Free All as Bore Cleaner?

[JBauer]

All I use anymore!!!!
Simple and it works!
Just give it a little time to soak in. 15 minutes minimum, then brush and patch out.

 

[JBT47]

After your normal routine and you think the barrel is clean, run a brush with Free All through and the gunk will demonstrate the additional capability. As a routine first step I let it soak in overnight and it minimizes the need for an abrasive. As a last step I use lighter fluid to clean out the FA to reduce the number of fouling shots needed.

No need to try different solvents to see whether another picks up additional fouling left in bore. It’s much better to buy a $50 borescope and see actual bore condition than to trying other solvents to see what’s left in barrel. Clean barrel, examine with borescope to determine whether Iosso or Jb should be used.

 

[whatsupdoc]

I have used Free all spray for about 2 years, it is not removing any HARD carbon on its own. It seems to only provide lubrication for the bronze brush to do its thing.

 

[rlporter507]

I heard all the hoopla about free all, so I bought some and tried it on two bores that had everything cleaned out except small amounts of carbon. My results were dismal. Even leaving it over night. To soak. I did that method a few nights. It just did not "get under the carbon" or "loosen it up" or what ever other people have seen it do. I went back to my old method of other bore cleaners and just did the same ol thing I always do.

I should mention, that this was on a tikka factory barrel and a tikka mcgowan prefit. Who knows if the top tier barrels are different. It shouldn't be any different but who knows.

I had an take off barrel with lots of rounds and carbon, copper fouling. tried it with same results. really didnt get much out, had to do it outside, sprayed it down the bore. what really got it looking like new was thro clean. I tried this after i got a bore scope so i could see just how bad it was after using shooters choice and JB. ended up switching to bore tech and it does a better job every cleaning, then thro clean when it starts to build up. I had to do more strokes than the instructions say, 60 total.

 

[BoydAllen]

I have worked with Free All helping some fellows who have bore scopes deal with bad hard carbon problems. The thing that some who are posting here may not understand is that to use it to remove hard carbon is not a one and done deal. On the cases that I have helped with, multiple scrubbings were needed and the key has been giving the Free All at least 12 hours to soften the top layer of hard carbon, before scrubbing. For that scrubbing fellows have found that wrapping bronze wool to a tight fit on a nylon brush is advantageous because the nylon brush facilitates being able to reverse the brush with bronze wool in the bore. One fellow had over a thousand rounds through a .223 shooting Varget, only using a nylon brush and Hoppes #9 and patches. After buying a bore scope he discovered that he had hard black stuff all the way to the muzzle. As he went through multiple cleanings, using Free All over the course of a week or more, the black first came off nearest the muzzle and at the last in the throat. Every scrubbing was after leaving the barrel quite wet with Free All for at least 12 hours. The good news is that after getting the black out his barrel was restored to its former accuracy. I have worked with others for this sort of thing because I do not have any barrels that have hard carbon problems, because I have had the use of a bore scope, or owned one myself for many years, and I do not let things build up. For small amounts of hard carbon, I find that some work with IOSSO or more recently Thorroclean (a liquid IOSSO product) gets the job done, but for those who have long term accumulations, I do not want to scrub with an abrasive that much because part of that would be on clean portions of the barrel that I do not want to risk polishing, giving that a polished bore is undesirable because it would give copper fouling problems that could only be solved by relapping to a coarser finish.

 

[Dimner]

I have worked with Free All helping some fellows who have bore scopes deal with bad hard carbon problems. The thing that some who are posting here may not understand is that to use it to remove hard carbon is not a one and done deal. On the cases that I have helped with, multiple scrubbings were needed and the key has been giving the Free All at least 12 hours to soften the top layer of hard carbon, before scrubbing. For that scrubbing fellows have found that wrapping bronze wool to a tight fit on a nylon brush is advantageous because the nylon brush facilitates being able to reverse the brush with bronze wool in the bore. One fellow had over a thousand rounds through a .223 shooting Varget, only using a nylon brush and Hoppes #9 and patches. After buying a bore scope he discovered that he had hard black stuff all the way to the muzzle. As he went through multiple cleanings, using Free All over the course of a week or more, the black first came off nearest the muzzle and at the last in the throat. Every scrubbing was after leaving the barrel quite wet with Free All for at least 12 hours. The good news is that after getting the black out his barrel was restored to its former accuracy. I have worked with others for this sort of thing because I do not have any barrels that have hard carbon problems, because I have had the use of a bore scope, or owned one myself for many years, and I do not let things build up. For small amounts of hard carbon, I find that some work with IOSSO or more recently Thorroclean (a liquid IOSSO product) gets the job done, but for those who have long term accumulations, I do not want to scrub with an abrasive that much because part of that would be on clean portions of the barrel that I do not want to risk polishing, giving that a polished bore is undesirable because it would give copper fouling problems that could only be solved by relapping to a coarser finish.

