I need SAUM help

[Kevin1990]

Before I begin, I know any of these calibers within 600 yards will do the job. I've always been fascinated with the SAUM and want to build one.

This would be for whitetail and the possibility of black bear. Shooting 600 and in. Again I realize I could do this with a 308 or a boatload of other cartridges.

That being said I'd like to utilize smaller grain bullets like 115s for a 25, 130s for a 6.5, or 140-150 for a 7. Probably a 22in or 24in barrel.

What one would be the easiest to load for and be the best for brass and barrel life? I thought I was set on the 7 but I'm second guessing.

Thanks fellas

 

[STOMP442]

My .02 if you are wanting to utilize lighter weight bullets I would do a smaller more efficient cartridge that is easier to get brass for. SAUM cases are awesome and I love them but they are getting harder and harder to find stuff for.

115's = 25 Creed, 25-06

130's = 260 Rem / 260 Ackley or 6.5-284

140-150 = 284 Win, 280 Ackley

 

[L.Sherm]

If I did a 25 cal either a 25 PRC or if you want smaller bullets maybe a 25x47

 

[SKWERLZ]

7 saum is amazing and easy to load.
Hunting with 160-170 and ELR with 183smk or 190 LRHT
I generally get 1500 absolutely trouble free shots and can keep it going to 1800-1900 shots with load adjustment
ADG brass has been excellent and fairly easy to get.
Dies are easy.
Recoil is mild
Ballistics are impressive and it’s pretty efficient.
If I could only keep 1 cartridge it would be my 7 saum.

1525 yards with 7saum

183SMK

rumble.com

 

[davidjoe]

You’ve got the right idea on huntiing purposes and moderate barrel length. I remember these short mags being rolled out in the printed magazine days, and the stalking/hiking weight rifle had come on strong. They were shaped to dump energy into the bullet very swiflty, optimizing “short” barrels.

I think the designers had in mind a “bigger” 22-250, for bigger game, but the saum’s most ardent fans today see it as a bigger 6BR. The 22-250 isn’t renown for winning shooting matches and the 6 BR rarely hunts, despite how close together the two really are.

What might surprise the designers is that we chamber Saums for 32+ inch barrels on 22 pound guns and have no concern at all about short magazine length, or even magazines period. They probably would ask us why we aren’t just using long cartridges, in that case.

I only know it as the 7mm, and it’s
a love-hate. Like a trigger’s “wall”, the primer pocket has a pressure threshold that can’t be exceeded.

Small as that case is, you still can’t use all of it with heavies. It is as if they anticipated a moderate weight bullet, at a published, appropriate book speed for it, and then decided not to waste any extra brass in the web, whatsoever. It is highly likely that Palma .308 brass with the smaller head can actually withstand more pressure, and not “per” square inch, either, but absolutely. That engine block that can handle nitro for 4 times factory horsepower, …this isn’t it.

But it sits at the top of what bullets and barrels can take in string fire. Any more than a Saum and accuracy regresses. Shoot it as fast as you can and you may very well blow up a bullett, but even if you don’t, you’re still on the very low end of barrel life.

All that said, I dropped two more blanks and my saum reamer off today. My car has saums with Lapua 180’s in it to revisit that old combo, tomorrow, at the range. I have decided that it’s evidently harder to wring out substantially more BC, than it is to become a better wind caller, something .22 matches have shown me lately.

 

[MDT6BRA]

I have just started a 7saum improved, a buddy has a couple that are amazing, one in bench foundation rifle and the other in a carbon hunting rifle. Amazing round and could hunt anything in North America with it.

 

[L.Sherm]

If I did a 25 cal either a 25 PRC or if you want smaller bullets maybe a 25x47

I should have added the 25 saum in there especially if a short action is what you wanted to build on.

 

[AMG04]

Looks like I failed to reply on my old 300 SAUM thread, sorry about that. I never got around to shooting the 155s, other projects got in the way.

I had really good results with the 300 in a very short barrel. 16" 300 SAUM outperformed my 24" 30-06.

For the distances and game you are shooting, the 6.5 SAUM 4s would be great (if you are set on the SAUM case). The easy button today is the 6.5 PRC.

The 6.5 will be more pleasant in a stalking weight rifle, 7-10lbs. The 300 I built was a boat anchor, meant to be shot from a blind at hogs.

...

A relentless nagging from the back of my mind has me wanting to run a new .25 cal. My first hunting rifle was a 25-06.

25 SAUM and 133gr Berger Elite Hunter vs.
300 SAUM with 180gr Berger Elite Hunter

Both max out what optimally fits in a short action (2.955 in an Origin or similar action)

The 25 SAUM only gives up 224 ft.lbs of energy on target at 600 yards, but gets there with 13% less wind drift and 36% less recoil!

The 6.5 & 7mm fall between the two, but in the case of the 7mm you really push the boundaries of even modern short actions with 175+gr bullets.

...

