First Rimfire

[BobWill]

Long story short: Went to the local gun club to site in the 12 gauge slug gun. There was a man concentrating on an odd looking gun (with lots of extra toys and accessories). Not wanting to interrupt him, I waited for a break to strike up a conversation and feel him out. Next thing you know I am sitting at the bench sighting in this AWESOME rimfire gun. Pulled the trigger, knocked the bulls eye out of the park and I AM HOOKED.

Now what? It is highly unlikely that I find find my final gun today. I know, what are your goals: competition, fun, local? Not really sure where it will take me.

I have been lurking and it seems as though a CZ 455 Varmit might be a good gun. Put a $200 scope on it and I will be shooting. But wait. What if I got a good 40X for $1,000. Put a $200 scope on it, and build on it later? Or what about that gun that is already to go, barrel, scope, trigger, etc for $2,000?

Tough decisions, I was hoping that someone would share their experiences and route that they took and what they would do different.

Thanks,
Bob

 

[bozo699]

Bob,
I am the wrong guy to talk to about rimfire rifles, I have a cooper and a Kimber I like really well, and a Winchester 75 that shoots pretty good but for top accuracy those rimfire guy's are just as serious as us centerfire guy's when it comes to components and equipment, if you don't get the answer you are looking for here try rimfire central forum, I just saw it was your first post and wanted to be the first to welcome you to the forum,....Welcome to the forum, ENJOY
Wayne.

 

[Shynloco]

Ah yes, the desease of Rimfire Rifles. I know of that ailment and the tough decisions that will be forthcoming. I'd been shooting rifles of all sorts for over 47 years when a friend who I shoot Benchrest rifles with, talked me into sitting down behind his Benchrest .22 Rimfire. Big mistake on my part, at least for the sake of my bank account getting drained. But he suggested I not go hog wild, but consider buying a Savage BV model, which after several sessions of testing various ammo, was incredibly accurate with the "good stuff." And then after shooting that for a few months and trying out some other makes/models, quickly found that for the money (the BV was $340 without the scope) Savages were hard to beat as a rifle right out of the box for accuracy. Now sure there were other make/models that were nice, CZ, Remington 40X and even some of the nice custom rigs for like $3500 - $5,000 (which I can't afford so I shot some buddies rifles). So next I bought another Savage this time a TR that felt even better than the wooden BV model stock and had a better/lighter trigger and again shot in credible groups @50 yds with the "proper" Match Ammo. But the desease got even worse despite the warning by my wife, stay the hell out of the gun store! But then one nice day I got a phone call from my buddy that cause all my financial grief. He told me he was at the local gun store and that a new Anschutz 64 MPR had just arrived and that it was "SWEET." SO somehow, the car I was driving went out of control and drove me straight to the gun store my wife tried to warn me about. So there I got to hold this Anschutz that I'd read quit abit about and it felt like....OH MY GOSH...sooooooooooooooooooo nice. Needless to say I became about $1150 poorer almost instantly, not to mention I was now in deep kaka with my wife for sure. But at the range, this Anschutz made me look REALLY good. And in subsequent weeks to come, I was winning local Rimfire competitions and learned that Anschutz, Lapua and Federal had to be in cahoots because that rifle loves that expensibve Match ammo that all the bigs boys like to use on their $5,000+ match Rimfires. SO for this old retired fart, whose eyes aren't what they once were, but still loves to shoot for accuracy, is quite happy and pleased with the results I get out of all my Rimfires. The key to it is simply finding what ammo your Annie or baby likes the best and use that ammo and forget the cheap stuff that we used way back when you were a kid squirrel hunting.
Lastly, there is no cure for the desease of getting hooked on Rimfires. And remember that BV, I get to shoot it now and then because my adult daughter stole it out of my safe because she and my grandson like shooting it. Bottom line, so long as the buck flow, buy youself whatever makes you happy. What makes me happy is that when the scores are recorded at the conlsuion of a friendly local competition, that Anschutz seems to outshoot all the Savages, the CZ's, the Rem 40X's, just to name a few. Even the Custom jobs seem to come in 2nd place. So before you buy that CZ (and I'm not knocking them) go shoot somebody's Anschutz and see how you like them. Eveyrone has their own tastes and feel of a rifle. WHy not get it right the first time! Good luck and have fun!

