So now I have the gear, and want to ramp up practicing for HP with a match rifle. However, practicing only three times a week ( maybe 100 rounds each session) means in around two or three months I would be looking at a new barrel, maybe longer. On the other hand, I get the sense that some guys only shoot at competitions, and never practice in between. Time permitting, is there some sort of happy medium? In other words, does shooting more (more rounds and more frequent) show more rapid improvement?
How much practice makes perfect?
- Thread starter Viperdoc
- Start date
Erik Cortina
Team Lapua Brux Borden Captain
Yes and no. Good practice makes you better, bad practice doesn't.
I have to drive 3 1/2 hrs. to go to competitions, and I try to go at least once a month, maybe twice. But I do practice in between, but it's mainly working on my setup. I find that when I'm out "practicing" is when I figure out what's not working, being setup or equipment. For example, the next match is next weekend, so I went out yesterday and found that my rest wasn't tracking straight (joystick), so I adjusted it and now it tracks perfect. Another thing that I found out is that the rear piece of my scope wasn't focused perfectly, so I worked on that and now the crosshairs are nice and clear.
Anyways, I think practice is very important, but only if you pay attention and correct bad habits. If you just go out and shoot alot without paying attention to your form, then you are wasting your time and valuable barrel life.
I guess to sum it up, when I'm not competing I'm getting ready to compete.
I have to drive 3 1/2 hrs. to go to competitions, and I try to go at least once a month, maybe twice. But I do practice in between, but it's mainly working on my setup. I find that when I'm out "practicing" is when I figure out what's not working, being setup or equipment. For example, the next match is next weekend, so I went out yesterday and found that my rest wasn't tracking straight (joystick), so I adjusted it and now it tracks perfect. Another thing that I found out is that the rear piece of my scope wasn't focused perfectly, so I worked on that and now the crosshairs are nice and clear.
Anyways, I think practice is very important, but only if you pay attention and correct bad habits. If you just go out and shoot alot without paying attention to your form, then you are wasting your time and valuable barrel life.
I guess to sum it up, when I'm not competing I'm getting ready to compete.
OK,
Here is what has been successful for me in XC Highpower competition and LR prone.
Get a copy of "Ways of the Rifle" and read it. You won't understand a whole lot the first read thru but as you begin to analyze your on target results, it will answer many questions for you. As the old Kung Fu episode said, the answer is only important if you ask the right questions! You need to know what the right questions are.
In HP, standing is where the match is won or lost (see Sherri Gallagher at Perry). Get a decent air rifle and set up a range in your basement or garage. Start running pellets down range a couple of nights a week. When I was chasing leg points, I typically went thru a tin of 500 pellets in a month or so.
Dry fire for sitting and rapid prone. This will help you work out your position. Position is everything in HP. Get that sling the correct length, know exactly where it needs to be on your upper arm. Mark your fore end so that your hand goes in the same position each time. In rapid prone, that rifle needs to be in your shoulder tightly enough that the butt doesn't slip. Check your NPA in sitting so that when you are as relaxed as you can get, the target is centered in the front sight.
Practice slow prone with your pellet rifle or a 22 rf outdoors. 50 and 100 yard RF practice is great for 600 yd slow fire. A 22 will teach you bunches about prone shooting. When you can keep all your shots in the 10 and X ring at 50 yds with a rimfire, you are on your way.
When you use the pellet gun and RF for practice, your centerfire practice becomes more useful and scores will get higher. The other big advantage is that you don't pile up the round count thru your match tube!
Have a good practice plan. Establish goals for yourself in practice, don't just shoot shots down range with no expectation. That sort of practice has very limited value.
The above methodology was good enough to earn a Distinguished Rifleman's badge and P100 with an M14 (shooting against ARs). High Master XC with an AR15. High Master at MR and LR prone with a bolt gun. Am not bragging here, just letting you know the value and result of using the above information.
There are many ways to success, but that one was mine!
RGDS
Bob
Here is what has been successful for me in XC Highpower competition and LR prone.
Get a copy of "Ways of the Rifle" and read it. You won't understand a whole lot the first read thru but as you begin to analyze your on target results, it will answer many questions for you. As the old Kung Fu episode said, the answer is only important if you ask the right questions! You need to know what the right questions are.