An Origin with 20" Proof CF chambered in 25 SAUM/PRC in a custom Manners EH4 might happen before the end of 2025.

I ran the numbers on the SAUM as that's what the OP referenced. I'm likely going with the PRC case due to readily available brass and cheaper dies.

 

[Preacher]

I shoot a 25, 6.5 and 7mm in the SAUM IMP 35˚ case and have a lot of new ADG brass because of it....
All 3 of them shoot as intended... Any one of them will do you good.
I prefer the 25 SAUM of the 3 mentioned..

 

[WSMNUT]

I currently have a 25 SAUM IMP and 300 SAUM IMP for hunting.

300 SAUM IMP 22” 1-9” Proof Barrel
125 Accubonds for pigs and deer 3620 FPS
180 Accubonds for elk 2905

25 SAUM IMP 20” 1-10” Muller Barrel
110 Accubonds 3530 FPS

I also had a 25 SAUM 20” Hawk Hill barrel
110 Accubonds 3450.

All of the SAUM cases are very accurate. I build a lot of 7 SAUM and 7 SAUM IMP rifles as well. They all seem to be the easy button. The 25 might be my favorite for deer hunting. It’s easy to make brass. Just neck size 6.5 SAUM brass and go shoot. I don’t think you can go wrong with any of them.

 

[nakneker]

I’ve used the 7 Saum for my main hunting rifle for years, I’ve had three built and it’s been an excellent choice. Very efficient cartridge, I think youd be happy trying out the platform.

I also have a 25 Saum improved built on a Kimber action with a Lilja barrel made with the same factory profile Kimber uses (it’s unique/different). Zack built it last winter, it’s too much fun. I just neck down 6.5 Saum brass and shoot. I’m getting a little over 3600 fps with a 22” barrel. Very accurate rifle, very fun chambering - but then again every rifle Zack has built has shot small. Nice guy, can’t say enough good things about working with him.

This winter I’m in line for a 7 Saum shorty, it’s an experiment. I’m hoping for 2750+ with a 20” CF proof using 180 hybrids. Should be a fun experiment. Gonna play around with some shorter barrels over the next year for suppressor use.

 

[Kevin1990]

My first thought was the 25 Saum, but I was thinking I'd get MAYBE 3200 fps with a 115 vld Berger out of a 24 inch barrel, even if it was IMP so I let the idea go.

What's the barrel life on those looking like anyway?

Btw @WSMNUT still waiting on a stock from Dima for the Panda and Krieger barrel for the 30BR. It's coming, I swear. haha!

 

[justme]

I had a 25saum put together in 2005. I'm still shooting it. It's pretty entertaining! My opinion is that once you get a 25 cal bullet going 3200 or so, another 100 fps speed don't matter much. I found I could get more than that, and with 115 and 120 gr bullets.

 

[HandgunHTR]

Unfortunately, your criteria is a bit of a contradiction. Lighter bullets will steer you towards the smaller caliber SAUMs, such as the 25 and 6mm. However, with those, the barrel life isn't nearly what it is on the 7 and 300.

I believe the 7 will give you what you are looking for. However, I would step up into the 160 grain class of bullets to get the best compromise in performance.

 

[Kevin1990]

Unfortunately, your criteria is a bit of a contradiction. Lighter bullets will steer you towards the smaller caliber SAUMs, such as the 25 and 6mm. However, with those, the barrel life isn't nearly what it is on the 7 and 300.

I believe the 7 will give you what you are looking for. However, I would step up into the 160 grain class of bullets to get the best compromise in performance.

Nope. No contradictions. I want a SAUM that will sling lite for caliber bullets at high velocities. Only going out to 600 yards max. You can get lite caliber bullets in all of the aforementioned 25, 6.5,7 and 300.

 

[L.Sherm]

If a 25 saum is what you want pushing light bullets do it.
I've got a safe full of rifles in different calibers from 17-338 they all scratched a itch at some point

 

[X Count]

6.5mm and run everything from 90 speer TNT through to 156gr Berger. So many quality bullet options in 6.5mm. Or even 6.5PRC for brass off the shelf

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Id run 168 vlds in a 7 saum. I have a lot of experiance with the saum case. You gain very little to nothing improving it. Its already a good design. Killed 4 elk with the 168 and every time it did the same thing. Great bullet.

 

[davidjoe]

Id run 168 vlds in a 7 saum. I have a lot of experiance with the saum case. You gain very little to nothing improving it. Its already a good design. Killed 4 elk with the 168 and every time it did the same thing. Great bullet.

I sometimes forget that the original caliber for a saum probably wasn’t even a 7mm, let alone a ~195 grain bullet. Back pressure with these heaviest loads in 22 pound fclass rifles isn’t the fairest way to assess the case.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

You could also load 185 bergers in a 300 saum and have the easiest tuning rifle there is. Its my favorite 600yd an in bullet in a wsm. Best combo I have found.