Help with redding Comp. dies

[RichAllen]

I just got a set of dies that utilize the bushings and I'm not sure that I'm using them correctly.

Measuring the outside of a fire formed loaded case I subtract .001 for the correct bushing size.

I sized about 50 cases using the die last night and I decided to chamber on to see how it felt, to my surprise the bolt was tight.
I want to make sure that having a tight bolt-is correct before I charge the cases.

When I say tight, I'm not implying that the bolt cannot be closed with out force but it's not like loading a factory spec round either.

I took one of the sized cases and and changed bushings in the die by -.002 and it chambered with the same tight feeling.

This is the 4th time loading this brass.

Thanks for the help

Rich

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Sounds like it's not adjusted to bump the shoulder back properly. You need to be able to measure how much you bump the shoulder back when adjusting the die.--Mike

 

[RichAllen]

I want to add a few comments so we have the right piture.

The load I'm using has not changed, the cases don't show sign from pressure and I'm under the extreme load data.

The bolt lugs are oiled properly and the gun is clean as a whistle.


Rich

 

[RichAllen]

Good morning Mike.

I have a wilson case gauge and it slips right in..... How else do i measure it?

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I'm not familiar with the wilson case guage. If you can use it to determine the length of the case from base to datun point on the shouler, it'll work. Take a fired case and measure it against a sized case. Adjust the die down until you get about .001-.002" "bump" or shortening of the case.---Mike

 

[CatShooter]

Do the fired cases chamber tightly before you size them?


.

 

[CatShooter]

"... If it bolts hard, adjust the die until you get no resistance to closer,or to your liking).
If you adjust the die to much where the bolt closes to freely, back the die off. Happy Shooting Donovan Moran

Do we know if he has a neck, or FL die die???

 

[RichAllen]

I have a complete set of the competition dies, FL, Neck and bullet seater.

I know if I run the brass through the FL die it will chamber easy. I was under the impression that by using the bushing and only sizing the neck you get more precision.

Catshooter: The brass in question Lapua, this will be the forth time loading it. The first two times everything went smooth but after the 2nd time I could feel the bolt was stiff when chambered them. This time the bolt is even stiffer.

Like i said, it's not hard to close the bolt but the stiffness is definitely noticeable.

Maybe I should just run the brass through the FL die and bring it back to original specification.

I just started relaoding but my loads have proven to be very accurate so far, I just want to make sure that I'm not going to hurt the rifle by chambering the brass with such a tight fit.


Rich

 

[relliott]

Rich

The shoulder of your cases grow in length each time you fire them. As you mentioned, the first two firings chamber easily. The shoulders then contact the chamber causing the stiff bolt closure. Your neck sizing die isn't "bumping the shoulder" back but just sizing the neck. Using your full length die,as you mentioned) sizes the case to where it chambers easily. This setting on your full length die may be excessive,size a little too much) but without some type of exact measurement to the shoulder it's just a guess. As mentioned earlier you can play with the setting for your full length die so that it bumps the shoulder 2 or 3 thousands and greatly extend the life of your brass. I would highly recommend the RCBS case mic. You can then measure a case that causes stiff bolt closure and find out what that measurement is. After that it's easy to size a case and measure and know exactly how much your sizing your case and how much to adjust the die.

I did a drawing showing the Wilson case gage and its use. Hope it helps a little.

"I was under the impression that by using the bushing and only sizing the neck you get more precision."

Personally I don't think you get more precision from just neck sizing with bushings. I use the Lee collet dies and the runout is next to nothing. In my opinion proper case prep and sizing practices are the main path to tiny bughole groups.

Hang in there. Keep at it. Soon you'll have many targets with little tiny bugholes. Then as with most of us, you'll be spending all your time and effort trying to make those little bity groups even smaller. Welcome to the world of precision handloading!

Rick

 

[CatShooter]

I have a complete set of the competition dies, FL, Neck and bullet seater.

