heavy bullets at short range ?

[cjmac]

so iv worked up a good load in my 223 . 75 grain hornady bthp . and imr 4166 . but some how In the back of my mind I keep thinking the heavier bthp is hurting my accuracy at short range. I'm using a 26in 1 in 7 twist . would it be worth it to use flat base bullet ? like a 52 or 53 grain burger or sierra . so far as jam or soft seating bullets iv never had good accuracy at all for some reason. if working up new load should I jam , then work in powder charge , sorry don't know much about jam or soft seating

 

[jr600yd]

I use to shoot a lot of 100 yd XTC matches using an AR match rifle. In those matches I shot the 53 gr SMK's with just enough powder to cycle the action. For 100 yds probably the most accurate load I ever developed. This was in a 1/8 barrel.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

According to what chamber you have you may not be able to jam at mag length with any bullet

 

[jr600yd]

Dusty's right, my ammo was loaded to function thru a magazine. If your shooting a bolt gun that's another story.

 

[cjmac]

It's a bolt gun. Just never got good groups into the lands , not sure why . Should I try into the lands then work on powder charge?

 

[broncman]

My most accurate load in my FTR AR is a 77 SMK.....even at 100 yds. I do not believe weight is an issue as long as it stabilizes. Dont be afraid to try other bullets though. Just saying that weight alone does not determine accuracy. I tried every offering available at the time from SIerra and Hornady from 50 grains to 77. It loved the 50Vmax and 77 SMK. I have a few 10 shot groups under 1/2" at 100 with the 77's.

Personally in both my comp guns I have done better with a jump.

 

[cjmac]

Maby I'll try 52 Berger or 53 smk ... Sierra is cheaper.

 

[jr600yd]

The guys have given you good advice. Refining your load may show heavy Bullets to be as accurate as the lighter ones in your rifle at 100 yds. If this proves true the biggest difference will be on the price of a box of bullets.

 

[cjmac]

Very true, I'm not sure why I decided to use 75 grain as I don't shoot past 300 yards. I might someday..

 

[cjmac]

The hornady match bullets are cheap but the ogive makes it hard to seat constantly . I think I'll need vld stem for My Wilson seating die. I get get more consistent OAL with my rcbs die

 

[cjmac]

And I do sort my bullets

 

[waldo1979]

Those 75gr HBPT shoot really good for my friends and I. For 100 yard these are one of my favorites:
https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/23812

I use Benchmark powder with the lighter bullets. Both liked to be jumped and used at book length. My AR has a CLI chamber which has a little less freebore.

Wow a 1:7 with a 26" barrel, that's a really fast twist for that length. Probably could stabilize a 90gr easily.

 

[waldo1979]

I bet these shoot amazing but I haven't tried them:
https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/21176

 

[cjmac]

I bet these shoot amazing but I haven't tried them:
https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/21176

I have a box of 52 gr Berger's haven't got a chance to try them yet

 

[cjmac]

Those 75gr HBPT shoot really good for my friends and I. For 100 yard these are one of my favorites:
https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/23812

I use Benchmark powder with the lighter bullets. Both liked to be jumped and used at book length. My AR has a CLI chamber which has a little less freebore.

Wow a 1:7 with a 26" barrel, that's a really fast twist for that length. Probably could stabilize a 90gr easily.

I'm seriously considering trying the 90 grain Sierra . Not sure what powder I'd use I have n140 and imr 4166

 

[jmcgowe]

FWIW - the 90 SMKs now come pointed in the box from the factory. Regardless, you'll need a long freebore to seat them optimally. Their base-to-ogive measurement is only about .009" less than the Berger 90 VLDs (based on book values, actual BTO lengths may vary a bit). Many people are using .169" fb to load the 90 VLDs. There are a couple guys I shoot local matches with every month that have been using the 90 SMKs recently due to the shortage of Berger 90 VLDs. So far, they have been very happy with the performance.

I am looking to rebarrel my Savage F/TR .223 to shoot the 90 gn SMK's. Most of the discussion has referred to the Berger VLD's when referencing freebore. Should the same freebore recommendations hold for the SMK's (i.e. somewhere in the range of .164" per Pitcairn to .169" in these forums)?

 

[Berger.Fan222]

80 SMKs produce 0.4 MOA at 100 yards in the Savage F-TR rifle we shoot them out of. I think it is a 1 in 8" twist.

We also have a 1 in 14" twist Savage Triple Deuce that loves just about any bullet it will stabilize. 0.4 MOA is real regular with the 52 grain Berger.

I think most shooters would be hard pressed to pick one over the other in a 100 yard match. Since wind can open up groups at 100 yards, those who have shot both on a windy day would shoot the 80 SMKs from the F-TR.

I don't think you make hard, fast rules about barrels and bullets. Some times you just stumble upon great combinations and try not to change anything as long as it lasts.

 

[boltman223]

I am looking to rebarrel my Savage F/TR .223 to shoot the 90 gn SMK's. Most of the discussion has referred to the Berger VLD's when referencing freebore. Should the same freebore recommendations hold for the SMK's (i.e. somewhere in the range of .164" per Pitcairn to .169" in these forums)?

Yep same freebore for Sierra 90's. I Even use the same freebore with 80 smk's and it works great for those too.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I am looking to rebarrel my Savage F/TR .223 to shoot the 90 gn SMK's. Most of the discussion has referred to the Berger VLD's when referencing freebore. Should the same freebore recommendations hold for the SMK's (i.e. somewhere in the range of .164" per Pitcairn to .169" in these forums)?

Many of those shooting the Berger 90 VLDs are seating them into the lands. I am one of a small number that have found optimal results with them seated ~.015-.018" off the lands. As a result, I'm effectively "losing" about .025" of the .169 freebore, relative to seating them .010" into the lands. IIRC, the bearing surface of the 90 SMK is ~.009" shorter than the 90 VLD. With the 90 VLD seated at ~ .015" off the lands, the boattail/bearing surface junction is just barely above the neck/shoulder junction. For that reason, even with the slightly shorter 90 SMK I wouldn't go less than the .169" freebore. There's still room in the neck to move them out quite a bit further, but almost none to move them further in. 0.169" fb ought to be ideal for the 90 SMK, regardless of whether you seat them slightly off or slightly into the lands.

 

[jmcgowe]

Many of those shooting the Berger 90 VLDs are seating them into the lands. I am one of a small number that have found optimal results with them seated ~.015-.018" off the lands. As a result, I'm effectively "losing" about .025" of the .169 freebore, relative to seating them .010" into the lands. IIRC, the bearing surface of the 90 SMK is ~.009" shorter than the 90 VLD. With the 90 VLD seated at ~ .015" off the lands, the boattail/bearing surface junction is just barely above the neck/shoulder junction. For that reason, even with the slightly shorter 90 SMK I wouldn't go less than the .169" freebore. There's still room in the neck to move them out quite a bit further, but almost none to move them further in. 0.169" fb ought to be ideal for the 90 SMK, regardless of whether you seat them slightly off or slightly into the lands.

Many thanks, guys. So .169" it is then.

John