That's a great summary and explanation of situations where free all can be helpful. I tried the multiple soaks and brushing, and it just wasn't for me. Too many days of scrubbing, too much effort, and too little removed. So I just went to iosso and got it done quick. However, the lesson learned is: Don't let hard carbon build up in the first place!

I'm not competing, and a .300 group would make my day. So in my application, I have no problem using iosso paste when needed. But when I need to use it, it means I was lazy in maintenance sometime before.

 

[CharlieNC]

I have worked with Free All helping some fellows who have bore scopes deal with bad hard carbon problems. The thing that some who are posting here may not understand is that to use it to remove hard carbon is not a one and done deal. On the cases that I have helped with, multiple scrubbings were needed and the key has been giving the Free All at least 12 hours to soften the top layer of hard carbon, before scrubbing. For that scrubbing fellows have found that wrapping bronze wool to a tight fit on a nylon brush is advantageous because the nylon brush facilitates being able to reverse the brush with bronze wool in the bore. One fellow had over a thousand rounds through a .223 shooting Varget, only using a nylon brush and Hoppes #9 and patches. After buying a bore scope he discovered that he had hard black stuff all the way to the muzzle. As he went through multiple cleanings, using Free All over the course of a week or more, the black first came off nearest the muzzle and at the last in the throat. Every scrubbing was after leaving the barrel quite wet with Free All for at least 12 hours. The good news is that after getting the black out his barrel was restored to its former accuracy. I have worked with others for this sort of thing because I do not have any barrels that have hard carbon problems, because I have had the use of a bore scope, or owned one myself for many years, and I do not let things build up. For small amounts of hard carbon, I find that some work with IOSSO or more recently Thorroclean (a liquid IOSSO product) gets the job done, but for those who have long term accumulations, I do not want to scrub with an abrasive that much because part of that would be on clean portions of the barrel that I do not want to risk polishing, giving that a polished bore is undesirable because it would give copper fouling problems that could only be solved by relapping to a coarser finish.

Yes, FA is not a do all / end all. It is a tool like other solvents, for me better than C4, which helps reduce the frequency necessary to remove hard carbon with an abrasive. And its by far the best powder smut solvent I have used.

 

[jelenko]

Too many days of scrubbing, too much effort, and too little removed. So I just went to iosso and got it done quick.

Me too.

 

[JEFFPPC]

So after you Free all guys are done try this. Now use some Iosso and tell me how much carbon you got out. You can tell the caked carbon on the patch from the chemical discoloration. If you think your getting it down quick, your decieving yourself. Now after all that leave Sweets in overnight. If you have NO blue, good job. Does it need to be this clean? If your doing it quick....it obviously doesn't. I think getting it clean helps extend barrel life if nothing else.

 

[BoydAllen]

So after you Free all guys are done try this. Now use some Iosso and tell me how much carbon you got out. You can tell the caked carbon on the patch from the chemical discoloration. If you think your getting it down quick, your decieving yourself. Now after all that leave Sweets in overnight. If you have NO blue, good job. Does it need to be this clean? If your doing it quick....it obviously doesn't. I think getting it clean helps extend barrel life if nothing else.

Many many years ago I pitted a cromoly barrel by accidentally leaving Sweets in it for a number of hours. After that I decided that since Sweets was the only solvent that posed that danger, and I could get the same job done with safer products, I discontinued using it.....permanently. My recommendation for knowing what the inside of your barrel looks like is to buy a Teslong bore scope. The one that I have cost me $55.

 

[JEFFPPC]

I have had a borescope for years. I should have specified stainless, thank you. Common sense. Does the Sweets instructions say only use x number of patch in a cleaning? No it doesn't. It says repeat if needed. No limit specified. Explain that, or think about it. I remember some idiot at an IBS match advising me when Montana Extreme came out to not use it because it would eat the throat out and destroy the barrel. How do these crazy ideas get started? From what I have learned and observed as long as you don't leave ammonia dry, so it does not form ammonia salt, no problem. And even if it does form the salt depending on the stainless it still might not cause a problem.

 

[BoydAllen]

I have had a borescope for years. I should have specified stainless, thank you. Common sense. Does the Sweets instructions say only use x number of patch in a cleaning? No it doesn't. It says repeat if needed. No limit specified. Explain that, or think about it. I remember some idiot at an IBS match advising me when Montana Extreme came out to not use it because it would eat the throat out and destroy the barrel. How do these crazy ideas get started? From what I have learned and observed as long as you don't leave ammonia dry, so it does not form ammonia salt, no problem. And even if it does form the salt depending on the stainless it still might not case a problem.

