forster bushing bump neck die

[wolfman]

Has anyone tried these dies? I'm currently running unturned Lapua cases into a redding body die, and then through a S neck die, and then finally a Lee collet. I'd like to consolidate the body and S operation into one, and the two choices seem to be the Forster or a Redding FL Type S. The Forster is quite a bit cheaper, and my experience w/ Forster quality compared to Redding was been better. Any one have first hand experience to share?

 

[TheBlueEyedBear]

I agree with what you want to do.. Good idea! What I do is load up a few rounds, fire them a couple times, then send three cases to Neil Jones for a set of custom dies. It isn't the cheapest way to go, but after selling the original dies in the classified section it's not too bad. And, you have a set of the best dies money can buy.
Check out his site: http://www.neiljones.com/

[font=arial,helvetica,univers,zurich bt]FULL LENGTH SIZING DIE[/font]

[/t][/t][/t] [/t] [/t][/t] [SIZE=-1][font=arial,helvetica,univers,zurich bt]The Die's Sizing Insert is Custom Bored to Resize Your Fired Case to Optimimum Chambring Dimensions... Eliminating Excessive Stretching and Stress. [/font][/SIZE] [/t][/t][/t] [SIZE=-1][font=arial,helvetica,univers,zurich bt]We Use One of Your Fired Rounds to Determine the Correct Finished Dimensions. [/font][/SIZE] [SIZE=-1][font=arial,helvetica,univers,zurich bt]Uniform Headspace Maintained with Our Combined Sizing/Shoulder Bump Bushing. [/font][/SIZE] [SIZE=-1][font=arial,helvetica,univers,zurich bt].050" of Adjustment per Revolution of the Micro-Dial. Each Engraved Increment Line Equals .00125" (1-1/4 Thousand). [/font][/SIZE] [SIZE=-1][font=arial,helvetica,univers,zurich bt]Our Die Will Not Scratch Your Cases... it Rockwell's out at 60-62. [/font][/SIZE] Barry

 

[camac]

I agree 100% with BlueEyedBear. Nothing will beat a custom die but I have also found a spot in my reloading cupboard for the forster bump and neck die. Especially if you are still experimenting with neck tension (I always seem to be). I have some redding competition neck dies too but have tuned up the forster to do as good a job. As with any of these neck bushing dies you will probably have a little runout if you one step neck size them with standard bushings. But I set mine up to bump and final neck size in my second run through. I found you can accurately set the bump by either using the redding comp shell holders or some shim material between shell holder and die (2-4 thou for all mine.) and set the bushing depth seperately (ensure backed off a bit though). They are excellent value for money with the two dies in one. If you want to accurise them a bit and go for a one step neck size you can put a slight lead in taper into the bushing.

I am a little perplexed as to why you would use the Lee collet die after neck sizing though? Nothing against the Lee die - they are excellent but they do not "straighten" a round after neck sizing. They just squeeze in slightly whatever the neck runout is. With properly tuned neck bushings this step can be avoided also. Or alternatavely just use the body die and lee die you already have (if you are happy with the neck tension of the Lee).

 

[RJinTexas]

The only complaint I have with my Forster bump dies are that I'm restricted to using only Forster bushings. IMO they could have done us all a great service if they would have designed them so that we could utilize our Redding TiNi bushing or their's, I'm sure it would have help increased their popularity as well as their sales.

Regards
RJ

 

[NorCalMikie]

Got the Forster Bushing Bump die in 6BR. Works like a champ. Also got a redding "body die" for a quick pass "when needed". (maybe every 5th. or 6th. firing if the case gets snug in the chamber)
Picked up a "extra" set of bushings to do my 22 BR as well out of the same die.
Never had any problems and my brass is still going strong after maybe 15 firings. Shoulder bump maybe .0015 and size the neck. Spend the extra $$ on a custom die if you want but the Forster BBD works like a champ.

