How Much Accuracy Compromised w/Bipod?

[Phil3]

When shooting off a bench to 100 and 200 yards, how much accuracy do you think is lost using a bipod (Harris tilt w/PodLoc) vs using a front rest? Both setups would use a Protecktor rabbit ear rear bag, using an EGW bag rider (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/996210/egw-bag-rider-ar-15-a2-buttstock). Rifle is a 12.8 lb. AR-15 (223) with 22" long Krieger bull barrel, 10 oz. second stage Geiselle trigger, 6 - 24 Bushnell scope, and standard A2 stock. It shoots well but wonder how much potential accuracy I may be losing with a bipod vs front rest. Would the answer to this question change if I was shooting a bolt action 223 and 6mmBR rifle?

It may be best to develop loads using a front rest, know what the rifle can do, and then move to a bipod, working on my technique to do as well as the front rest permits. ??? But, I have no access to borrow a front rest long term.

Thanks.

Phil

 

[mac86951]

I'd guess no difference to a well experienced bipod shooter. Its like saying what is the difference between a hard hold and free-firing? Well, a Hard-hold can and will be affected by the shooter, where free-firing is much more affected by how the rifle sits on the rests/sleds and how it recoils. The key to both is consistency.

http://www.accurateshooter.com/shooting-skills/bugholes-from-bipod/

-Mac

 

[NateHaler]

When shooting off a bench to 100 and 200 yards, how much accuracy do you think is lost using a bipod (Harris tilt w/PodLoc) vs using a front rest?

Depends on the shooter. If you know what you're doing, my hunch is that there would be a negligible accuracy difference.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

My experience, with a .243 Win. bolt action rifle, is there is no change in accuracy when switching from one to the other! That gun shot bug holes off a rest or bipod!

Mike

 

[Chuckhunter]

Clyde Hart told me years ago, a guy can shoot tiny little holes if he's falling off his stool, as long as he falls off his stool the same way every time.

 

[Forum Boss]

Depends on the gun and the configuration of the bipod. I have personally witnessed 3-shot groups in the "ones" shot with the Jennings F-TR rig, off the ground, using Federal Gold Medal Match ammo. I've shot this gun and the cross-hairs are more steady in the horizontal plane than on my 3"-wide foreend 17-pound bench gun, using a premium front rest and rear sandbag.

 

[Preacher]

As long as you load the bipod up the same way each time you shoot, it will not effect accuracy..

 

[BoydAllen]

Obvously, what the Forum Boss is referring to is more than a bit exotic, and the results obtained with that setup do not correlate to those typical of a typical Harris bipod setup. Having said that, I have seen skilled shooters, who have figured out all of the bipod tricks, shoot very well using one.

Another thing that should be mentioned it that you may be able to get some sense of the difference using something improvised instead of a fancy front rest, as long as the rifle is supported at the point on the forend that produces the best accuracy, by a sand bag, or bags that give you the necessary stability. You can pile stuff up, as long as the result gives you good stability. I have done it with a PPC.

One day, when I failed to get my head screwed fully on, before leaving for the range. I got there only to learn that while I had my rear bag, my rest was not with me. Not wanting to waste the trip, I improvised with what was available, carpet covered wood and shot bags filled with sand. I certainty did not have anything resembling tracking, quite the opposite, but I managed some satisfying groups in the small twos.

It should also be mentioned that many times with either bipod or rest, shooters leave a lot on the table, so to speak. It is often the case that one needs to experiment quite a bit to find out what your particular combination likes best, and shooters often have a fixed idea of how they should shoot that prevents this.

 

[mac86951]

Clyde Hart told me years ago, a guy can shoot tiny little holes if he's falling off his stool, as long as he falls off his stool the same way every time.

+1 to consistency. That is the name of the game.

-Mac

 

[Old Navy]

I do much better with the Bag Rider on my AR. Later! Frank

 

[Phil3]

A bag rider on the stock, one up front on a rest, or both? I have ordered the unit for the rear of the A2 stock and a bag, but will try to work with the bipod up front given the comments here. The gun hops a lot and have to move it quite a bit after each shot. This happens despite loading the bipod (pushing forward). The bench is a wood surface.

