Extreme Recoil Torque?

[RAFII]

Hello,
Sorry if this has been covered here elsewhere...

Think I am experiencing extreme clock wise torque/twisting recoil when shooting.
This is also affecting the ability of the rifle to return to battery.
A friend slow motion videoed myself and a friend shooting with his cell phone.
My fellow shooter had a nice reward motion.
I had a corkscrew like motion.

Particulars:
Hall Action in a McMillan Edge Stock
30BR (115 10X bullets over 34.7 grains of 4198)
1:17 twist barrel (I believe)
Front Rest is a second generation SEB NEO with it's stock three piece bag
Edgewood rear bag
No shoulder or cheek contact, only hand gripping stock. But not tight or a death grip.
(So yes I am shooting a bench gun... prone. No Hi Power bench rest activities at my club. Sorry)

I have the two side bags/ears of the rest pretty firm on the stock. The rifle does slide forward/backward with a slight amount of resistance. With the stock's "upside down T shape" I would think that the bag ears would hold it quite well and prevent this rotation effect...
Could these two bags be filled too much or be too firm?

I shot a respectable score. (As we shoot an NBRSA Hunter 200 yard target.) But we shoot 4 rounds into each scoring bull. So my final score was 198 and 10X. So I am able to deal/adapt with the "situation".

But those that are watching (who are experienced shooters, including the guy who shot the video) think something is just not right.
I wish I had the two videos so you could see what they are seeing.

Regards,
Richard

 

[Link]

My 30br has a fair amount of recoil at 34.5 gr and bolt click. So much so I looked for a lower node. I'm not a competitive shooter. But my 2 cents. I'm sure someone will help.

Link

following

 

[Sniper338]

I thought i was crazy when i had that happening to me. Personally ive only experianced it with hotter loads, and heavy bullets for the caliber rifle i was shooting at the time. I got rid of a factory 243 that did that, other issues too. But i have a 338 lapua custom build that was doing it at first..

In theory all i can figure is the gun torques/twists to the right because of the right hand turn rifling and torque of the twisting motion of the bullet in the barrel... something along those lines...

I noticed it right away because the left leg of a bipod would kick up off the ground or bench...

This 338 lapua actually broke two cheap bipods because of it... i corrected it by loading these bipods quite stiff and hard, but they couldnt handle it... so i had to do something different.

As in your case you cant load a bipod to correct it, only thing i can think of is slowing the velocity/pressure so it doesnt torque as bad... but that may put you out of the chosen node real quick. The speculation i have is to change powder to a powder with a slower burn...

In my 338 this helped a lot when i changed from H1000 to reloader 33... better velocity and less pressure.. no where near the twisting motion anymore..

I speculate thats what causes it, it fixed it for me changing powders... worked for me, but im no expert and cant tell you exactly why it worked..

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Get the upgraded bag from mike ratigan and lower that load a tad. What velocity is that?

 

[noload]

I have only experienced this with a Neo rest and a hot load in a 284 Shehane. It still grouped well though. I may be wrong but wouldn't the gun raise the right side up first with a right twist. Then the left side torques up as a secondary response ?

 

[Killshot]

No, the right-hand twist torques the barrel to the right unweighting the left side.

 

[LHSmith]

First, I would suspect the front bag is too hard....not enough sand and allowing the sand to pack hard. Those bags were a poor design. Possibly gun balance. Try different positions with both front and rear bag ( different overhang amounts).Shooting at uphill angles will aggravate the problem.Check the rifle balance point of your rifle. Tighten the front rest side clamps as much as rules allow, and I don't like heavy sand in the ears of any bag, front or rear- the bag should act like a dampner not like a rock.

 

[Macropod]

No, the right-hand twist torques the barrel to the right unweighting the left side.

Interesting.... But wrong.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

No, the right-hand twist torques the barrel to the right unweighting the left side.

Interesting.... But wrong.

I thought i was in the bizarro world. Thank you

 

[Syncrowave]

Bullet gets pushed clockwise. Rifle gets pushed back counterclockwise. Think of shooting a .44

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Equal and opposite reaction correct

 

[Macropod]

Like you Dusty, it challenged everything I thought I knew about barrel torque. Dang, nearly thought my offset stock was all wrong!

 

[M-61]

An example would be SSS Dogtracker Stock. Barrel waaay offset to the RIGHT with all that forearm on the left to make the torque less evident. I have this in a 6.5x.284 and my own personal experience it made an unpleasant cartridge somewhat more manageable. Didn't save the day...just seems to me to be a bit better. Right twist barrel it's torquing to the left.

 

[XXPER]

Do you experience the same torquing when you use a different rifle with the same rest?

 

[Sniper338]

Equal and opposite reaction correct

So my theory was right, just the opposite way... i figured it had something to do with that one way or another...

 

[Link]

You guys had me wondering. I put a torque tab on my 223 X Ray stock with a level in the rear. Not that a 223 has a lot of torque but it did seem to help not upset it so much when I work the bolt. And the bubble is nice.

Link

;D