Fraud, they finally got me (Not this Forum)

[nakneker]

They finally got me. I have over a combined total of 1200 transactions on 4 platforms, never been burned.
I put out a WTB ad, got a few responses. Ended up buying two items. One transaction was legit. The second was fraudulent. After our initial contact the fraudulent party provided a copy of their drivers license, their concealed weapons permit and their FFL. At that point I let me guard down and proceeded with a 300.00 dollar transaction. I won’t bore you with the details but the short of the story is he tried to sell me another item and I insisted we complete the first transaction before doing more. When it was time for a tracking number he went dark, it went from answering emails within a hour to flatline silence. After 4-5 days I looked up the FFL, it is active, then I looked up his name (The name on the DL &CCW) and found a phone number to call. I called, talked to a nice guy who then put me in contact with the guy I was looking for. He confirmed my suspicion, he said they about got him too.

What did I do wrong? The biggest thing I did wrong is I didn't make the phone call before sending the funds. Forum boss has said it over and over and over. Second thing I should have done is asked for a picture with a date or something current. Firearm enthusiasts and knife enthusiasts are some of the best people I’ve met in general. I figured I had what I needed with the FFL, DL and CCW. I only share this to help others who may run into a similar circumstance, I’d be slow to let your guard down right now.

 

[AckleymanII]

Some people can not post pictures on line, but they can with their phone!

 

[hoz53]

They finally got me. I have over a combined total of 1200 transactions on 4 platforms, never been burned.
I put out a WTB ad, got a few responses. Ended up buying two items. One transaction was legit. The second was fraudulent. After our initial contact the fraudulent party provided a copy of their drivers license, their concealed weapons permit and their FFL. At that point I let me guard down and proceeded with a 300.00 dollar transaction. I won’t bore you with the details but the short of the story is he tried to sell me another item and I insisted we complete the first transaction before doing more. When it was time for a tracking number he went dark, it went from answering emails within a hour to flatline silence. After 4-5 days I looked up the FFL, it is active, then I looked up his name (The name on the DL &CCW) and found a phone number to call. I called, talked to a nice guy who then put me in contact with the guy I was looking for. He confirmed my suspicion, he said they about got him too.

What did I do wrong? The biggest thing I did wrong is I didn't make the phone call before sending the funds. Forum boss has said it over and over and over. Second thing I should have done is asked for a picture with a date or something current. Firearm enthusiasts and knife enthusiasts are some of the best people I’ve met in general. I figured I had what I needed with the FFL, DL and CCW. I only share this to help others who may run into a similar circumstance, I’d be slow to let your guard down right now.

Sorry to hear this happened nakneker. Wow though 1200 transactions. Youre a busy buyer. Ive had a few where they get my CC # and charge items to my card but not with a transaction where i agreed to buy something from someone. knock on wood -i been lucky- It sure never hurts to be reminded to stay vigilant. Thanks

 

[joshb]

Sorry to hear. I considered you as one of the smarter guys here. Well, I still do. Given the stats, your average is good. Keep an eye out for the curve ball in the future. Maintain vigilance. These scammers are getting good at their game.

Edit: I recently walked out on thin ice by buying a gun on Gunbroker. I “really” wanted the gun so I did a bunch of investigation on the seller before I bid. Checked and verified FFL status and finally found a phone number to call. That did it for me and I placed my bid but still was a little nervous so I paid the extra 3% and used a credit card.(I have one with a low limit, just for online purchases).
The gun came in and was just as described, so all is good.

 

[338 Mollett]

I hate to see any of my Brothers get burned !

 

[bluealtered]

I'm sorry about the fraud. Thank you for sharing with us to keep our guard up.

 

[Forum Boss]

Sorry for the loss. Please tell me if the bad guy was registered here.

VOICE PHONE CALL ALWAYS!!
In the last 5 years I am aware of only one fraud from our Classifieds where the buyer made the VOICE PHONE CALL. But even in that case the call was to a real retail shop employee, so the scam seller was later identified and arrested.

PHONE Tip: If when you call the provided number, you get Google Voice or some other forwarding service, be very, very, very suspicious. Personally if I called and got Google Voice I would forget the transaction.

DEMAND Custom Photos ALWAYS!!
People read this, but they don't seem to get it. Don't just ask for a photo with a piece of paper with the day's date. The scammers will photoshop that instantly. I can't believe that people will ask for a custom photo, and then they get the SAME photo with a photoshopped overlay and they say "Oh, that's OK". Don't be a fool.