Here is a little story that you may find interesting. Back in the day a fellow named Merrill Martin wrote regularly for Precision Shooting Magazine. He was quite the experimenter, and I always enjoyed his writing. Back then borescopes with video camera attachments were big money, but he could afford one. Somewhere along the line he wrote that he could tell if a someone was cleaning his barrel with Sweets by borescope inspection, yes, a bold claim. Anyway, a fellow that I knew, that lived in Fresno, as I do, was putting on annual events that were called Prairie Dog Conferences. Shooters would be charged a fee for a package deal shooting prairie dogs at various locations, more than once, on an Indian reservation. In any case, Merrill attended one or more of these events, and after his statement about being able to spot barrels that had been cleaned with Sweets, wanting to stir the pot a bit, I suggested that he take his bore scope, video attachment, a monitor, and recorder to a conference and invite shooters to have their barrels scoped without telling them how they were cleaned, and that he should tell them if they had used Sweets. He did, and he did.....correctly. The fellow that put on the events was Chuck Cornett. Out of the collective fees he paid for the travel and lodging for a dozen name gun writers to each of the events. and the fellows who paid to come got the opportunity to shoot prairie dogs with them. Writers and all I believe that there may have been around 75 people involved. He also solicited a lot of door prizes from manufacturers, worth tens of thousands, for a drawing, that took place at the pitch fork steak barbeque that was included as part of the package. More than one shooter went home with a prize worth a lot more than his cost for the event.

 

[JEFFPPC]

Here is a little story that you may find interesting. Back in the day a fellow named Merrill Martin wrote regularly for Precision Shooting Magazine. He was quite the experimenter, and I always enjoyed his writing. Back then borescopes with video camera attachments were big money, but he could afford one. Somewhere along the line he wrote that he could tell if a someone was cleaning his barrel with Sweets by borescope inspection, yes, a bold claim. Anyway, a fellow that I knew, that lived in Fresno, as I do, was putting on annual events that were called Prairie Dog Conferences. Shooters would be charged a fee for a package deal shooting prairie dogs at various locations, more than once, on an Indian reservation. In any case, Merrill attended one or more of these events, and after his statement about being able to spot barrels that had been cleaned with Sweets, wanting to stir the pot a bit, I suggested that he take his bore scope, video attachment, a monitor, and recorder to a conference and invite shooters to have their barrels scoped without telling them how they were cleaned, and that he should tell them if they had used Sweets. He did, and he did.....correctly. The fellow that put on the events was Chuck Cornett. Out of the collective fees he paid for the travel and lodging for a dozen name gun writers to each of the events. and the fellows who paid to come got the opportunity to shoot prairie dogs with them. Writers and all I believe that there may have been around 75 people involved. He also solicited a lot of door prizes from manufacturers, worth tens of thousands, for a drawing, that took place at the pitch fork steak barbeque that was included as part of the package. More than one shooter went home with a prize worth a lot more than his cost for the event.

I have no doubt. They were the only ones copper free. Pretty elementary.

 

[BoydAllen]

I have no doubt. They were the only ones copper free. Pretty elementary.

Seriously, barrels cannot be cleaned properly without it?

 

[JEFFPPC]

Seriously, barrels cannot be cleaned properly without it?

I did not say that. I said it's my final check to see if the copper is all gone. I have shown numerous shooters their barrel they think is as clean as new.... is not. But more importantly is clean as new necessary to be competitive? I don't think so. I do believe a well cleaned barrel might stay competitive longer than one not meticulously maintained. The world today wants quick and easy and will generate any excuse to make it so, this I believe.

 

[PopCharlie]

I started using Free All after I saw Keith Glasscock's video (Winning in The Wind guy). I find that it works very well if I "scuff" the hard carbon with JBs before using Free All.

PopCharlie

 

[rlporter507]

next take off barrel i get i will try the soak method. I did leave it in only about 10 minutes. As with the thro clean, my first use i did the 15 strokes like the instructions said, and was not impressed. but after watching John's video, i did it again and was!

 

[Dimner]

I did not say that. I said it's my final check to see if the copper is all gone. I have shown numerous shooters their barrel they think is as clean as new.... is not. But more importantly is clean as new necessary to be competitive? I don't think so. I do believe a well cleaned barrel might stay competitive longer than one not meticulously maintained. The world today wants quick and easy and will generate and excuse to make it so, this I believe.

I don't think clean as new is necessary, but it's the only realistic baseline a shooter has that can be used to ensure consistency.

Consistency is everything. And I have not found a way to be able to return a barrel to a pre defined 'fouled' state. All we have in our tool box is a clean as new bore and then go from there.

 

[rebs]

Two hours at the most, after 70 rounds of open F/Class, Either Wipe-Patch Out or Bore-Tech takes 6-10 patches to get the carbon out. Then another 15-20 patches to get the all the copper out. Both very good products, IMHO.

are you using Boretech carbon remover or the eliminator ?

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Free All does seem to work pretty well IME, but the common denominator seems to be some level of scrubbing/scoring the carbon. That's why I use a bronze brush. Whatever carbon solvent I'm using, I find them best to be applied with several strokes of a brush, followed by soak time. I don't think this is complicated at all, just score the carbon so that the solvent can get into and under it. Copper is a different story but I get to it after the carbon is mostly out, so the copper cleaner can actually get to the copper.

There's probably a thousand way to get there but this works well for me. I use abrasive cleaners, but sparingly and not every time.