was not there to see any conditions or flags..If was real calm sometimes it can be harder to hit a good tune or them dots...Same target but 200 yard target in a ground Hog match I had 5 shots well inside the 10 ring(on one target) but never hit the dot..lol...with a 6 Dasher..

 

[Travelor]

Man, that stock color is "unique". Some pictures are hard to get out of my mind.

 

[LHSmith]

Before firing the shot, predict where the bullet will land. If it does not hit where you intended and you cannot reason why it went out, then you are not quite in-tune. This is the problem when shooting calm, especially late evening.....you can't see what is happening between you and the target.....slight air currents from thermals, mirage due to air cooling in the evening while the ground is still hot...a lot of dynamics are really in motion that you just can't see if you don't know what to look for by carefull study through a high mag scope.
Another indicator is if your 6mm bullet holes look like .22 cal. holes, you're there (but probably not for long- you are teetering on the edge).
I prefer shooting a 2 or 3 shot group also vs. a score target to check tune....eliminate the chance of an error due to your bag/rest not being up to par.

 

[WyleWD]

Before firing the shot, predict where the bullet will land. If it does not hit where you intended and you cannot reason why it went out, then you are not quite in-tune. This is the problem when shooting calm, especially late evening.....you can't see what is happening between you and the target.....slight air currents from thermals, mirage due to air cooling in the evening while the ground is still hot...a lot of dynamics are really in motion that you just can't see if you don't know what to look for by carefull study through a high mag scope.
Another indicator is if your 6mm bullet holes look like .22 cal. holes, you're there (but probably not for long- you are teetering on the edge).
I prefer shooting a 2 or 3 shot group also vs. a score target to check tune....eliminate the chance of an error due to your bag/rest not being up to par.

I agree with LH on his post. And regarding the bag/rest set up affecting your score on such a target, I ALWAYS shoot the target the same way, meaning shooting each column from top to bottom, or by row from bottom to top (which ever you decide). That way it is easier to trouble shoot whether the movement of the front rest (or placement of the rear rest) is affecting your score. Make sense? WD

 

[expiper]

OP,,,,the only person that can tell you that the gun is working ,,,is,,,YOU,,,your wife certainly had the vertical figgerd out ,,,and she was either keeping it out by holding for each shot or you were putting it in with each shot,,,shurely you were not just aiming at the "dot" ,,,the best information that you have is the last bullet down range,,,,we have no idea whre you were holding,,,
Roger

 

[DCRYDER]

Looks like that stock has been playing paintball and lost!!!!!

Good shooting.

Moving from target to target brings more variables. It's a different bag pressure every time. Tune it shooting groups.

 

[Frankr]

I hate to say it but that rifle is making me wish for a wife.

 

[DeltaBravo]

As some older comedian once said: "Take my wife...please"

Dennis

 

[ttfreestyle]

I am trying to learn hold off so my sighter on the right target was the high right shot on the bottom left dot and I held off the rest of the target to compensate for where the sighter hit. Very little wind but you could feel a breeze at times. I did notice some bullet holes looked " cleaner" than normal. And shooting the same way makes sense , I don't do that but will start. I put a couple clicks in and wife shot her target, she just shoots that gun well. Man so much to think about and learn. Thanks

 

[Eric Leonard]

I miss guessed my load today bad,,I shot earlier in the week when it was really hot and had to back off my load then it was only like 80-85 today,,I shot a 3 shot group on my sighter after finishing each target and I had some serious vertical,,2 bullet holes at 100 and 1/2 inch at 200,,

I will never load ammo 4-5 days early again,,

 

[WyleWD]

I miss guessed my load today bad,,I shot earlier in the week when it was really hot and had to back off my load then it was only like 80-85 today,,I shot a 3 shot group on my sighter after finishing each target and I had some serious vertical,,2 bullet holes at 100 and 1/2 inch at 200,,

I will never load ammo 4-5 days early again,,

We're you using 133 or LT-32? WD

 

[ttfreestyle]

I don't have enough knowledge or experience to change my load for the conditions yet , so I leave it the same and am trying to learn the flags better. Not sure this is the correct approach, time will tell I suppose. Yesterday at Gallatin I did get some vertical but talking to the other shooters it seemed to be happening to everyone there. And then there is the shoot 3 shots in one ragged hole in the ten/eleven ring on your sighters and move to your first shot for score and shoot a big fat 9 !!!!!! That is driving me crazy. Had a blast at Gallatin again. Thanks to all who make that match so great.

 

[GSPV]

Shoot two or three shot groups, increasing charge by .2 or .3, along a horizontal line to form a graph. Hold every other variable constant. If the load is in tune, increasing charge will print lower. At some point, it'll nose over and start printing higher. It is now out of tune.

