Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Thats why i recommend a 243. Very non complicated. And you can get lapua brass or cheap stuff and load n fire it. Very forgiving on loads. Some folks gotta be a lil cooler tho.
if you were building a rifle to shoot unknown range targets
- Thread starter Eric Leonard
- Start date
Petey
Gold $$ Contributor
Two thumbs up for the 6XC also!! I was behind the eight ball on this post, or my vote would have been up before now. Of course it's all "Ford, Chevy, Toyota" right?.. I just choose to run a Dodge b/c I don't want to mess around working on the dang thing all the time! Everyone of the fore mentioned rounds will do the job and well, so it's just a vote for opinions on what you like the most. The lil 6XC has my vote... beat out a 6CM, 6.5x284, 6.5x47 and .284 twice at the last 1000 yard match on my bench.
And truly if you read about the development of the 6XC and how it came to be you realize the short comings of the other mentioned cartridges as far as too long for A 2.800 length action/clip ect . or too short to feed well..although they all can work well. the 6XC in the Norma brass is really just about perfect..and so so easy..nice tac 30 any stye bottom you want to run and it works great..the Norma brass seems available.. barrel life is a factor that varies greatly depending on many factors..what's a 6XC good for 2500 rounds? or more? I do understand the extreme of the 6CM but I feel it's a lot of trouble to go through for me..the 6XC is well proven and seems to work well with different chambers. I have two different chambers. one what I call a true min clearance match chamber and the 6XC 2 chamber ah they shoot the same. it does not seem critical to have a ultra matched die set up. As I believe it has been stated the only other cartridge as easy to load for is the 308 win.I am a fan of the 6XC and all the other cartridges are about the same thing a little longer or a little shorter. I hope to be playing with a new 1-7 twist barrel by December in you guessed it 6XC why a 1-7 you ask? I just want to try one for myself..cant wait.
XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
To address the 6XC comments and my reasons that I did not build a 6XC:
1) As far as I know the only brass out there is Norma. $85/100 vs $50/100 for WW.
2) Case Capacity, the 6XC is 50grH2O, the 6SLR is 54.7. If you want to drive 105/107 class bullets faster more powder is a good thing. (I know the 6CM has even more, but it has to be fire formed to get there, I didn't want that.)
3) Case length isn't a concern. My 6SLR cases are 2.02, the 6XC lists at 1.89. The 243/6SLR started as a 308 based case, with a .075 FB and Sierra 107s I fit fine in an AICS at 2.85, and with my receiver relieved to feed from Alpha Mags or an AICS with the front plate removed I'd be able to go to about 2.94 OAL. (Which I have done to feed long 308s, my rifle is a switch barrel)
4) ease of loading, I don't ever load new brass w/o running it over a mandrel. I've loaded thousands of new Lapua and WW cases, and IMO every one of them is way too tight to load out of the box. So even the 6XC would go through the press once. With the 6SLR I run them in the sizing die and load, no extra steps in my world.
5) Mr. Tubb is a fine marksman, and I'd wager that pretty much any of the rounds being discussed here would have gotten him the same result, remember, he shoots at a 1MOA X ring. Sling shooting is WAY more about a shooter with a solid hold and good wind calls than pure accuracy of the rig. That is not to say that Mr. Tubbs rifle was or may have been anything less than a precision shooting setup, but no less so than any of the other rigs on the line shot by accomplished shooters. He also designed the 6XC. For comparison, Mr Whidden is also a fine marksman, and he chooses the straight 243. I've seen John's bullet trace to 1000 yards, it's freaking flat.
In the end we all build what we want, I wanted a 6SLR for reasons stated here and in other threads, others have chosen different chamberings. In the end it is personal preference and I doubt it matters much on the targets.
1) As far as I know the only brass out there is Norma. $85/100 vs $50/100 for WW.
2) Case Capacity, the 6XC is 50grH2O, the 6SLR is 54.7. If you want to drive 105/107 class bullets faster more powder is a good thing. (I know the 6CM has even more, but it has to be fire formed to get there, I didn't want that.)
3) Case length isn't a concern. My 6SLR cases are 2.02, the 6XC lists at 1.89. The 243/6SLR started as a 308 based case, with a .075 FB and Sierra 107s I fit fine in an AICS at 2.85, and with my receiver relieved to feed from Alpha Mags or an AICS with the front plate removed I'd be able to go to about 2.94 OAL. (Which I have done to feed long 308s, my rifle is a switch barrel)
4) ease of loading, I don't ever load new brass w/o running it over a mandrel. I've loaded thousands of new Lapua and WW cases, and IMO every one of them is way too tight to load out of the box. So even the 6XC would go through the press once. With the 6SLR I run them in the sizing die and load, no extra steps in my world.
5) Mr. Tubb is a fine marksman, and I'd wager that pretty much any of the rounds being discussed here would have gotten him the same result, remember, he shoots at a 1MOA X ring. Sling shooting is WAY more about a shooter with a solid hold and good wind calls than pure accuracy of the rig. That is not to say that Mr. Tubbs rifle was or may have been anything less than a precision shooting setup, but no less so than any of the other rigs on the line shot by accomplished shooters. He also designed the 6XC. For comparison, Mr Whidden is also a fine marksman, and he chooses the straight 243. I've seen John's bullet trace to 1000 yards, it's freaking flat.
In the end we all build what we want, I wanted a 6SLR for reasons stated here and in other threads, others have chosen different chamberings. In the end it is personal preference and I doubt it matters much on the targets.
XTR you are right. That is a very nice rifle you built..I cant wait to get mine done and let you guys know how it turns out.