 

[bozo699]

Ah yes, the desease of Rimfire Rifles. I know of that ailment and the tough decisions that will be forthcoming. I'd been shooting rifles of all sorts for over 47 years when a friend who I shoot Benchrest rifles with, talked me into sitting down behind his Benchrest .22 Rimfire. Big mistake on my part, at least for the sake of my bank account getting drained. But he suggested I not go hog wild, but consider buying a Savage BV model, which after several sessions of testing various ammo, was incredibly accurate with the "good stuff." And then after shooting that for a few months and trying out some other makes/models, quickly found that for the money (the BV was $340 without the scope) Savages were hard to beat as a rifle right out of the box for accuracy. Now sure there were other make/models that were nice, CZ, Remington 40X and even some of the nice custom rigs for like $3500 - $5,000 (which I can't afford so I shot some buddies rifles). So next I bought another Savage this time a TR that felt even better than the wooden BV model stock and had a better/lighter trigger and again shot in credible groups @50 yds with the "proper" Match Ammo. But the desease got even worse despite the warning by my wife, stay the hell out of the gun store! But then one nice day I got a phone call from my buddy that cause all my financial grief. He told me he was at the local gun store and that a new Anschutz 64 MPR had just arrived and that it was "SWEET." SO somehow, the car I was driving went out of control and drove me straight to the gun store my wife tried to warn me about. So there I got to hold this Anschutz that I'd read quit abit about and it felt like....OH MY GOSH...sooooooooooooooooooo nice. Needless to say I became about $1150 poorer almost instantly, not to mention I was now in deep kaka with my wife for sure. But at the range, this Anschutz made me look REALLY good. And in subsequent weeks to come, I was winning local Rimfire competitions and learned that Anschutz, Lapua and Federal had to be in cahoots because that rifle loves that expensibve Match ammo that all the bigs boys like to use on their $5,000+ match Rimfires. SO for this old retired fart, whose eyes aren't what they once were, but still loves to shoot for accuracy, is quite happy and pleased with the results I get out of all my Rimfires. The key to it is simply finding what ammo your Annie or baby likes the best and use that ammo and forget the cheap stuff that we used way back when you were a kid squirrel hunting.
Lastly, there is no cure for the desease of getting hooked on Rimfires. And remember that BV, I get to shoot it now and then because my adult daughter stole it out of my safe because she and my grandson like shooting it. Bottom line, so long as the buck flow, buy youself whatever makes you happy. What makes me happy is that when the scores are recorded at the conlsuion of a friendly local competition, that Anschutz seems to outshoot all the Savages, the CZ's, the Rem 40X's, just to name a few. Even the Custom jobs seem to come in 2nd place. So before you buy that CZ (and I'm not knocking them) go shoot somebody's Anschutz and see how you like them. Eveyrone has their own tastes and feel of a rifle. WHy not get it right the first time! Good luck and have fun!

Shynloco's last sentence is the best advice I think you could ever ask for, I started out with a Savage model 12 for my CF bR outfit and worked my way up, I wanted the better from the start but worked my way up, one rifle at a time,...in the long run I spent about 10X the amount as if I would have just taken several peoples advice and buy a custom to start with, I used to own a old Anschutz rifle that was completely wore out from thousands of rounds shot by the old gent that I got it from, but it probably shot well like he said it did if I hadn't of been a know it all and used cheap standard velocity through it and I wasn't impressed at all and got rid of the big bulky old thing,.....sure wish I could get it back for the $300 I paid for it
Wayne.

 

[CJ6]

What was said above + make regular appointments with your therapist and get a good set of flags (you'll NEED both). Not sure if there's a" PROGRAM" for RF shooters but a trip to the range is usually prescribed medicine.

 

[4570sharpshooter]

Once you have decided on your rifle( I'm in agreement with the rifle prescribed) there is the matter of ammo. You can buy some crappy ammo that shoots good ,but is dirty. Or you can buy better ammo(higher price) that shoots a tad better ...but clean. A good rifle,good ammo,good flags,a better rest , and last but not least talk to other rimfire shooters . Just my two cents,45/70SS

 

[ridethe53]

I have a CZ 452 Varmint and a 452 Style. Both are very good shooters right out of the box and I'm working on tuning and experimentation with ammo to further dial in the accuracy. There's an excellent and very active CZ/Brno forum on Rimfire Central (RFC) which you would very much enjoy if you're oriented to CZ at all. I'm by no means a rimfire authority - came to CZ's because of the very solid build and performance of those rifles at an affordable price. That said, within the CZ community (and it is one...) the 455 line is somewhat suspect in terms of accuracy compared to the tried and true 452/453 line. Part of this may be somewhat traditional thinking and suspicion of anything new, but there have been indications that CZ is not completely dialed in on the 455 product line just yet.

