Is there any magic behind a 4 or 6 groove or going to a 5r? What about bore specs? I've narrowed it down to a 30-32" heavy palma 9 twist with a us team ftr reamer so I can run lapua brass without turning necks and run 185 juggsajd 200.20x as well as others like 195 tmk or 200 smk. I want to do this barrel right though and if most are seeing that a 4 groove shoots better than a 6 then I'll go with what experience is telling others.
Ftr 308 barrel specs
- Thread starter 74GTF100
- Start date
A friend of mine who's a Smith and done alot of testing has seen that with a faster twist like an 8-9tw in 308 it spins them fast enough that they don't tumble and destabilize when going transonic. He shot a 9 twist 308 accurately at 3200y and has shot a mile with it regularly. I'll use this barrel with 175 vld for PRS as well and we have shot out to 1200 pretty regularly with some going out to almost 1500. Thus the 9 twist.
wasn't the question about F/TR?
Ned Ludd
Silver $$ Contributor
There is no need for a 9-twist barrel. The 200.20Xs actually shoot extremely well out of even an 11-twist barrel. That is not to say you can't use a 9-twist, but a 10-twist will do everything you need. I am a big believer in running the minimum twist rate necessary to fully stabilize the bullet you intend to use (i.e. Sg ~ 1.5). Running a twist rate any faster than that might, repeat "might", increase torque and gun handling issues unnecessarily, as well as aerodynamic drift. Whether the difference in either of these factors between a 9-twist and a 10-twist barrel is actually noticeable doesn't really matter; if you don't need a 9-twist barrel in order to fully stabilize the bullet of choice, why even risk the possibility that it might make a difference? Increasing twist rate can sometimes make a difference when a bullet goes trans-sonic, but not always. Gyroscopic stability actually increases the farther the bullet flies, but in the trans-sonic region, other factors in addition to gyroscopic stability become important. The trans-sonic behavior is largely a property of the bullet design, less so the velocity in a practical sense. Sometimes a faster twist rate may help, sometimes not. If trans-sonic stability is an issue with a given bullet, I would suggest using a different bullet where it isn't a problem, not using a barrel with a faster-than-necessary twist rate.
Until recently, I had never used any barrels other than Bartlein 5Rs for my F-TR rifles. Last fall, I decided to re-barrel a custom wood stocked .308 Win rifle I had built several years ago, but that didn't previously have a barrel that was really amenable to shooting F-TR (i.e. 24" barrel). Because the stock is made of Brazilian Leopardwood finished with clear polyurethane and is really almost a work of art, I had to make sure that the barrel blank would properly fit the barrel channel such that no woodwork would have to be done. It turned out that a 30" Heavy Palma contour barrel was a perfect fit, whereas the 30" MTU contour I normally favor wouldn't work. At the time, the only 31" Heavy Palma 10-twist (.300"/.308") blank I could find was a Krieger 4-groove. I worked up a load with the 200.20Xs over Varget and I have to tell you, that barrel shoots as well any any barrel I've ever owned.
I recently used the Leopardwood rifle with the new 30" Krieger Heavy Palma barrel to shoot my first e-target with a new Shotmarker setup at 600 yd. I think the results speak for themselves, but it is worth noting that the two shots out of the X-ring were most likely poor gun handling on my part. They occurred late in the string and I lost focus a little bit. In any event, even though I am still a big fan of Bartlein 5R barrels, I would not hesitate to purchase another Krieger 4-groove. From other shooters I know, I believe the same should hold true for Brux barrels, which also have a very fine reputation, but I have never personally shot a Brux barrel. I doubt you will go wrong with any of those three manufacturers, and I also doubt the specific land/groove pattern will make a noticeable difference.
Until recently, I had never used any barrels other than Bartlein 5Rs for my F-TR rifles. Last fall, I decided to re-barrel a custom wood stocked .308 Win rifle I had built several years ago, but that didn't previously have a barrel that was really amenable to shooting F-TR (i.e. 24" barrel). Because the stock is made of Brazilian Leopardwood finished with clear polyurethane and is really almost a work of art, I had to make sure that the barrel blank would properly fit the barrel channel such that no woodwork would have to be done. It turned out that a 30" Heavy Palma contour barrel was a perfect fit, whereas the 30" MTU contour I normally favor wouldn't work. At the time, the only 31" Heavy Palma 10-twist (.300"/.308") blank I could find was a Krieger 4-groove. I worked up a load with the 200.20Xs over Varget and I have to tell you, that barrel shoots as well any any barrel I've ever owned.