In HP, standing is where the match is won or lost (see Sherri Gallagher at Perry). Get a decent air rifle and set up a range in your basement or garage. Start running pellets down range a couple of nights a week. When I was chasing leg points, I typically went thru a tin of 500 pellets in a month or so.
Dry fire for sitting and rapid prone. This will help you work out your position. Position is everything in HP. Get that sling the correct length, know exactly where it needs to be on your upper arm. Mark your fore end so that your hand goes in the same position each time. In rapid prone, that rifle needs to be in your shoulder tightly enough that the butt doesn't slip. Check your NPA in sitting so that when you are as relaxed as you can get, the target is centered in the front sight.
Practice slow prone with your pellet rifle or a 22 rf outdoors. 50 and 100 yard RF practice is great for 600 yd slow fire. A 22 will teach you bunches about prone shooting. When you can keep all your shots in the 10 and X ring at 50 yds with a rimfire, you are on your way.
When you use the pellet gun and RF for practice, your centerfire practice becomes more useful and scores will get higher. The other big advantage is that you don't pile up the round count thru your match tube!
Have a good practice plan. Establish goals for yourself in practice, don't just shoot shots down range with no expectation. That sort of practice has very limited value.
The above methodology was good enough to earn a Distinguished Rifleman's badge and P100 with an M14 (shooting against ARs). High Master XC with an AR15. High Master at MR and LR prone with a bolt gun. Am not bragging here, just letting you know the value and result of using the above information.
There are many ways to success, but that one was mine!
RGDS
Bob
Klong
Gold $$ Contributor
Bob3700, advice is sound. Dry fire more than you live fire. Watch what is happening to your front sights.
BTW, only perfect practice makes perfect. Don't worry about the shots that are not centered up. Learn how you fired the 10's and x's and repeat it.
At 600 yards, it is all about the wind.
BTW, only perfect practice makes perfect. Don't worry about the shots that are not centered up. Learn how you fired the 10's and x's and repeat it.
At 600 yards, it is all about the wind.
I second what Bob3700 said, but will add one more component to the practice regimen. Whether you are practicing or in a match you need to have a consistent mental thought process that you use to ensure each shot is the same.
Mine works like this for standing - insert buttplate in shoulder and rotate rifle into my cheek. Does it feel right? If not start over. If is does feel right, check natural point of aim and begin concentrating on sight alignment. REMEMBER WHAT A TEN LOOKS LIKE AND SQUEEZE THE TRIGGER SLOWLY AS LONG AS THE SIGHTS LOOK LIKE TEN.
If you follow this type of mental program every time you will make progress much faster.
One other comment about dry firing. You have to be hyper-critical of the sight alignment and sight picture when dry firing. If the shot looks like anything other than a perfectly centered X, then you probably won't even be a 10 under actual shooting conditions.
Theron
Mine works like this for standing - insert buttplate in shoulder and rotate rifle into my cheek. Does it feel right? If not start over. If is does feel right, check natural point of aim and begin concentrating on sight alignment. REMEMBER WHAT A TEN LOOKS LIKE AND SQUEEZE THE TRIGGER SLOWLY AS LONG AS THE SIGHTS LOOK LIKE TEN.
If you follow this type of mental program every time you will make progress much faster.
One other comment about dry firing. You have to be hyper-critical of the sight alignment and sight picture when dry firing. If the shot looks like anything other than a perfectly centered X, then you probably won't even be a 10 under actual shooting conditions.
Theron
This is a thought for the standing position. It may fly in the face of what is taught/practiced by some but here it is.
For each and every shot, you need to check your NPA. Close you eyes and see just where that front sight is pointed. If you mounted the rifle the same, then your NPA will remain. If not, minor adjustments (mainly your feet) will have to be made.
Shoot the first 10 you see! This was the best advice I ever received. While training on a Noptel down at the AMU (Ft. Benning) the coaches analyzed my hold. I was over holding the shot. My hold was X and 10 ring for 5 seconds and then deteriorated. My scores went up dramatically when I began to count to myself, once I began to focus on breaking the shot.
Here is the part that some will not agree with. The reason for the above Noptel testing was because I was holding my sight picture while I began squeezing the trigger and allowing the shot to just break. My off hand scores plumeted using that technique.
In off hand, When you see the 10, break the shot. What that really means is that you are holding tension on the trigger and executing a "Fast Press" when you see the first 10. You are intentionally launching that shot. No surprises when the gun goes off.