 

[camac]

The only complaint I have with my Forster bump dies are that I'm restricted to using only Forster bushings. IMO they could have done us all a great service if they would have designed them so that we could utilize our Redding TiNi bushing or their's, I'm sure it would have help increased their popularity as well as their sales.

Regards
RJ

RJ - My Redding Nitride bushes fit in my Forster with very nice tolerances

 

[NorCalMikie]

Guys: I've been wrong before. I went out and measured my bushings. The Redding bushings measure .500 and the Forster bushings measure .490. The redding bushings will drop in the die but won't go past the step in the die so they won't go all the way to the bottom. My guess is they won't work?? I havn't tried but with them not seating at the bottom of the die, my guess is that they won't work? All the bushings I have for the Forster die are "Forster".
Getting old kinda sucks at times. (I'll go to my room now) :-[

 

[Gearheadpyro]

I have a bump die and love it. It sets the shoulder back just enough that I don't have to full length size. I've got 6 firings on some of my .308's, never been FL sized. They still chamber fine and shoot accurately.

I bump .001-.002" each time I reload, and I size the neck down just over 1/2 way.

 

[camac]

Guys: I've been wrong before. I went out and measured my bushings. The Redding bushings measure .500 and the Forster bushings measure .490. The redding bushings will drop in the die but won't go past the step in the die so they won't go all the way to the bottom. My guess is they won't work?? I havn't tried but with them not seating at the bottom of the die, my guess is that they won't work? All the bushings I have for the Forster die are "Forster".
Getting old kinda sucks at times. (I'll go to my room now) :-[

No you're not getting old - I forgot this time. I remember being quite pleased with the redding bushings as they are a nice tight fit in my forster dies but had forgotten that I put the beveled edge on them. I have taken a photo (just got to post it somehow) of some 6.5*284 shells necked down to 6mm (268 redding bushing) so it is easier to see the neck reduction. Without the bevel they pull up about 90 thou short of neck /shoulder junction (OK if you have a long neck and leave a fair bit of neck unsized) and with Bevel are similar to the forster and pull up about 30 thou short. They are a nice tight fit in mine with very tight tolerance.

 

[xtightg]

I tried the Forsters neck sizing bushing bump die on my Lapua .243 brass.
My groups opened way out the die appeared to created a doughnut inside the bottom of the neck.
I put the poor grouping down to inconsistent neck tension.
Redding Comp bullet seating die used to seat the projectiles, I could feel the doughnut.
Went back to my lee collet die with new brass almost one hole again at 100 yards.
I use the Redding Competition Bushing Die set for my .308 Win Sako TRG 22, no complaints.
This is only my opinion and experience.

 

[wolfman]

Thanks for the insight folks. I've been doing the bushing then collet sizing thing in an attempt to get the neck down just below where I want it, and then letting the collet act as an expander. My thinking is that if I don't turn necks, I'd rather put any inconsistancies out on the outside of the neck. I managed to grab the Forster .308 kit- die and three bushings- on Ebay for $44 delivered, so I figure it's worth trying!

 

[camac]

xtightg - One of the "joys" of using any neck bushing or neck die without expander is "donuts". The cost of using them is vigilence against this and I try and ensure the base of the bullet is above the donut ring (or where you neck size to). All Lee would have to do to capture much more market is to put out some undersize and oversize mandrels to cater for neck tension experimentation. I made a few for my .308 last year and they work great.
Wolfman - great price and in my opinion great die. I am not sure how the Lee collett die would "handle" donuts either though as I imagine it would only squeeze in at that point and leave the rest a little "loose". If you use a neck bushing in combination with this then still watch for the dreaded donut. Alternatively you can put an expander button on the Forster neck bushing die. I occasionally swap them in and out from my FL dies for different purposes and am working on building some with a nice long slow taper in. This will save you another step in the process to give you a one stop shop. If the neck tension is low then the expander button will not do much to runout on the way back through (certainly similar amount or less than using the Lee as an expander). Also make sure ball is adjusted up just below neck so neck is still substantially in neck bushing when button starts to do its work (without being too high and jamming).

