Girdle and Spraying Trees

[Schippergreg]

Not always 100% effective when dealing with Honey Locust. The stuff with the poisionous thorns several inches long. Even when used during winter as recommended on the label. Found that out the hard way. Not a problem you want to have because the sprouts grow back with more thorns than leaves.

I’ve had excellent results with milestone on honey locust.

 

[TC260]

View attachment 1400140
Interesting timing on this for me. There are multiple ins-and-outs.

I love trees. Love oaks, maples, hickory, many more, however some trees are garbage on the land.

It's extra dangerous to cut big trees down in confined spaces because you can't effectively get away if they go sideways. Also, they can twist and flip and bring other dangers down.

You can griddle. You can get as aggressive as you like as you can see above. This girdling was done mid July 2022 and won't make any difference until this coming summer. No change whatsoever as of mid-january. I've tried drilling holes and adding salt, and salt to the roots. No impact.

A new day is dawning on this for me, I'm stepping up my game, just received a gallon of 41% glyhosphapte, gloves, face shield, and squirt bottle and a package of 1/2 drill bits and going to drill three holes per trash tree and add a tea poon of glyosphaspate to each hole.

We'll see - good luck

I can help you save some work there. If you're using herbicides there's no need to trim off that much bark or drill holes. If you understand tree biology there's some subtleties not discussed in the girdle and spray video. The reason he's just making a single shallow cut around the tree is to do one thing, allow the herbicide direct access to the phloem.

There's two conducting pathways in the tree, xylem and phloem. The xylem fibers are located on the outside edge of the actual wood of the tree and they conduct water and nutrients up from the roots to the canopy of the tree. The phloem fibers are located on the inner portion of the bark outside of the actual wood and they conduct photosynthates down from the leaves to the roots. By applying the herbicide to the phloem it's a straight shot down to the roots, plain and simple. Drilling holes into the tree doesn't really do anything because the circumferential area your treating is limited to the width of the drill and most of it is going into wood that isn't doing anything anyway.

For herbicides, glyphosate is really best suited for herbaceous plants. Sure, in high enough concentrations it'll work but Triclopyr is really a much better herbicide for woody plants.

 

[Doug Bogg]

I can help you save some work there. If you're using herbicides there's no need to trim off that much bark or drill holes. If you understand tree biology there's some subtleties not discussed in the girdle and spray video. The reason he's just making a single shallow cut around the tree is to do one thing, allow the herbicide direct access to the phloem.

There's two conducting pathways in the tree, xylem and phloem. The xylem fibers are located on the outside edge of the actual wood of the tree and they conduct water and nutrients up from the roots to the canopy of the tree. The phloem fibers are located on the inner portion of the bark outside of the actual wood and they conduct photosynthates down from the leaves to the roots. By applying the herbicide to the phloem it's a straight shot down to the roots, plain and simple. Drilling holes into the tree doesn't really do anything because the circumferential area your treating is limited to the width of the drill and most of it is going into wood that isn't doing anything anyway.

For herbicides, glyphosate is really best suited for herbaceous plants. Sure, in high enough concentrations it'll work but Triclopyr is really a much better herbicide for woody plants.

Dude, I want to be the kindergarten student at the college level class you're teaching.

I've reread this several times and in my simple mind I have a question with getting the agent into the xylem versus phloem. I do know that trees can live for a year with all the bark completely stripped away, so positively there is some nutrient movement in what would seem to be "dead wood".

The confusion for me is that you've written that, "By applying the herbicide to the phloem it's a straight shot down to the roots, plain and simple". So, wouldn't drilling 2" deep holes and applying a squirt of glyso be achieving what you're describing?

Sorry for my lack of understanding, and clarification highly appreciated -

 

[TC260]

Dude, I want to be the kindergarten student at the college senior level class you're teaching.

I've reread this several times and in my simple mind I have a question with getting the agent into the xylem versus phloem. I do know that trees can live for a year with all the bark completely stripped away, so positively there is some nutrient movement in what would seem to be "dead wood".

The confusion for me is that you've written that, "By applying the herbicide to the phloem it's a straight shot down to the roots, plain and simple". So, wouldn't drilling 2" deep holes and applying a squirt of glyso be achieving what you're describing?

Sorry for my lack of understanding, and clarification highly appreciated -

You're right, the wood isn't completely dead (non-functional). To visualize it, you can think of the outer say inch of wood is where the xylem is located. The wood further towards the center of that is no longer conducting water and nutrients. If you've heard of the term "Cambium" or "Cambium Layer", that's the very outside edge of the wood where cell division (growth) is actually taking place.

When you girdle the tree you're cutting off the energy supply (phloem/inner bark) to the roots, starving them. But like you've seen, the tree can continue to survive for a little while because the xylem is still in tact. Water flow in the tree is a passive system. Moisture evaporates off the leaves and pulls water up the tree via capillary action in the xylem.

In regard to the holes, picture it like this. Let's say the circumference of the tree is 30" and you drill 3 one inch holes in the tree. In that case you'd only be applying the herbicide to 10% of the phloem. More or less 90% of the root system would be unaffected. In the video, when he makes that cut around the tree and applies the cocktail, it's going into 100% of the phloem and that's why it's more effective than drilling holes.