If the group size there isn't what you'd like, play with the seating depth and maybe neck tension to bring it in.

You can shoot some great 3-shot groups when the load is out of tune. It'll just never
Agg.

Tune is temperature specific. As temperature increases, it'll have the same effect as increasing powder charge. I.e., at some point, it'll nose over into being out of tune.

It's an awful thing, but, often, as the load is going out of tune, your group will get awesome...then blow up.

 

[WyleWD]

I don't have enough knowledge or experience to change my load for the conditions yet , so I leave it the same and am trying to learn the flags better. Not sure this is the correct approach, time will tell I suppose. Yesterday at Gallatin I did get some vertical but talking to the other shooters it seemed to be happening to everyone there. And then there is the shoot 3 shots in one ragged hole in the ten/eleven ring on your sighters and move to your first shot for score and shoot a big fat 9 !!!!!! That is driving me crazy. Had a blast at Gallatin again. Thanks to all who make that match so great.

Do you practice on the same targets (or some facsimile)? Many times an improper and subtle bag or rest set up causes the change in zero on the move from sighter to target. Personally I find these types of 8's and 9's more frustrating than anything in shooting competition. It's hard to find the problem, and sometimes darned expensive to fix. I've found that shooting a tight group and moving from target to target are quite often two very different challenges.

But heck, if you got to hang out with Greyfox and the guys it should have been a great day. He's one of my favorites even though we don't get to chat very often. WD

 

[Greyfox]

Do you practice on the same targets (or some facsimile)? Many times an improper and subtle bag or rest set up causes the change in zero on the move from sighter to target. Personally I find these types of 8's and 9's more frustrating than anything in shooting competition. It's hard to find the problem, and sometimes darned expensive to fix. I've found that shooting a tight group and moving from target to target are quite often two very different challenges.

But heck, if you got to hang out with Greyfox and the guys it should have been a great day. He's one of my favorites even though we don't get to chat very often. WD

That's a pretty nice thing to say WD. Thanks, same for you.
But as to conditions yesterday. Eric wasn't the only one who was having a lot of trouble with vertical. It seems that most of the shooters, including me, had the same thing. I started 200 with a dead zero and by the 2nd relay, I was getting the full 10 ring of vertical....sometimes. I'm pretty sure it was mainly due to the changing cloud cover which went from full sun to cloudy and back a time or two. Also, there were some tricky wind conditions that added to the mix. Mirage was also a factor from time to time. It seemed that most everybody could manage to stay inside the 10 ring for most of the time, but the chigger was hard to corner. Most shots wandered around the ring.

On the first relay @ 100 I was pretty sure I was out of tune and adjusted the tuner several times before determining that it was the wind and the light that was causing the problem. Also, I thought it was just me until I saw the rest of the scores. To look at the wind forecast (2-4 mph, light and variable) one would have expected some high scores, but the gremlins won instead. To give you an example, one of our best shooters shot a 62, 63...57...62. Nothing changed in the conditions to speak of. The rifle didn't change and the shooter didn't forget how to shoot when he shot that 57. Stuff happens.

Rick

 

[Eric Leonard]

I was shooting 133 and had been using 29.3-29.5 but the other day in the heat it was really hard to open bolt and I backed down to 28.7 and was shooting lights out at about 98*,,then Saturday morning it was in the low 80`s and I was getting the vertical Rick is talking about plus another line it seemed to me,,
my first 2 targets at 100 early when it was cool were pretty bad,,then when it warmed up some I shot a 65 on the 4th target,,it could have been all the gremlins I suppose but I really think I was about .5-.6 grs light on my load to be where it really likes to be,,I mean even the bolt opened way to easy from what I am used to when that rifle is really drilling them,,

 

[Slickrick0999]

I shot the same match. I actually asked ttfreestyle about my load and the tune of it for that day. I'm lost on the tune thing for right now. I'm like tt and just trying to learn the wind and my holds.

Like others have said THANK YOU Greyfox for putting on such a great match and thank you to all the other shooters for the hospitality!

 

[GSPV]

When the load is in tune, the bullet is exiting the muzzle at a point in its oscillation when the oscillation actually helps compensate for slight variances.

Those variances might happen this shot or the next. But they will eventually happen. That's why a load that isn't in tune can shoot a good group, but will not agg.

A load that is in tune will will eventually get out of tune as temperature increases. It will also eventually come back into tune and maybe before the load is too hot.

Here is a thread on it that several people posted on. http://forum.accurateshooter.com/th...en-tuning-for-accuracy.3903831/#post-36783519