Have all Wolf primers gone soft?

[Dave2]

There's a thread over on the long range forum about the new Wolf small rifle magnum primers apparently being softer than previous lots (one comment pasted below). I posted a question asking about Wolf large rifle magnum primers, but haven't received a response.

Does anyone have any experience with new lots of Wolf large rifle magnum primers? Have they gone soft too?

Thanks,
Dave

"I have a large stock of these primers, and found out about the change last week, when my old (chrome) stock was depleted.

As of now, I have new lot numbers 5-09, 6-09, and 17-09. They all are the new replacement, which have a softer, brass cup. Insertion of these primers are easier, with narry of the old "hard seat" issues.

After briefly testing them last week in my 6BR test rifle (awfully tight chamber), several things immediately jumped to my attention, first, having left all else equal (powder type, weight, oal, etc.), I was surprised that these primers couldn't hold pressure the same way it's original couterpart did. Second, after having reduced the load by half a grain, pressure signs remained. Third, another decrease of powder (2/10ths) made the pressure signs disappear, but rendered this cartridge substantially underpowered (over 1 MOA lower at 600yds). Fourth, testing conditions were 50-60 degrees, which makes this a scary situation for when summer temperatures arrive.

In all, I feel dissapointed (being extremely polite here)at this uncalled for change. Four years of testing and countless pages of outstanding loads basically thrown down the drain. For now, much needed tests will determine what purpose these "new" primers hold in the future, if at all.

Andy



Andy (or anyone!),

Do you know if the newest Wolf large rifle magnum primers have "gone soft" too? I have some on order, I may cancel and re-think things if the new ones are also soft.

Thanks,
Dave

 

[fullersson]

A buddy of mine shoot those and I just ordered some. He hasn't experienced any problems with them. I have always heard that Wolf has the softest primers, but we shoot loads way over max and haven't had any problems.

 

[fayettefatts]

Dave: Don't know if my experience will be of help or not, so I wont charge the usual $.02.
I tried Wolf small rifle magnum primers in a 6br this past summer and had good results. I just found a good deal on more this past weekend at a gun show, and bought 5000 more.
After reading your post, I opened the sleeve of recently purchased primers and compared them to the ones I already had. All have the same lot number, 5-09. All are chrome plated. (It sounds like the new ones Andy talked about were not plated). Haven't used any yet, so I cannot say if they are harder or softer, nor can I tell you if they are "new" or "old". Just wanted to say I see no visual difference.
Look forward to hearing what other shooters are finding.

 

[Steve Blair]

I have been using Wolf KVB-5.56M, lot number 5-09 in 6BR and .223 with no issues. In no way can my loads be described as low pressure. I am getting just over 3000 fps with Sierra 107s. It may be important to make a distinction between the two types of Wolf SRM primers, KVB-5.56M and KVB-223. The following is a quote from Widener's site.

Wolf small rifle primers are now available in types.

SMALL RIFLE PRIMER (part #QQQSR) - Used as a standard small rifle primer. Perfect for the 30 carbine and 223 standard loads. Many people use this primer in bench and other loads for the 223. This primer is a copper colored primer.

SMALL RIFLE MAGNUM PRIMER (part#QQQSRM) - This is the primer we had before for use in the 5.56 loads and hot 223 loads. A thick cup for the higher pressure. We sold a lot of these primers earlier this year. The new lot is brass colored instead of nickel.

SMALL RIFLE 223 (part #QQQSR223) NEW NEW This is the newest primer available in the Wolf line. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite.

 

[Dave2]

Thanks for the replies. I've been using the Wolf small rifle magnum primers for a few years with good results. These are the chrome-plated ones.

I have no experience with the Wolf LARGE rifle magnum primers, don't know if they've changed their cups like they seem to have on the SR magnums. I'll hope that the cups on the LR magnums are still hard, I have a few thousand on order!

Thanks,
Dave

 

[Steve Blair]

I have used the KVB-7 in .22-250 and .308 Win. loads, the KVB-7M in 6.5-284 loads with RL22 and H4831SC. All are full-pressure loads and I have observed no primer-related problems. All my problems seem to be shooter-related.

 

[Dave2]

Thanks Steve. Now if I can just get rid of my shooter problems too!

 

[Short Round]

I have a stash of KVB223M, Nickel coated.

I have at different times and places been told I have the regular primer and not the one suitable for AR's.

So far no problems.

 

[Steve Blair]

Both the KVB-223M and KVB-5.56M are small rifle magnum primers. The KVB-223 is the small rifle primer and said to have soft and/or thin cups. I have never tried the KVB-223. The KVB-5.56M is the original SRM from Wolf/PMC/etc. Note that Widener's says the KVB-223 has a copper-colored primer. If the cup is truly copper, that would certainly explain why it is soft. It may just be a copper wash over the brass to distinguish it from the magnum primers.