Now that may be a technique that only works for me, but I can tell you that it really does work. Let the fur fly!!!!!!!!!
Bob
For each and every shot, you need to check your NPA. Close you eyes and see just where that front sight is pointed. If you mounted the rifle the same, then your NPA will remain. If not, minor adjustments (mainly your feet) will have to be made.
Shoot the first 10 you see! This was the best advice I ever received. While training on a Noptel down at the AMU (Ft. Benning) the coaches analyzed my hold. I was over holding the shot. My hold was X and 10 ring for 5 seconds and then deteriorated. My scores went up dramatically when I began to count to myself, once I began to focus on breaking the shot.
Here is the part that some will not agree with. The reason for the above Noptel testing was because I was holding my sight picture while I began squeezing the trigger and allowing the shot to just break. My off hand scores plumeted using that technique.
In off hand, When you see the 10, break the shot. What that really means is that you are holding tension on the trigger and executing a "Fast Press" when you see the first 10. You are intentionally launching that shot. No surprises when the gun goes off.
Now that may be a technique that only works for me, but I can tell you that it really does work. Let the fur fly!!!!!!!!!
Bob
Some of the best advice I've seen on this site. But not much mention of DRYFIRE, DRYFIRE, DRYFIRE- it's free.
to Klong, I would have to put position in front of wind reading at 600. Plenty of matches are shot with no wind and the shooters that have the best position win. You can read the wind perfectly and still put the shot out the top, so position must come first. Most shooters that I see struggle at 600 is because of position, they shoot high, low, corner shots and then they start to chase the spotter from a bad shot. never ending cycle. It a person makes a bad call its' straight out to the side and that happens far less than the other types of errors.
just my opinion, to keep the converstion going.
to Klong, I would have to put position in front of wind reading at 600. Plenty of matches are shot with no wind and the shooters that have the best position win. You can read the wind perfectly and still put the shot out the top, so position must come first. Most shooters that I see struggle at 600 is because of position, they shoot high, low, corner shots and then they start to chase the spotter from a bad shot. never ending cycle. It a person makes a bad call its' straight out to the side and that happens far less than the other types of errors.
just my opinion, to keep the converstion going.
Thanks for all of the great advice! Have working on loads for my 6.5 CM rifle, and have found it really liked the Sierra 123 MK with RL 17. with a scope off a rest I can easily put five shots into one hole, but with the new target sights can barely shoot a five inch group off a rest. (only used the sights twice) Didn't expect to be world class immediately, but was a little disappointed that the groups weren't a little better to start.
You will need to read a bit and talk to others with the same sights as you have.
That will probably get you some baseline numbers with which to set the front and rear aperatures.
Start with the rear around 1.0 mm. The front wil be the unknown.
Most manuals will tell you to adjust the front aperature so that there is as much white around the bull as the bull is wide.
It is then a matter to train yourself to align the sights and center the bull. The circle within a circle concept willl grow on you after awhile.
Best might be to work with a rimfire that has aperatures on it and save an expensive bbl from a learning curve. Once you get the hang of the iron sights, you may find that you are more consistently accurate with them than a scope!
Bob
That will probably get you some baseline numbers with which to set the front and rear aperatures.
Start with the rear around 1.0 mm. The front wil be the unknown.
Most manuals will tell you to adjust the front aperature so that there is as much white around the bull as the bull is wide.
It is then a matter to train yourself to align the sights and center the bull. The circle within a circle concept willl grow on you after awhile.
Best might be to work with a rimfire that has aperatures on it and save an expensive bbl from a learning curve. Once you get the hang of the iron sights, you may find that you are more consistently accurate with them than a scope!
Bob
Great advise from all above.
I will add one more - going to practice and firing off 100 shots without thinking is not good practice. Dry firing a lot as suggested and only sending down a few will help much more if you are taking your time, watching and learning from wind and mirage. Our brain doesn't work well and trying to remember 100 mental notes is a lot harder than 5. Plus if you are doing something wrong it is better not to practise the wrong technique a lot (The body will take over and remember it) Shoot a few, analyse what went wrong and talk to people about it.
I will guarantee you dry firing loads as suggested above concentrating on technique and follow through etc and then sending down only a handful of live rounds, but really concentrating on where each and every one went will do much more for you than letting rip with hundreds.