When asking for a custom photo, ensure that you require the object to be photographed in a different location, different light, different angle. Require the seller to interact with the sale item (unbox it, put something on it).

Example for a scope sale: Tell the seller to tie a rope or ribbon around the scope, then put the scope on the dashboard of his vehicle for the custom photo. The seller cannot do this if he does not possess the scope. For custom photo always -- Different location, different angle, something extra in photo that physically connects with the object sold.

BEWARE Non Members!!
WTB listings invite scammers. If the person responding is NOT a member of this Forum, be VERY wary. Even if he IS a member, look at the sign-up date. If someone is responding in the first 30 days of membership, that is against our rules. Notify me and I will ban that person permanently.

There are also darn good reasons to only do transactions with paying members with previous Trader History. The purchase of a membership requires requires a valid personal check, active PayPal account, or valid CC account.

NEVER EVER Pay with PayPal Friends & Family!! NEVER!! Got that?!
The defrauded party here paid via PayPal Friends & Family, despite our emphatic, repeated cautions to NEVER EVER do that. You have NO protections, and you are violating PayPal rules. Why do people still do this -- I simply don't get it...

Consider Paying for Background Check Services
You may want to subscribe to Spokeo.com. This service allows you to background check using a name + state, or phone number, or email. If you Spokeo search a phone number or email and there are no findings, be very suspicious.

About Scopes
I recommend that members buy scopes new. Optics are probably the #1 item pushed by scammers (because guns have to go through FFLs). On a $1500.00 optic, don't take the risk of losing all your money to save a couple hundred. Buy new so you are assured the optic is perfect and you also have the best warranty.

 

[nakneker]

Sorry for the loss. Please tell me if the bad guy was registered here.

VOICE PHONE CALL ALWAYS!!
In the last 5 years I am aware of only one fraud from our Classifieds where the buyer made the VOICE PHONE CALL. But even in that case the call was to a real retail shop employee, so the scam seller was later identified and arrested.

PHONE Tip: If when you call the provided number, you get Google Voice or some other forwarding service, be very, very, very suspicious. Personally if I called and got Google Voice I would forget the transaction.

DEMAND Custom Photos ALWAYS!!
People read this, but they don't seem to get it. Don't just ask for a photo with a piece of paper with the day's date. The scammers will photoshop that instantly. I can't believe that people will ask for a custom photo, and then they get the SAME photo with a photoshopped overlay and they say "Oh, that's OK". Don't be a fool.

When asking for a custom photo, ensure that you require the object to be photographed in a different location, different light, different angle. Require the seller to interact with the sale item (unbox it, put something on it).

Example for a scope sale: Tell the seller to tie a rope or ribbon around the scope, then put the scope on the dashboard of his vehicle for the custom photo. The seller cannot do this if he does not possess the scope. For custom photo always -- Different location, different angle, something extra in photo that physically connects with the object sold.

BEWARE Non Members!!
WTB listings invite scammers. If the person responding is NOT a member of this Forum, be VERY wary. Even if he IS a member, look at the sign-up date. If someone is responding in the first 30 days of membership, that is against our rules. Notify me and I will ban that person permanently.

There are also darn good reasons to only do transactions with paying members with previous Trader History. The purchase of a membership requires requires a valid personal check, active PayPal account, or valid CC account.

Consider Paying for Background Check Services
You may want to subscribe to Spokeo.com. This service allows you to background check using a name + state, or phone number, or email. If you Spokeo search a phone number or email and there are no findings, be very suspicious.

About Scopes
I recommend that members buy scopes new. Optics are probably the #1 item pushed by scammers (because guns have to go through FFLs). On a $1500.00 optic, don't take the risk of losing all your money to save a couple hundred. Buy new so you are assured the optics is perfect and you also have the best warranty.

Bad guy wasn’t registered here, I sent a detailed description of what happened along with the documents he sent me via email. thanks boss!

 

[nakneker]

Sorry to hear. I considered you as one of the smarter guys here. Well, I still do. Given the stats, your average is good. Keep an eye out for the curve ball in the future. Maintain vigilance. These scammers are getting good at their game.

Edit: I recently walked out on thin ice by buying a gun on Gunbroker. I “really” wanted the gun so I did a bunch of investigation on the seller before I bid. Checked and verified FFL status and finally found a phone number to call. That did it for me and I placed my bid but still was a little nervous so I paid the extra 3% and used a credit card.(I have one with a low limit, just for online purchases).
The gun came in and was just as described, so all is good.

