frusterated trying to find a load in 35 whelen improved with cfe 223. target pics added

[Savageseven]

anyone else have a load that has worked well for them in 35 whelen improved with 200 grain projectile ?
i want to use the 35 200 grain accubond because thats what i have the most of.

the rifle groups a 2 inch 3 shot group at 200 yards with 69 grain of cfe 223 and a GM210M primer .
but im really not that happy with that group. i feel they should all touch at 200 yards or atleast be a half inch group .

with 69.5 grains of cfe 223 im getting 3167 fps with a 26 inch barrel 1-12 twist

 

[Kurz]

There are lots of variables here which have an effect on accuracy and performance. Just because you have a particular powder or bullet doesn't mean that your rifle likes the combination.

Is your 69.5 grain load compressed? Or are you using an adjusted OAL with this load?

 

[Savageseven]

no

There are lots of variables here which have an effect on accuracy and performance. Just because you have a particular powder or bullet doesn't mean that your rifle likes the combination.

Is your 69.5 grain load compressed? Or are you using an adjusted OAL with this load?

i agree thats why i was hoping someone else could chime in and speak from past experience .
no my 69.5 load is not compressed. ive done seating test with this load everything from 5 thousands off lands all the way back to 15 thousands jump. and rifle still seems to not get any tighter groups

 

[358WCF]

No experience with an Ackley Whelen, but my standard Whelen didn't behave well with CFE223. It really liked PP2000MR. Unsure if I'm just lucky or if the sharper shoulder doesn't agree with the newer more progressive burning powders (like CFE223 or the PP series), but haven't had any success with them in any of my Ackleys. Ramshot Big Game does very well in my 338-06 Ackley.

Also... Accubombs reportedly like some jump. I've had good results from anywhere between very light jam to .100" off touch in my Whelen & a 358 Norma. The Whelen likes some jump & the Norma likes none.

2" at 200 yards is nothing to sneeze at with a hunting rifle & factory hunting bullets. If that can be done consistently, I wouldn't be too unhappy.

 

[Savageseven]

so maybe i should try seating with more jump then 15 thousands

 

[Walt Krafft]

Details of the rifle will help us understand what you are trying to do. Action, stock, scope, barrel make twist weight length. Two inches at 200 yards is 1 moa. Hard to consistently beat that from a hunting rifle.

 

[Savageseven]

Do you guys feel that powder brand or seating depth plays a bigger part in group size ?

 

[Mark611]

I had the same problem with my 6.5Creedmoor I tried the jump @10 15 20k off the touch, I end up at 30k off touch, before I saw the bullets touching each other @200m.

 

[SeabeeKen]

Sometimes you just cant get a particular powder to shoot well. I test many powders and find this a lot. I have a number of AI cartridges and try many powders in them. As @358WCF mentioned, Big Game might be a good choice to try. I have had excellent results with it and Hunter. When i did my Hodgdon purge, I kept the entire line of Ramshot powders. Another one You might consider, IMR-3031. It has performed well for me in places I never thought possible and often gives me phenomenal accuracy. It is a very under rated powder. I won many club matches with it in yrs past. 60-61 gr should be near max but your rifle will have to determine that

 

[Webster]

so maybe i should try seating with more jump then 15 thousands

2" at 200 yards. It is not a bench rest gun. 2" should be good for hunting deer. I asked someone once what size group do you shoot standing off hand after you have been walking for an hour. Maybe a 15 or 20" group.

 

[Savageseven]

70 grain of CFE seating test . 5 thousandths off the lands would be 2.621

 

[Savageseven]

 

[Savageseven]

Seating test at 69 grains

 

[Savageseven]

All testing was done at 200 yards
Nosler brass , CFE 223 powder , GM210M primers . And 200 grain nosler accubond.
All testing was done in 3 shot groups with
Letting barrel rest between shots.
At 69.5 grains of powder I’m at 3167 fps

 

[Savageseven]

any ideas guys ??

 

[Walt Krafft]

I think if you build a composit group from all your targets the answer will be clear.

 

[swd]

ive done seating test with this load everything from 5 thousands off lands all the way back to 15 thousands jump. and rifle still seems to not get any tighter groups

Do more seating depth testing. Plenty of bullets shoot best farther off. .020”-.050”. I never tried CFE223 in the Whelan AI but 3100+ seems awfully fast. Try farther off first if that doesn’t do it change the powder or bullet.

 

[Savageseven]

Do more seating depth testing. Plenty of bullets shoot best farther off. .020”-.050”. I never tried CFE223 in the Whelan AI but 3100+ seems awfully fast. Try farther off first if that doesn’t do it change the powder or bullet.

i did jump the bullet in seating test 50 thousands are you saying it needs more jump ?

 

[swd]

i did jump the bullet in seating test 50 thousands are you saying it needs more jump ?

Yes I’d try as far back as .050”-.060” but if you’ve already been there it’s time for for a different powder or bullet.

 

[PBking51]

Not to hijack the thread, but if anyone gave up on their 35 whelen improved, I could use dies