Shot my new Savage 6br yesterday and was not happy! At 100yds it shot a 3 inch group. Maybe its my load? I havn't been able to find Varget so i used some BLC2. 105 Amax 29grn BLC2 fed 205 Can IMR4895 be substituted for H4895?
disapointed
- Thread starter choppedsami1
- Start date
You are right, that group is very disapointing. The very first thing I would do is check the rear action screw and lossen it up to only slightly snug,I use clear fingernail polish to ceep it from turning out).
I think your powder is a bit too fast for the 6mmBR. I would try 4895. IIRC IMR 4895 is just a bit faster than H4895 so I would back off a bit from 29 grains to test it.
Do you have any VARGET or RL 15? The go-to load for 6mmBR's is 30 grains of VARGET with a 105-107 grain bullet. Most guns shoot this load very well.
I also have found my 6mmBR's,I have three) shoot very well with the bullet loaded .020' back off the rifling. You might consider varying the seating depths AFTER you get the groups under 1'.
As a last resort - if all else fails - call Savage as they are very good to stand behing their products. In the mean time DO NOT alter the gun at all until it starts to shoot or it goes back to Savage.
Keep us informed as I love Savages and your gun should shoot great. Remember you are not alone out there and we will get your through this and get that gun shooting well.
George
I think your powder is a bit too fast for the 6mmBR. I would try 4895. IIRC IMR 4895 is just a bit faster than H4895 so I would back off a bit from 29 grains to test it.
Do you have any VARGET or RL 15? The go-to load for 6mmBR's is 30 grains of VARGET with a 105-107 grain bullet. Most guns shoot this load very well.
I also have found my 6mmBR's,I have three) shoot very well with the bullet loaded .020' back off the rifling. You might consider varying the seating depths AFTER you get the groups under 1'.
As a last resort - if all else fails - call Savage as they are very good to stand behing their products. In the mean time DO NOT alter the gun at all until it starts to shoot or it goes back to Savage.
Keep us informed as I love Savages and your gun should shoot great. Remember you are not alone out there and we will get your through this and get that gun shooting well.
George
If your barrel is a 12tw go to 68 to 75 grain bullets and H322 and you'll soon have a big smile on your face. Try a 75gr Vmax pushed with 29.0gr/H322. This load has shot well averaging .2's to .3's in most 6BR I've shot it in, even fast twist barrel will shot this load well. An old friend who use to shot a 6mmbr in 100/200yd benchrest used 68gr Bergers - 29.0gr/H322 as his competition load, I've watched him shoot a lot of low.1's. Quick Load shows 30.0grs is max. Hope you find this helpful.
Good luck
RJ
Good luck
RJ
Ackman
Gold $$ Contributor
That's terrible accuracy but it doesn't mean much. Is that an arbitrary load or did you see it somewhere...... someone said that's THE load for a 6BR? You can't just put together a powder charge someone gives you and expect it to shoot well in your gun. Someone tells you to use x-amount of x-powder with x-bullet and it's the greatest thing and will shoot well for you because it's accurate in their gun or their friend's gun....means nothing. It might work well for you but don't count on it. Too many variables. Use someone else's load as a ballpark reference only. You've gotta do a load sequence to find what works best. Doing a load workup your barrel/chamber may just not like a particular bullet or a particular powder or a particular bullet/powder combination. You don't really know what'll work til you try things. With a 12 twist barrel 105gr bullets are way too long/heavy anyhow, you'll need to go much lighter. Check your loading manuals....they're not anywhere near gospel but they do give you a place to start.
It is a Model 12 Benchrest with a 29' 1 in 8 twist.
You cant be disappointed with your first load, after you have tried 10 or 30 you will find one your rifle and you both like. And I would loose the 105g bullets to shoot 100 yds, and try something around 80g or less, that will get you out to 400 yds.
You dont need 105s, unless you plan to shoot out to 600+.
M.
You dont need 105s, unless you plan to shoot out to 600+.
M.
This doesn't sound like a load problem. A rifle that should be shooting half-inch groups or better won't shoot three inch groups with ANY reasonable powder/charge/bullet/seating depth. Something else is seriously wrong. Here's why I think so:
http://yarchive.net/gun/ammo/benchrest_loads.html
Things to check:
Loose scope bases/rings,also check to see if a scope base screw is bottoming in a blind hole, or hitting the threads on the barrel shank).