As far as Brass goes if I can buy Lapua brass for it that's what I shoot. Norma second . Winchester third if you can find it in stock,it seems lately the only thing you can find is Norma or Lapua. That's just fine with me..I love this my buddy bought a 270WSM you could not buy Brass for it to save your life..only thing he could find was Nosler at $233.80 a Hundred I was LMAO seems 89 bucks a Hundred is cheep now days..The Norma 6XC brass does seem to be very High Quality..I have like 400 cases 300 are still new. the original 100 I started are still going.I am not shooting competition. I looked real hard at the 6 SLR I like it. But I know the brass is thicker in the shoulder so if you push it back and up into the neck I would have to expand and neck turn them or it would bug me.I have necked turned a KA Zillion 220 rush and fire formed to PPC. 6 Dashers every 6BR I have owned has been a tight neck..Any thing that has to be neck turned or fire formed just turns me off anymore. so when I decided to try this 6XC High quality Norma brass , Load and go..and it works..I do primer pockets and flash holes(I hate it) and load and shoot.
As far as Brass goes if I can buy Lapua brass for it that's what I shoot. Norma second . Winchester third if you can find it in stock,it seems lately the only thing you can find is Norma or Lapua. That's just fine with me..I love this my buddy bought a 270WSM you could not buy Brass for it to save your life..only thing he could find was Nosler at $233.80 a Hundred I was LMAO seems 89 bucks a Hundred is cheep now days..The Norma 6XC brass does seem to be very High Quality..I have like 400 cases 300 are still new. the original 100 I started are still going.I am not shooting competition. I looked real hard at the 6 SLR I like it. But I know the brass is thicker in the shoulder so if you push it back and up into the neck I would have to expand and neck turn them or it would bug me.I have necked turned a KA Zillion 220 rush and fire formed to PPC. 6 Dashers every 6BR I have owned has been a tight neck..Any thing that has to be neck turned or fire formed just turns me off anymore. so when I decided to try this 6XC High quality Norma brass , Load and go..and it works..I do primer pockets and flash holes(I hate it) and load and shoot.
DHD
Silver $$ Contributor
mr.big said:
I just got my Surgeon action back from being rechambered (was a 308, now a 6x47L). I have never seen a primer flow like they did while breaking the barrel in. I could not get above 2950 fps (105 Hybrids) without having a nipple on the fired primer. Off the bolt went to Gre-Tan. I hope to have it back for this weekend so I can shoot the thing.
Built a 6.5x47L on a Model 7, and it will leave a nice wart on the fired primer. It went to Greg too.
My point Mr Big is, I hope you have that firing pin hole bushed. I hoped my Surgeon action would have not needed to have this done to it, but those "47L" cases really need a small firing pin hole in my opinion......
I thought this was a interesting article .
http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/?p=1354
I run 40.5gr RL17 in a 26" barrel at 3,150 FPS I can push to 3,200 but I get a sticky bolt. My Norma brass holds up well at 40.5gr of RL17..I shoots 1/2 moa or less most of the time. I have had 1/4 moa with H4350 at 40.5grs but at 3,025 FPS it shoots so well with either and I have hit target's at 700 yards with it going 3,025 FPS ,it really seemed to smack them so hard you wondered why even try to push it faster. But for my purpose I go with the RL17 at 3,150 FPS..
Just a regular old rem 700 blueprinted. match barrel.
http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/?p=1354
I run 40.5gr RL17 in a 26" barrel at 3,150 FPS I can push to 3,200 but I get a sticky bolt. My Norma brass holds up well at 40.5gr of RL17..I shoots 1/2 moa or less most of the time. I have had 1/4 moa with H4350 at 40.5grs but at 3,025 FPS it shoots so well with either and I have hit target's at 700 yards with it going 3,025 FPS ,it really seemed to smack them so hard you wondered why even try to push it faster. But for my purpose I go with the RL17 at 3,150 FPS..
Just a regular old rem 700 blueprinted. match barrel.
I was gonna shoot the 6.5x47 and see how primers looked first,,you say I should just send it in and have it bushed before even trying it, I have about 3500 rounds combined of 6.5x47 and 6BRDX on the Stiller action with no mod to bolt and have had no problems with primers,,
is the bolt in the Stiller Tac30 ready to go out of the box,,if so I will send Rem 700 bolt in before shooting,,
is the bolt in the Stiller Tac30 ready to go out of the box,,if so I will send Rem 700 bolt in before shooting,,
DHD
Silver $$ Contributor
mr.big said:
No I'm not saying to send it first. I lucked out and got my bolts back in a week (not here yet, but on the truck somewhere). I have over 2500 rounds with this Surgeon action in 308 using mostly Lapua Palma brass with a stiff load of Varget, and never saw anything like the first 3 rounds fired in it's new caliber. I've read about it and saw a little bit of primer flow in my daughter's 6.5 × 47L (Model 7), but I know I'm going to really appreciate a small firing pin.
I just wouldn't be surprised to see some primer flow if I were you. That's assuming you rebarrel to 6×47L.
I just reread your post. As far as the Stiller action is concerned, I don't know for sure, but I haven't read of anyone complaining about primer flow with them. I THINK they use a small firing pin as I seem to remember Stiller writing about small firing pins. I don't know why the custom actions even come with a large firing pin. In my non engineer mind, I think a small pin is a good thing regardless of caliber/bolt face diameter.
There are guys on here that have a magnitude more experience than I with this style case (.473" small primer small flash hole Lapua brass). I'm just relating my experience and saying don't be surprised.
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