If you're looking to buy right now, my suggestion would be to track down a 452 or 453 Varmint from the remaining stock. Most of the RFC CZ folks are more sold on buying the 452 and working on the trigger than are strong advocates of the 453 with its single set trigger. I found this to be solid advice - the 452 trigger is very simple and it's very easy and inexpensive to modify it to a very clean break with no creep and whatever pull weight you desire. With a little patience and some very simple tools - and a very small investment in parts - the factory trigger can be terrific.

One piece of advice that you'll probably hear again and again is not to scrimp on the scope. Spending $200 on a scope probably means that before long you'll be lusting for a better scope and you'll sell the $200 scope for a loss. A $200 scope may shoot fine, but it won't hold its value as well as a $600 scope. A good scope will last for a long time and can be swapped to a new rifle when you upgrade. A used scope that comes with a lifetime warranty that is not limited to the original purchaser can be a great value with very little risk.

The other variable is ammunition and taking the time to see which ammo provides the best performance with your rifle. Many of the CZ's shoot CCI Standard Velocity really well. Wolf and SK provide a higher level of performance at a reasonable cost. With a CZ, you want to tune the action screw tension to the setting that gives your rifle its best group size - a torque screwdriver is a fairly inexpensive investment in accuracy among CZ shooters.

It's pretty hard to beat the CZ rimfires for solid fun and return on investment. Once you have one, however, you'll probably want to own a few more.

 

[laveritt]

PM sent.

 

[hogpatrol]

Uh Oh, sounds like a potential case of RIDS (rimfire induced divorce sydrome).

 

[bozo699]

Uh Oh, sounds like a potential case of RIDS (rimfire induced divorce sydrome).

That's a good one hogpatrol
Wayne.

 

[TRECustom]

BobWill, RFC is a goldmine of info, but all I've been able to do is read the boards. I registered about 8 months ago and got a username "Saltwood", but after many unsuccessful tries for member confirmation, finally gave up. I don't know what's going on over there, but nothing I tried (with lots of help from this site), worked. Hope you do better.

If you just accept that rimfire shooting is an incurable disease, it'll be easier to understand the migration of several of the little guys into your safe.

Have fun!

Tom

 

[bozo699]

Bob,
Here is your new rifle for sale right here on our classifieds forum,....
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/index.php/topic,3777735.0/topicseen.html
Wayne.

 

[BobWill]

RIDS! I've got it real bad! LOL Luckily I have a great understanding wife!

I have been building up my gun fund because I knew that this day was coming. Just had no idea that it would be an expensive rimfire!

I think that the CZ is out. I think that I want to concentrate on finding a little better shooter that is ready to go. Waiting and looking are going to be tough.

ridethe53, that is good advice. It would be hard to get rid of a cheap scope. I noticed that a lot of guns are sold without scopes. Could be that the owners wanted to keep the scopes. The scopes that come with the guns may not be that great, or the previous owner is getting out on the benchrest business all together. Looks like Leupold and Weavers are the ones to get? Just wondering what makes them so great and what should I look out for?

Well thanks again for the tips. I'm off to make that appointment with the therapist!

Bob

 

[hogpatrol]

Bob, Check out the Anschutz line. I have two in .17hmr and two in .17hm2. If their .22s are anything like these, they would be shooters right out of the box. Maybe one of your rimfire brethren has one you could try. I also have CZs with and without the single set trigger and the Annies are definitely several notches above in the trigger department but both shoot about the same and are partial to one particular weight & brand of ammo. Oh yeah, don't scrimp on the glass either. It'll make or break ya. Hog

 

[Shynloco]

What was said above + make regular appointments with your therapist and get a good set of flags (you'll NEED both). Not sure if there's a" PROGRAM" for RF shooters but a trip to the range is usually prescribed medicine.

CJ6,
Good news and bad news! The good news is got me a therapist. Bad news is he''s now my shooting partner with a brand new Rimfire Anschutz. Let's face it, ain't no cure for the desease.

 

[Buzzsaw]

I'm going through the samething. After reading many forums, articles on the subject, talking to and swapping emails with gunsmiths. I have come to this conclusion

Study up on phisics, engineering, being patient and winning the lottery.....and then I will have to learn to shoot.