 

[Doug Bogg]

Thanks for your reply with great insights.

Ok, so I have gas powered chainsaws, battery powered chainsaws, axes, hatches, saws, drills, and a gallon of 41% glysophate and want to eliminate pine. What would be your recommendation? Light drilling? Hatchet cuts? Saw cuts? Chainsaw "plunge" cuts? One cut per/tree? Three cuts per tree? Six cuts? Three drill points and three hatchet cuts? I'm highly appreciative of hearing more and thanks for your time -

I kindly asked the loggers to get everything but they were operating on an "umbrella drink" protocol. "If it's not on flat-open-ground we can't get to it"

 

[pdhntr]

... and want to eliminate pine....

Conifer rarely regrow from stumps. And they tend to rot relatively quickly when in contact with the ground.

I would simply cut the tree down, make enough cuts to the stem and branches so the pieces get close to the ground so they rot, or spend a few minutes piling up the trash so it is out of the way or can be used by the local wild life for cover.

The last thing I want on my land is a bunch of standing dead trees. They are a fire hazard, a safety hazard on windy days, and they will be dropping branches and tops in your way for years.

Just my thoughts from experience.

Jim

 

[markT]

Harbor Freight has a "Chain Saw" type attachment for an angle grinder. I think it is for carving.. Looks dangerous as heck. That might be an easy way yo girdle a tree.. I think the cocktail of chemicals might work according to the write up... Probably going to try this this spring.

 

[D Coots]

I've got a bunch of trees I need to kill. Sweetgums and Holly mostly.
Ran across this. I'm thinking spring time would be the best time. Anyone got any experience?

Not sure what kind of soil you have there or what the root system is. If it's sandy I'd knock the trees down with an excavator, buck them up in a pile, let them set for a year to dry and let the soil on the root ball dry, then repile them to get the soil out of the roots, and burn them. Just fill in the holes left.

 

[NorCalMikie]

View attachment 1400110

Shaken but NOT stirred.

 

[DaveTooley]

Perfect timing. I have 100+ small trees to kill up in the mountains here in NC to open up the view on a steep hillside. Lots of gum, some oak. For safety reason's I need a hack and squirt routine.

 

[markT]

Not sure what kind of soil you have there or what the root system is. If it's sandy I'd knock the trees down with an excavator, buck them up in a pile, let them set for a year to dry and let the soil on the root ball dry, then repile them to get the soil out of the roots, and burn them. Just fill in the holes left.

Several things we have here that prevent such an easy suggestion.
Callery Pears which are wild Bradford Pears that have tap roots that are 3'-4'. If one does not get all the roots up the roots just start growing another tree.. We also have red clay for soil and it is very hard to dig..
We have Sweetgum trees that are very similar all the roots must be dug up or the tree regrows. Cutting these down is a waste of time.
Many of the Holly Trees are right up against or close to 100 year old oaks. I have been spraying these trees but I don't like to spray for a multitude of reasons. Some of these tree are 40'-50' tall.

 

[Walt Krafft]

Get some professional help.

 

[Doug Casner]

I got some guys that do it for a living to clean my timber up. They girdled some cut some down about 3 ft. off the ground. Just let em fall. They dont clean the fallen trees up. My paths thru the timber were messed up but the timber canopy was letting sunlight to the ground making the small plants regenerate awesome deer forage. I saw alot of deer down there last year. Did the right thing, for once. Doug

 

[TrapperBR549]

In Missouri we have a private land specialist for each county. They will tour your property, make recommendations, and provide $$$ to implement.
One example on our place is removing bush honeysuckle. Their recommendation was a basal application (just spray the trunk) with Remedy and diesel and they will pay for the chemical and pay a certain amount per acre once they are dead.
NRCS has some programs as well and they probably have more $$$$ available but so far the process has been long, drawn out, and frustrating.

 

[Walt Krafft]

One of the reasons I think you need some professional help is the closeness of the trees you are trying to kill to trees you want to keep. If the roots are comingled, some herbicides can move from one tree to the other, killing both.

 

[TrapperBR549]

One of the reasons I think you need some professional help is the closeness of the trees you are trying to kill to trees you want to keep. If the roots are comingled, some herbicides can move from one tree to the other, killing both.

Agreed. Glypo (roundup) is very safe to nearby trees but might not be as effective for some applications. I have found that tordon kills most undesireables better but can definitely harm other "good" trees.

 

[akajun]

Hack & squirt. I use straight imazapyr. It is active in the soil so be careful around trees you want to keep alive. They have to be actively growing to be effective.

This , remedy is the brand name
About $100 a gallon
Get you a tool belt , sharp heavy hatchet, and a refillable spray bottle
One hatchet gouge for every 2-3” of tree dia

Dead in a year

 

[okie]

One of the reasons I think you need some professional help is the closeness of the trees you are trying to kill to trees you want to keep. If the roots are comingled, some herbicides can move from one tree to the other, killing both.

Exactly