Phil

 

[BoydAllen]

If your rear bag rider is parallel to the bench, how do you make elevation adjustments, when aiming the rifle? Have you tried an improvised front rest that has the stock resting on a sand bag? If you try a sandbag in the front, just remember that the forend needs to be free to slide without hooking on the bag. This is a common mistake that I see on both front and rear bags. Another issue with pistol grips is that when shooting from the bench shooters tend to grip them as they would a pistol and have their finger in the wrong relation to the trigger. You need to position your hand so that the trigger touches between the tip of your index finger and its first joint, so that your pull is straight back. The hand goes wherever it has to to make this happen. Another problem that can be caused by a full grip is torquing the rifle as the trigger is pulled. On the other hand, with most setups that I have seen, holding the rifle too lightly can cause problems. Shooters tend to make the mistake of thinking that when shooting from the bench, that the lighter the hold the better. For most rifles this is not the case. particularly when triggers are measured in pounds and not single digit ounces. Properly laid out bolt action rifles are a lot easier to shoot small with. One trick that will help your situation ( and most other shooters for that matter) is a lot of dry fire practice. Take you time and do everything right when you do. It will build "muscle memory".

 

[6BRinNZ]

Phil3 - if you count accuracy as a one off group then a Harris bipod can run with a front rest...IMO the Harris bipod requires a lot more technique to get small groups and maintain them to any degree.

I find off a bench Harris bipods tend to bounce a little more and it is more difficult to remove vertical than a rest.

good luck.

 

[boltfluter]

As far as eliminating the vertical from a bi pod on the bench. I have placed a magazine under the bi pod with very good results. It also helps with the tracking. Just a thought. ;D

Paul

www.boltfluting.com

 

[lpreddick]

i'm a paper shooter in the off season and a ghog hunter the rest of the time. technique and practice is the key. i practice with the harris and rear bags...bunny ears and plain, even a closed fist shooting prone. i practice off the bench, car hood, ground, and occ log pile, sitting with long harris bipod with multiple guns. i try everything i encounter in the field and with practice, i get comfortable. extreme accuracy is not easy with the harris but i usu get 1/2 min of ghog with the above. 532 yds with a walking ghog is my best.

 

[Bradley Walker]

My AR-15 space gun LOVES a bipod... It barely moves. It is very heavy and the bolt is moving I suppose.

Much better than a bolt gun where getting super tight groups is tougher.

Anything to keep the gun from jumping would be good. I can't wait to try the suppressor...

 

[Bradley Walker]

extreme accuracy is not easy with the harris but i usu get 1/2 min of ghog with the above. 532 yds with a walking ghog is my best.

I agree half minute is typical as the best for me with a bolt gun.

My longest shot was 440 yards with my old 22-250. But the only thing sticking out of the hole was his head. About the size of a baseball... It was a bragging shot fo sho... He fell six feet straight down into his hole and we almost never found him as it was getting dark. I miss Ohio hahaha...

 

[BoydAllen]

Bradley,
It sounds like you are pretty good with your AR, but you definitely have not shot the right bolt gun. In .222 and .223 I used to tune up factory Remingtons with sporter weight barrels to 3/8 inch and a little better, and a friend who has a couple of custom 700 based 6BRs has no trouble turning quarter inch groups when the wind is not too bad. Good stocks, good barrels, good triggers, good rests, and a well tuned load are all requirements for this level of performance. On the other hand, while I expect my tuned up factory varmint rifles to be consistently under a half inch, I believe that you can have a world of fun with one that just makes that level. Every so often, when I am at the range, and have done what I came to do, I will look around to see if I think that anyone has shown a particular interest in all the stuff associated with me taking a 6PPC to the range (loading gear, wind flags, etc.) and ask someone if he wants to try my rifle. The reason that I do is so that fellows will know that with the right equipment, that they are a lot better than they think they are. Because the trigger is around 2oz. and the rest is different than what they are use to, I have them take a half dozen dry shots, to get used to things, and after telling them what to look for on the flags, I hand them 3-4 loaded rounds, and walk away, so as not to be a distraction. The inevitable result is a group that is around a quarter inch or better. The whole idea behind a competition bench rifle is to have something that is as easy as possible to shoot small groups with, but of course, I would never take one of these rigs into the field. For one thing, I don't want to turn necks for that many cases, and for another a fixed power scope of high magnification, and 2oz. trigger have no place there IMO. As well as you are shooting your AR, with the right bolt rifle, half inch would be a distant memory.

 

[waterfwlr]

What are some tricks or techniques to shoot well with a harris bipod?

 

[mgx1138]

If you were equally skilled at shooting with a bipod or high-quality front rest, IMHO the groups shot with a front rest would be significantly smaller and more consistent. Now "significant" is a relative term, but there is NO WAY that you could shoot competitive size groups in BR competition from a bipod. Whether you were shooting BR at 100/200, or long range, the consistency of shooting with a good rest is going to be much better than a bipod. Bipods are an expedient; they are designed for hunting or warfare. A well made front rest with a windage top and quality rear bag is a zero compromize accuracy shooting tool. Do you ever see a bipod at a BR competition?