My computer is now shutting down every time I go to put a picture on. I will try from another.

 

[camac]

photo of redding .268 bushing and two shells resized with it in Forster 6.5x 284 die. Bottom shell has bushing up normal way (90 thou from neck shoulder junction). Top shell gets to within 30 thou of base of neck with bevel down. My bushings are same measurements as yours Norcalmikie. inside my forster measures at 0.500 as well - so tight squeeze but does work - Oh I also use spacer on top to push it down as redding are shorter.

 

[Mikem]

I tried the Forsters neck sizing bushing bump die on my Lapua .243 brass.
My groups opened way out the die appeared to created a doughnut inside the bottom of the neck.
I put the poor grouping down to inconsistent neck tension.
Redding Comp bullet seating die used to seat the projectiles, I could feel the doughnut.
Went back to my lee collet die with new brass almost one hole again at 100 yards.
I use the Redding Competition Bushing Die set for my .308 Win Sako TRG 22, no complaints.
This is only my opinion and experience.

Donuts dont appear from one resizing, are you comparing well used brass with donuts, to new brass?

I have a Forester Bump die, and think there great, I also use it on 22BR and 6BR, and only size about 90% of the neck, to minimize the donut problem, but haven't found any accuracy degradation that I could put on to the dies. I also have Redding dies, and both brands are top notch. But the bump feature makes thing easier and no problems with case headspace, tight bolt etc, I also bump about .0015.
Mike.

 

[cfrazier77]

Are "donuts" a problem when only half of the neck is resized?

 

[NorCalMikie]

The "donut" seems to show up at the base on the neck/shoulder junction. I've never had them show up on any of my cases. If you're loading a boat tail bullet and arn't seating them too deep in the neck, I don't think you'll have a problem. My shooting buddy had a few that caused problems while loading but I'am not sure what bullet he was using. He had a hard time pulling the bullets so I'am guessing that was the problem. A flat base bullet could end up hitting the donut if you seat it that far into the case?? Some folks end up reaming the case necks to get rid of the donut.
If you're not seating that deep, I don't think there would be a problem.

 

[RJinTexas]

photo of redding .268 bushing and two shells resized with it in Forster 6.5x 284 die. Bottom shell has bushing up normal way (90 thou from neck shoulder junction). Top shell gets to within 30 thou of base of neck with bevel down. My bushings are same measurements as yours Norcalmikie. inside my forster measures at 0.500 as well - so tight squeeze but does work - Oh I also use spacer on top to push it down as redding are shorter.

camac, what do you use for a spacer to sit on top of your Redding bushing is it something that you must machine or just a commercially made washer and what is the thickness.

Thanks
RJ

 

[NorCalMikie]

camac: Does the Redding bushing go all the way to the bottom where the Forster bushing fits? Or you just sizing the top portion of the neck? I havn't tried yet and you have so I'am curious.

And RJ: If you were to place a larger ID bushing on top of the Redding bushing??? But if the Redding bushing won't seat all the way to the bottom of the Forster die, it wouldn't make any difference. You still can't size the full length of the neck if the bushing won't go all the way to down. (no matter what you put on top)

 

[camac]

RJ - I machined my own spacer 125 thou thick (doesn't need to be this thick) but you could just use another neck bushing, only you might have trouble getting the reach with your decapping pin assembly.
NorCalMike - The beveled edge on bottom allows it to almost get to bottom. Hard to see in the photo but the top shell was sized to within 30 thou of neck / shoulder junction. Without the bevel it only got within 90 thou. This works for both my Forster dies but I have had a Private message to say they don't fit on someone elses. Maybe Forster had a little bit of variance here?? Would be good if others could try and post there findings as well.
cfrazier66 - donuts form wherever you neck size to. halfway, 3/4 or at base of neck. As Norcalmike indicated it only matters if you seat the bullet past this so the donut is pushed out and can "jam" on bullet when chambered. It can occur if you still neck size all the neck but tends to interfere less if down in shoulder section. It is also much less of a drama if using a tapered bushing.