If you like semi-autos, I have a purty one in the classifieds

Any way remember....you only cry once!

 

[Cort]

Bob,

I was bitten by the .22 LR bug not too long ago. I started out with a CZ 455 American and a cheap scope. Very soon, the scope was replaced by a Sightron 6 - 24 with AO. Then the CZ was set aside and a Kimber 82 with a Weaver 36X went to the range with me. After a few matches, that was sold and a Remington 540XR with a Weaver 36X went to the range. That was sold and I am now awaiting a Hall action with a Jewell trigger and a Shilen barrel in a McMillan stock. Initially, it will have a Weaver 36X but only for awhile. The Weaver is a good scope, particularly for the money, but there are better choices, in my opinion.

I would recommend going with a true bench rest rifle if that is your direction. You rarely see a straight factory rifle on the line at a match - Anschutz actions and triggers with custom barrels and stocks; Remington 40X's with Jewell triggers, custom barrels and custom stocks; custom actions with all the frills. I suspect the Anschutz is the best of the straight factory rifles from a performance perspective.

Once you have the rifle, then you will need to get a good rest and find the ammunition that your rifle truly likes. A tuner will help the good ammunition once you find it but it will not make ammunition that your rifle doesn't like win. After all that, you need to shoot and shoot some more. Wind flags are a must (you can start with surveyors tape and some sticks). This sport is about as addicting as anything else that I have ever experienced.

Good luck,

Cort

 

[Shynloco]

Cort,
I see you suffer from the very same symptoms I do. And funny thing happened today BEFORE i read your message. I dropped by my local Gunstore where one of the owners is a shootin buddy who taught me how to reload a few years back. I never had the time while I was working a regular job, but after retiring, I had time to do some of the things I never did in my previous some odd 40+ years of target shooting and hunting. But today I stopped by his shop just to see what an Anschutz 1913A BR-50 would cost because the itch has struck AGAIN. And BTW, he's the only guy who I haven't outshot using my Anschutz 64 MPR that has a Harrel Tuner and a 1.5 lb trigger pull. Personally I don't care for those 6 oz triggers. SO besides talking about the possibility of getting me that BR-50, I asked him what it would cost me have him build me a REALLY nice Target rifle sorta like his that has a Sako Action, Lilja 16 Twist HV barrel and of course the Jewell Trigger that is set right at 6 ozs. So to the drawing board we went and he's got an extra Rem 40X action and he suggested putting on a Lilja 16 Twist 28" barrel, Jewell trigger that he can adjust down to 2 oz if I want, all atop a McMillan BR stock and of course a Harrell Tuner like I have on my 64 MPR. He's going to figure all that up in terms of cost, but estimates right between $2400 - $2800. Not bad at all for a custom rig as I've seen similar custom setups for over $3200. Now those other rigs do have either Hall or Turbo actions, but for strength and endurance, its hard to beat a Remington 40X that is probably half the cost of the other two I mentioned. So based upon your examples of a "true Benchrest Rifle," I'd say we're on the same page and the desease continues. But so does my fun and never ending craving for that 5 Target, consistent .100 measurement on five shot groups. I'm both intrigues and hyped as to what such an effort will look like. OH...I almost forgot, guess I'll be also be buying another Weaver 36X to go atop this beauty once she's done. The only downside of such a venture is no more excuses of the infamous fliers that I actually abandoned back when I bought the Anschutz 64 mpr. Those are all on me now and I actually can call them just based upon the feel and shooting characteristics of a truly fine rifle. I'm certain that same feeling will apply to that custom job my Gunsmith is figuring on building for me. Simply incurable and terminal I'd say.

 

[BobWill]

Cort,

Been there, done that. I hate to keep upgrading and always wanting what the others have! LOL I have pretty much decided to get a nice dedicated benchrest gun. I can always work on it as far as upgrades, or get one more if I get bitten really bad. Either way, I am in for a mess of fun!

Thank everyone for the great thoughts and shared experiences!

Bob

PS
Let me know if you hear of any great deals!

 

[Shynloco]

Bob,
Just a thought, you might consider lloking around and getting hold of the some of the well respected Gunsmiths in the world of Rimfire and see if they have any nice rigs sitting around they want to sell. You might find a nice serious rig with a shot-out barrel that only needs a new barrel put on and get it for a very reasonable price. You might also consider getting hold of Dan Killough down at Killough Shooting Sports (in Texas) who occasionally has some nice used rigs sitting around and for sale as well.