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First swim in the "deep end" and a question.

joshb,

Did ole hogpatrol sit over at a distance, eating popcorn and eyeballing you?

I agree with ShootDots; less "tension/interference" seems to help seating force to be consistent, as does more uniform neck wall thickness. At least in my experience, they seem to help. Once I had fairly consistent seating force sorted out, then, sorting bullets with a Bob Green comparator really helped me a lot to hit my targeted head to ogive length in a single pass through the seater die.

Actually, Hogpatrol was very nice and supportive. He walked over, gave me some good pointers and went back to his shooting. In hindsight, I may have been a little rude. I didn't stop over to his bench, look over his gun and show interest. I got "involved" and forgot my manners.
 
Actually, Hogpatrol was very nice and supportive. He walked over, gave me some good pointers and went back to his shooting. In hindsight, I may have been a little rude. I didn't stop over to his bench, look over his gun and show interest. I got "involved" and forgot my manners.

Never took it that way. You had your hands full with your shooting partner and the "arsenal" you brought with you. :p:D. Aside from that, it was really nice to see your stocks in the flesh. They were impressive to say the least. Sir, you are a true craftsman.
Agree with Ben on the neck tension. .004 is tight and depending on the neck size, could be working the brass unnecessarily.
 
Thanks, Dale. While I was shooting, I could feel your "presence":rolleyes:. Just a little pressure. What did you think of the kid? I took him under my wing when he was 8 years old. We've gone thru some bumps and scrapes over the years. I tried to get him interested in college but it wasn't for him. He joined the Army and served as an MP for a few tours. He's got his feet square on the ground now. Just a fine guy. He's the one that likes the boomers.
On the neck tension: I'm going to go lighter and try that. Also, tho I do my annealing on a Benchsource, I'll try skipping a few cycles and see what happens.
On the "arsenal":
First time out for that 30br. Had to figure out loads.
2nd time out for the 223 Tikka/Brux. First time out, I had an old LC case head separate and blow my ejector. Got some new Lapua for it so I'm starting from scratch, again.
The 308 was an old Remmy 5r I put in the stock from the stock building thread. Had to sight that in.
The 6.5-47 is a work in progress. Third time out with that one.
 
39.3 4350 with a 123 seems pretty light,,,they might hold together better at 500 if you drive them a little faster,,

I shoot the 130 VLD and 40 grs 4350 works good up close but at 1,000 I run up to 42.2

work up depending on freebore and your rifle,,
 
I haven't shot any Bergers in over a year but never could get consistent seating depth without sorting them for length.
 
Well, between my chores, I cast my chamber and got .2935. My loaded brass runs .2905-.2915. A little tight for my taste so I'm going to turn them down to .2895 and load with the .288 bushing. I also have a .287 to test. See what that does, along with some sorted bullets. I'll do a whole new charge test with it along with a test with Varget. I usually load on the lighter side but I'll run up to the hotter side and see what happens. Thanks for all the input, guys.

Josh
 
No, I don't have any Scenars. Maybe I'll grab some, thanks. I spent the last 2 hours going over everything. I cleaned and reset my seating die. I've been using a .288 bushing, giving me 3-4 thousands neck tension. Might be too much and causing my seating problem. I'm going to order a .289 and .290. I anneal every cycle. Meanwhile, I'll start sorting bullets.
I've got some 123 scenars laying around here, let me know how many you need for testing and we can make a deal. They are the remains of a case of 1000 so all the same lot
 
Yup. Kinda what all the experts say, too. One of the reasons I told my story. I thought I had a "good load". I need to read and shoot more.;) Been spending too much time in the shop.
It’s my belief that there are no loads that shoot well at 100 and “fall apart” at longer distance. Rather, it is the shooter that tends to fall apart at longer range.

A bullet is never less stable than when it first leaves the muzzle up to the transonic speed. If a load truly hammers at 100y (with a large sample of 2x10 shot groups or more) then any “falling apart” at distance isn’t the load.

Either that or the load was not as good as you thought because you anointed it on just a group or two of 3 or 5 shots.
 
Load up some of your match rounds and try it one more time. Maybe it was just having your son and hogpatrol there. I’m not saying any of the Advice is wrong from the other post, just sometimes on this forum here the shooter can have a bad day. I’m living proof of this.
Good luck,
Jason
 
It’s my belief that there are no loads that shoot well at 100 and “fall apart” at longer distance. Rather, it is the shooter that tends to fall apart at longer range.

A bullet is never less stable than when it first leaves the muzzle up to the transonic speed. If a load truly hammers at 100y (with a large sample of 2x10 shot groups or more) then any “falling apart” at distance isn’t the load.

Either that or the load was not as good as you thought because you anointed it on just a group or two of 3 or 5 shots.
Ya...thanks...

I keep telling myself "its the load, its the load, its Not me, its not me!"
 
Good one , @snert . Kind of like , "Where the Hell did that round come from" ? As you look at a high 9 .
I do all of my basic load work-up at 100 , and do the adjustments until I get five groups , of five rounds touching at 100 yrds. Then it's straight to the 600 yrd. line . Been working so far . If you are shooting VLD type bullets , check your "stem" to insure that you have clearance between the tip and the stem , and the bullet is actually seating by the Ogive , rather than a being seated by the tip . That will also cause inconsistencies in seating depth .

As far as the "Munchkins" are concerned , I'm a identical twin . And you have no idea what's coming your way . So good luck with that . ;):D:D:D
 
It’s my belief that there are no loads that shoot well at 100 and “fall apart” at longer distance. Rather, it is the shooter that tends to fall apart at longer range.

A bullet is never less stable than when it first leaves the muzzle up to the transonic speed. If a load truly hammers at 100y (with a large sample of 2x10 shot groups or more) then any “falling apart” at distance isn’t the load.

Either that or the load was not as good as you thought because you anointed it on just a group or two of 3 or 5 shots.
This is not true. I have seen many loads that would shoot in the low 1's at 100 yards yards and wouldn't shoot under 13 inches at 1000. Most the time it is vertical, even though the ES is down around 2 to 3. Another load in the same gun with a bigger ES, maybe around 10 would shoot 3/8 or so MOA at 100 and would shoot 3 to 4 inch nice round 10 shot groups at 1000. Now these were heavy guns used for 1000 yard BR and would actually show the difference. I believe it has to do with how quickly the bullet settles down. But I have seen it many times with different barrels, cartridges and bullets. Matt
 
Thanks, Nick. I'm still having a problem with bearing surface differences affecting seating depth. The seater stem pushes on the same spot of every bullet to the same depth, with a quality die of course. How could a difference in length of the bullet affect that? I'm stuck!
Just spit balling here but if you think about the process a difference in length of bearing surface would absolutely change friction and the amount of pressure it takes to seat therefore that would translate in different lengths unless you adjusted the pressure with each bullet to suit its length
 
I had issues a while back getting consistent seating depth for my 308 Palma rifle. I tried everything but couldn't figure it out.
So next I checked the bullets and found a 10 to 30 thou difference between bullets. So I went to check the other 500 of the same and again large difference in ogive to base of the bullet. But I noticed there were 3 distinct groups of measured bullets and and within each group they were very uniform.

Long story short now I always check and sorting my long range bullets.

I load develop at 100 and always verify groups at 300. Usually if they are still holding consistent at 300 they will hold up further out.

I also shoot like 10 to 20 shot groups when verifying my loads.

Just my experiences.

Nick
My experience exactly. Haven’t checked the Berger 130 hunting my son uses. They shoot so well I don’t see the need.
 

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