I know if I run the brass through the FL die it will chamber easy. I was under the impression that by using the bushing and only sizing the neck you get more precision.

CatShooter: The brass in question Lapua, this will be the forth time loading it. The first two times everything went smooth but after the 2nd time I could feel the bolt was stiff when chambered them. This time the bolt is even stiffer.

Like i said, it's not hard to close the bolt but the stiffness is definitely noticeable.

Maybe I should just run the brass through the FL die and bring it back to original specification.

I just started reloading but my loads have proven to be very accurate so far, I just want to make sure that I'm not going to hurt the rifle by chambering the brass with such a tight fit.
Rich

Rich...

Depending on a bunch of variables, sometimes cases can grow to the point that they start getting to be a tight fit in the chamber.

Some shooters like that state of affairs,I'm one of them)... others are troubled by it.

Here's a simple solution.

Take the FL die and thread it down to the point that it hits the shell holder, and back it off 1/4 turn, and tighten the lock ring,a little).

Size a fired case, and try it. If it's still tight, turn the FL die in 1/32 of a turn, and repeat the same.

Keep doing this until the case fits the way you want. The die might be a bit off of the shell holder, or it might be tight on it.

Once it is set, then you use the neck sizer until the cases fit tight, and then use the FL die to set the shoulder back a few thou, and then go back to the neck sizer...

It's not as hard as some would make it out to be!


.

 

[Preacher]

Tight going in is not bad, but tight coming back out is not good at all....

 

[rstreich]

I think we'll have to designate Rick the official illustrator.

Keep cranking 'em out, Rick!

 

[RichAllen]

I ran the brass through the FL die and adjusted it down until the brass bolt closed freely.
I then it back through the neck die verifying the shoulder was to my specifications.


Everything seems to be back on track now. Thanks to everyone that helped me here :wave:


Rich

 

[RichAllen]

Hi Lynn,


The brass is Lapua 308 win.

This was the 5th time loading it. I went to the range on Saturday, the brass fired great.
I will have to check out the bump die and see if it's for me.

Jim Borden said my 6.5x284 Shehane should be shipping out this week. Just in time to get a load developed for the nationals at Sacramento.

Rich

 

[RichAllen]

Lynn, It's good to hear you are shooting your light gun with the tuner installed during the upcoming match. it gives real credit to everything you said on other forums regarding the tuner and your belief in the theory.


I'm bringing two rifles with me to the match, the 6.5x284 and the factory gun FN-SPR 308.

I will be testing at Two rocks and Sacramento in the days/weeks prior to the match. We need to make it point to say hello and shake hands while there.

The aluminum gun sounds cool, I can't wait to check it out.

Rich

 

[billmo]

Rich, if you don't mind me asking, what is your best accuracy load for your FN? So far, mine has shot really well with the Hornady 168 A-max non-coated. Thanks, Bill

 

[RichAllen]

Bill,

The last couple weeks have given way to a load my gun seems to really like.

Case: Norma trimmed to 2.000
44 grn Varget
berger 168 gr VLD
Fed 210 primer
Cartridge OAL measured at the ogive 2.285 ),ten thous off the lands)

The funny thing about this new load is 44 grains of varget will not not work for 168 SMK. I need to boost the load to 46 grains for the sierra 168.

The 44 grain load also works great using the 155 SMK.
My sons new Savage loves the 168 SMK with 46 grains of varget.

I've never tried the Hornady bullets in this rifle. We stopped by the range this morning and my rifle was shooting the best groups yet.
One thing about my rifle that seems crazy, It loves to shoot with a very warm barrel and it settles in after about 30 rounds have been pushed through it.
Using the very same load, I started out shooting .85 MOA and after about 30 rounds I was shooting .22 MOA.
I almost hesitate cleaning it. !


Rich

 

[billmo]

Yea, I bet you do. Some bareels do that. Mine shoots best after about 2 five shot groups. I have tried some loads with the bullet seated at 2.800 and it still shoots good even that far from the lands. I like mine alot. Bill