I‘ve been fortunate enough to avert several thieves in the past. Just got too complacent this time around, everything checked out so I didn’t make the phone call. That’s the point of this post I guess, I usually do make a call unless I’ve dealt with the person in the past. I’m just glad it was a small loss, if it would have been a bigger dollar value I wouldn’t have taken the chance, I gambled, I lost.

 

[Lucky Shooter]

This stranger-stranger buying and selling has to break down to trust.
Our custom is the buyer most always has to send the money before
the seller will ship the goods.

Why can't this work the other way around ? I've asked the seller to
look at my trader history and send the goods first-----when I had
doubts about the seller.

Some complied, some tried to negotiate a money-first deal and some
totally disappeared.

If you have a few bucks, there'll always be somebody out there who'd
love to beat you out of it.

As the man said-----use all available precautions.

A. Weldy

 

[Dave M.]

Some people can not post pictures on line, but they can with their phone!

Makes no difference if you use your home computer or your phone. ONLINE IS ONLINE. How the picture gets online doesn’t matter.
Dave

 

[K22]

After my computer was hacked, I went into "ostrich" mode.  I'm a dinosaur anyway so it wasn't difficult for me.

I only buy online from well-known and established suppliers such as Blue-Collar Reloading and Midway. I pay only with a credit card that has full fraud liability protection.

I get at least one scam call a day sometimes two. I screen all my calls and only pick up if I know the caller. The same with emails. Lot of bad actors out there - it's a multi-billion theft industry according to AARP.

Be careful.

 

[Straightshooter1]

After my computer was hacked, I went into "ostrich" mode.  I'm a dinosaur anyway so it wasn't difficult for me.

I only buy online from well-known and established suppliers such as Blue-Collar Reloading and Midway. I pay only with a credit card that has full fraud liability protection.

I get at least one scam call a day sometimes two. I screen all my calls and only pick up if I know the caller. The same with emails. Lot of bad actors out there - it's a multi-billion theft industry according to AARP.

Be careful.

Picked up a call where a guy told me he had a buyer for my timeshare that would pay me $22,000 for it. All I had to do is send him $750 (either credit card or Western Union). Well, at my age, I've been around the block many, many times, so I knew what was going on right away. Rather than hang up on him, I thought I'd have a little fun. I made him an offer that whatever he could sell my timeshare for, I guaranteed him I'd pay him 10% of the sale. For a sale of $22,000, that's $2,200 in your pocket instead of $750. He insisted he needed the $750 up front, and I insisted my offer is the only deal that was going to happen. He called me back a couple more times trying to get me to send the money first, to which I ignored his plea and I simply told him to sell my timeshare to that buyer and he'll get the $2,200 at closing. It took him a while to realize I was wasting his time (exactly what I was trying to do) and I never heard from him again.

 

[K22]

Picked up a call where a guy told me he had a buyer for my timeshare that would pay me $22,000 for it. All I had to do is send him $750 (either credit card or Western Union). Well, at my age, I've been around the block many, many times, so I knew what was going on right away. Rather than hang up on him, I thought I'd have a little fun. I made him an offer that whatever he could sell my timeshare for, I guaranteed him I'd pay him 10% of the sale. For a sale of $22,000, that's $2,200 in your pocket instead of $750. He insisted he needed the $750 up front, and I insisted my offer is the only deal that was going to happen. He called me back a couple more times trying to get me to send the money first, to which I ignored his plea and I simply told him to sell my timeshare to that buyer and he'll get the $2,200 at closing. It took him a while to realize I was wasting his time (exactly what I was trying to do) and I never heard from him again.

Smart move, I never buy anything over the phone unless I initiate the contact and then only with established, we known businesses.

You wouldn't believe some of the crazy schemes the bad guys have tried to get me to hook on to.

 

[hoz53]

Bad guy wasn’t registered here, I sent a detailed description of what happened along with the documents he sent me via email. thanks boss!

i didnt use to call so much but now if i get the # i always do even if its for something selling for 50 bucks. most of the time its another shooter and i have an interesting conversation with them in addition to helping confirm the deal is legit.

 

[nakneker]

i didnt use to call so much but now if i get the # i always do even if its for something selling for 50 bucks. most of the time its another shooter and i have an interesting conversation with them in addition to helping confirm the deal is legit.

That’s where I am now too. Sad it has to be that way but it is what it is I guess.

 

[hoz53]

That’s where I am now too. Sad it has to be that way but it is what it is I guess.

really i enjoy talking to other shooters most of the time so it has been a good thing overall.