Headspace help

[Justin B]

Ok so I have a savage 22BR. Using a Hornaday headspace gauge a fired casing headspace is 1.160 if I don't set shoulder back brass sticks & bolt closes real hard on anything over 1.153

Normally I don't have to set shoulders back this far what am I doing wrong or what is possibly wrong? Thank you

 

[Bill Norris]

Ok so I have a savage 22BR. Using a Hornaday headspace gauge a fired casing headspace is 1.160 if I don't set shoulder back brass sticks & bolt closes real hard on anything over 1.153

Normally I don't have to set shoulders back this far what am I doing wrong or what is possibly wrong? Thank you

WOW ! .007 is a wide stretch and a lot of brass movement.

 

[Justin B]

WOW ! .007 is a wide stretch and a lot of brass movement.

I know if I set the headspace back .003 the brass is almost impossible to get out of the chamber. Its frustrating its my favorite varmit caliber.

 

[jackieschmidt]

I don’t think the bumping of your shoulder is the problem. I would bet the problem is in the case web, which for some reason is not sizing down enough to get easy loading.

measure your case at the web after full length sizing and see if the sizing die is doing it’s job.

 

[Justin B]

I don’t think the bumping of your shoulder is the problem. I would bet the problem is in the case web, which for some reason is not sizing down enough to get easy loading.

measure your case at the web after full length sizing and see if the sizing die is doing it’s job.

I also thought this measured a case that loads easy & a case that would stick and I'm still getting. 4675 on both bad & good casings at the base or web.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

So a fired case will not rechamber? Without moving that much brass.

 

[JFrank]

Perhaps if you illustrate your cartridge as below, with fired and resized numbers these fellas can help you figure this out.

 

[K22]

A few questions but first I want to confirm that a "fire" case is difficult to extract and won't chamber without excessive force. Is that correct?

1. Is this the first time you have sized / loaded rounds for this rifle?
If so, I would have a gunsmith check the headspace of the rifle and examine the chamber for tool marks or other imperfection that could impede chambering a round and extracting a round. Do fired cases exhibit any heavy scaring / rub marks / tool marks?

If not, in other words if you sized and loaded cases before with no issues then did this condition begin to appear when you changed cases or made other changes such as brass / load, etc.?

2. Also, if the rifle is new, I've seen extractors cause problems chambering rounds on the newer vintage Remington 700's. The case would not "slip" into the extractor without excessive force. Haven't seen this with Savage rifles but it might be worth checking it out.

3. Is there any "galling" on the bolt lugs?

4. Do you notice any irregular bulging in front of the web area?

5. Do you notice any pressure signs, i.e., hard bolt lift, ejector impressions on the case rim.

 

[michaeljp65]

carbon ring

 

[M-61]

I know if I set the headspace back .003 the brass is almost impossible to get out of the chamber. Its frustrating its my favorite varmit caliber.

And how did it CHAMBER?
Chambering occurs before extraction.

 

[Justin B]

And how did it CHAMBER?
Chambering occurs before extraction.

Like crap. I'm starting to think its not a headspace issue at all. I took a round that would not chamber today & took a scotchbrite pad to it and polished it up good and it chambered fine. So at this point its my Die or chamber not?

 

[JSH]

I had to trim the brass on mine. I also did a skim turn on the neck.
Sure you know but will bring it up, there are reamers for RP specs AND Norma/Lapua specs.
That clean case, maybe some dykem will show where the issue is.

 

[JDinFbg]

Like crap. I'm starting to think its not a headspace issue at all. I took a round that would not chamber today & took a scotchbrite pad to it and polished it up good and it chambered fine. So at this point its my Die or chamber not?

Have you verified your chamber length? If your rifle chamber got cut with a short reamer, the end of the case neck could hit the end of the chamber before the case shoulder touches. I have made some simple chamber length measuring tools for various rifles, both rimless and rimmed. The top one in the picture was for my 30-06, but I machined a different sabot for my 6mm Remington. The sabot is threaded onto a flat-head machine screw so I can vary the OAL. I have to totally strip the bolt to eliminate any bolt-closing resistance, but vary the length of the tool until I find the point the bolt handle will not freely drop close. I measure the distance between the head of the screw and the end of the sabot, and this is my chamber length.

If you don't have the ability to make such a tool, take one of your fired cases that won't chamber freely, trim the neck significantly, seat a bullet (no primer or powder), and see if it will now chamber. You'll waste a piece of brass, but this would be an easy way to see if chamber length could be your issue.

 

[spudgun]

My Savage 12, 6.5 CM is very picky about the brass it likes.

Reloaded round was hard to close the bolt on and needed a piece of wood to beat the bolt out.

My problem was I needed to use a Small Base die to get the web of the case back to specs.

Now all is good.

 

[Drolds72]

Like crap. I'm starting to think its not a headspace issue at all. I took a round that would not chamber today & took a scotchbrite pad to it and polished it up good and it chambered fine. So at this point its my Die or chamber not?

It’s both- your die is not a good match for the chamber. I’d bet if you ran them through a small base/ring die, they would chamber and extract better. clickers upon bolt open?

 

[spudgun]

Try to get yourself a case length/headspace gauge. Here are 3 cases that I have for my 6.5 CM.

2, of these cases were resized with a F/L die and the one on the right was with a Small Base die.

Now the case on the left will NOT chamber in my Savage, the middle one will and of course the right one is perfect.

 

[pkuhn67]

Hi everyone. I am new here and somewhat new to reloading. Have reloaded 9mm, 38 and 357 but recently started loading .223. Also took some New Republic ammo.

Last week I loaded some round with lake city brass, Winchester srp, 55gn hornady fmjbt, using n-133. COL was at 2.19.

After the range I cleaned my brass. The LC all has this ring a short way down from the shoulder. Some is more visible than others but all in the same place. The NR brass is fine no rings or anything anywhere. I am trying to figure out if this is still good to go or just toss it?

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

If using a bushing die, pay close attention to the area just below the neck/shoulder junction that typically does not get touched by most bushing dies. Referring to the part of the shoulder that's just below the neck. It's especially so if you load hot but can happen without hot loads. I mean...the die never touches the area I'm talking about at all. How much depends on the hole size in the bushing shelf.

 

[pkuhn67]

I've been using just a standard .223 lee resizing / decapping die. That is what has me confused about these rings. I forgot to add that powder charge was only 23.5gn.

 

[SeabeeKen]

Id inspect the chamber and die with a bore scope. Ihave achamber with some rings in it that leaves a ring on cases. No big deal