I will add one more - going to practice and firing off 100 shots without thinking is not good practice. Dry firing a lot as suggested and only sending down a few will help much more if you are taking your time, watching and learning from wind and mirage. Our brain doesn't work well and trying to remember 100 mental notes is a lot harder than 5. Plus if you are doing something wrong it is better not to practise the wrong technique a lot (The body will take over and remember it) Shoot a few, analyse what went wrong and talk to people about it.
I will guarantee you dry firing loads as suggested above concentrating on technique and follow through etc and then sending down only a handful of live rounds, but really concentrating on where each and every one went will do much more for you than letting rip with hundreds.
Shynloco
You can lead a horse to water, but ........
Personally, of all the useful comments posted ahead of mine, I like what tdking had to say the best. And that is the "mental process remaining the same" each and everytime you shoot. I 've been shooting weapons of all sorts for over 50 years and I still enjoy spending time at the range once or twice a week. What seems to work for me the most is once I'm past the physical set up and positioning (since I do bench shooting almost exclusively) is to think through my shot each and everytime from first target acquistion, positioning of my trigger finger on the trigger, carefully aligning my aimpoint and checking the level on my anti-cant device, to taking a final breath and letting half of it out before stopping to breath and finally starting to squeeze the round off to ensure no movement. Sounds like boring repetition but once you know the rilfe and ammo is capable of the accuracy, the rest is in the shooter's technique and head. I've also found that even if your technique is right on, if your head is elsewhere, kiss that five shot one holer bye bye. Happy shootin everybody!
bozo699
Gold $$ Contributor
To all involved in this post,
This is one of the best threads I think I have ever read on 6br,and I have read thousands of them. I think ea. and every answer to the authers question was spot on and somthing could be learned from ea. post. All the reloading practices,whats the best cartridge,scope,bullets ,powder,ect.ect.ect. that you read about all over this forum doesn't mean squat if you don't practice good shooting skills!! period. I know I have learned alot by the 13 post prior to mine,I practice dry firing alot and think it is very inportant, but I need to focus on mind set and pre,setup and plan on starting today!!!! I hope this thread doesn't die there is a lot more knowledge to be had out there lets keep it going.Thanks to all involved.
Wayne.
This is one of the best threads I think I have ever read on 6br,and I have read thousands of them. I think ea. and every answer to the authers question was spot on and somthing could be learned from ea. post. All the reloading practices,whats the best cartridge,scope,bullets ,powder,ect.ect.ect. that you read about all over this forum doesn't mean squat if you don't practice good shooting skills!! period. I know I have learned alot by the 13 post prior to mine,I practice dry firing alot and think it is very inportant, but I need to focus on mind set and pre,setup and plan on starting today!!!! I hope this thread doesn't die there is a lot more knowledge to be had out there lets keep it going.Thanks to all involved.
Wayne.
"Here is the part that some will not agree with. The reason for the above Noptel testing was because I was holding my sight picture while I began squeezing the trigger and allowing the shot to just break. My off hand scores plumeted using that technique.
In off hand, When you see the 10, break the shot. What that really means is that you are holding tension on the trigger and executing a "Fast Press" when you see the first 10. You are intentionally launching that shot. No surprises when the gun goes off. "
Bob3700 is absolutely on the money. I discovered this same finding when shooting 3P smallbore during the offhand stage. His advice on shooting 10m airrifle and smallbore is also spot on, and is similar to what I do. Although I'm not quite as accomplished as bob3700, I too, have been able to make P100, DR, master OTC, HM LR prone, so there is a pattern there.
In off hand, When you see the 10, break the shot. What that really means is that you are holding tension on the trigger and executing a "Fast Press" when you see the first 10. You are intentionally launching that shot. No surprises when the gun goes off. "
Bob3700 is absolutely on the money. I discovered this same finding when shooting 3P smallbore during the offhand stage. His advice on shooting 10m airrifle and smallbore is also spot on, and is similar to what I do. Although I'm not quite as accomplished as bob3700, I too, have been able to make P100, DR, master OTC, HM LR prone, so there is a pattern there.
wht are your goals, (obviously to be competetive or win). What does it take to win where you wanna compete. So work tirelessly to surpass the last scores of the last match. Once you can do that then you go into a sustainment phase. e.g. dry firing, etc. Develop the standards you want to achieve then you'll have your answer. How fast you get there is up to you, your level of concentration, and how well you apply the principals of shooting in ur particular field. gl
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