I recently used the Leopardwood rifle with the new 30" Krieger Heavy Palma barrel to shoot my first e-target with a new Shotmarker setup at 600 yd. I think the results speak for themselves, but it is worth noting that the two shots out of the X-ring were most likely poor gun handling on my part. They occurred late in the string and I lost focus a little bit. In any event, even though I am still a big fan of Bartlein 5R barrels, I would not hesitate to purchase another Krieger 4-groove. From other shooters I know, I believe the same should hold true for Brux barrels, which also have a very fine reputation, but I have never personally shot a Brux barrel. I doubt you will go wrong with any of those three manufacturers, and I also doubt the specific land/groove pattern will make a noticeable difference.
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NZ_Fclass
Silver $$ Contributor
mmm 32in heavy Palma 9 tw...so a 4 power scope and a balsa stock to make weight? PRS with a 30-32in barrel? 28in of light or med Palma, 10 or 11 twist is all you need for FTR. Put the rest of the weight in a scope and decent stock/chassis. Pic is my FTR - 28in 13 twist MAB, Barnard action Right bolt left port, Dolphin Chassis. Burris XTR 8-40 scope.
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XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
Personally I would not go 32”, my testing says that for me at least the 15fps in MV you pick up isn’t worth it, esp considering that most of us find that we score better with a sable load that is about 50 to 60 FPS below the next node up that you can still run with a 30”.
If you insist on running 200s over 2700fps then a 32 might gain a tad, but really we’re talking 2/10 of a grain on charge. It’s not doing much for you.
I run a 30“ heavy varmint 1:10
If you insist on running 200s over 2700fps then a 32 might gain a tad, but really we’re talking 2/10 of a grain on charge. It’s not doing much for you.
I run a 30“ heavy varmint 1:10
It's looking like with an xlr envy, 30" heavy palma, defiance deviant, golden eagle with aluminum rings, and a joypod that I can make weight. My 28" heavy palma 6.5x47 barrel is only 5.5lbs so with increase in bore and 2" more it should be close to the same weight. Should be under 6.5lb
XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
I don’t know how heavy the XLR is but unless it’s a boat anchor you will be fine. Here in the US there was never a problem with making weight with a Heavy Palma in about ant setup even when we were running Nightforce NXS scopes that were about 8 Oz heavier than your Vortex.
if you can get a barrel with a 4” breach instead of the usual 2 1/2 you’ll have enough left over when it’s toasted to lop off the stub and rechamber it at 28”.
if you can get a barrel with a 4” breach instead of the usual 2 1/2 you’ll have enough left over when it’s toasted to lop off the stub and rechamber it at 28”.
30” krieger 12 twist heavy varmint has been one of the most accurate barrels I have owned. It’s shooting 185 juggernauts 2730fps avg with 10-15fps spreads over 10 shots. I would favour extra barrel weight on a 30 than a skinnier barrel at 32. I make weight with a barnard p action and hv barrel. Possibly the most accurate ftr rifle I have seen was a 28 inch parallel barrel on a stolle panda f class action. I have a 9 twist for my next one, only because I shoot at sea level and will try the 200gr sierra for myself as an experiment. Worst case it will work with 200.20x
I have used a 9t to shoot 185 in FTR after my attempt to get 215's to work didn't materialize the faster twist is not as accurate as a slower twist. 9T vs 10, 11 or 12 translates to a potential 11% - 33% slower spin. I have found that slower spinning bullet shows up on paper in the forum of smaller groups.
Additional the torque is notably more in a 9T then other slower twists
I have run 9T to 14T in FTR
I am however a fan of 32" barrels the majority of my barrels are 32 but for certain instances. The 185 whose upper node is 2800ish doesn't need a 32" you can achieve the same speed with 29". The extra weight lost in length can be made up in ordering a larger dia barrel, think Heavy Varmint vs Heavy Palma, short fat barrels whip less then long thin ones.
Cheers
Trevor
Additional the torque is notably more in a 9T then other slower twists
I have run 9T to 14T in FTR
I am however a fan of 32" barrels the majority of my barrels are 32 but for certain instances. The 185 whose upper node is 2800ish doesn't need a 32" you can achieve the same speed with 29". The extra weight lost in length can be made up in ordering a larger dia barrel, think Heavy Varmint vs Heavy Palma, short fat barrels whip less then long thin ones.
Cheers
Trevor
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