Is the scope itself known to perform well on another rifle?
Action/bedding screws torqued properly?
Barrel touching the stock?
Trigger mechanism touching the stock?
Crown dinged?
Barrel nut tight?
What was the shape of the groups? How windy was it? Did you use wind flags?
Toby Bradshaw
baywingdb@comcast.net
http://yarchive.net/gun/ammo/benchrest_loads.html
Things to check:
Loose scope bases/rings,also check to see if a scope base screw is bottoming in a blind hole, or hitting the threads on the barrel shank).
Is the scope itself known to perform well on another rifle?
Action/bedding screws torqued properly?
Barrel touching the stock?
Trigger mechanism touching the stock?
Crown dinged?
Barrel nut tight?
What was the shape of the groups? How windy was it? Did you use wind flags?
Toby Bradshaw
baywingdb@comcast.net
Thanks for the info guys. Y'all have been a big help but I agree with Toby I think there is an issue with the rifle or scope maybe.I bought the rifle to shoot 300+ but with the groups its shooting at 100 there is no way Ill keep it if I cant solve the problem. My Wal-Mart bought 700 shoots tighter with factory ammo!
choppedsami1: All the previous suggestions are excellent, and to add to those: My standard accuracy bullet is the 68 Berger Match with N133 powder, seated to touch. That combination is extremly accurate in a Shilen and a Hart 1-14, and a Savage factory in 1-9.25,re-chambered 243). For the 'shorter' distances, flat-base bullets work fine: I do not use boatail 'til 300 yds, and beyond. Do not give up on the rifle-- they will shoot.
Frank is right, I doubt there is anything wrong with the rifle, that you cant find and fix. I personally haven't seen a Savage yet that wouldn't shoot under .7 moa, with a good hand load, but it must happen. So hang in there, and check and recheck every thing.
And I suggest you start with a smaller bullet 60 to 80g and a good known powder load, you have to have a load that's consistent to find and eliminate other problems. Presuming the scope is good.
And you cant just take a strange to you, rifle and stick a long heavy bullet and a powder charge in it and expect it to shoot in the .5 moa the first time out, it takes more work and time to get there. Its just not that easy.
M.
And I suggest you start with a smaller bullet 60 to 80g and a good known powder load, you have to have a load that's consistent to find and eliminate other problems. Presuming the scope is good.
And you cant just take a strange to you, rifle and stick a long heavy bullet and a powder charge in it and expect it to shoot in the .5 moa the first time out, it takes more work and time to get there. Its just not that easy.
M.
Have not checked the twist but it says 1 in 8 on the barrel.
What larosa said, verify the twist rate. That bbl was made by humans and they screw up all the time. Hopefully you will discover that it is a 12 or 14 twist. Then you send it back to Savage and they put the correct bbl on it.
I wouldn't know where to start trying to improve on 3' 'groups'.
While checking the twist with the tight patch see if you feel any rough areas of the bore dragging on the patch. If it actually is an 8 twist they you need to have someone look at the bore with a borescope.
I wouldn't know where to start trying to improve on 3' 'groups'.
While checking the twist with the tight patch see if you feel any rough areas of the bore dragging on the patch. If it actually is an 8 twist they you need to have someone look at the bore with a borescope.
A 3' group from your first load in a new rifle is not all that far out. There are so many things to consider, I wouldn't assume its the barrel. I would clean it often and use a good copper remover. And try several bullet weights with the recommended powder you see posted hear, as well as different bullet seating depths.
Im sure you will get it to shoot down around .5' at 100, with some time and work.
Barrel break in can take 50 to 100 rounds and 10 to 20 good copper removing cleanings. And forget about using BLC2 and all of the 4895s, and find some Varget. And it will shoot.
Mike.
Im sure you will get it to shoot down around .5' at 100, with some time and work.
Barrel break in can take 50 to 100 rounds and 10 to 20 good copper removing cleanings. And forget about using BLC2 and all of the 4895s, and find some Varget. And it will shoot.
Mike.
choppedsami1 said:
It probably is the load. You should start with either a proven load -- which yours is not, as you've mentioned -- or get some match grade factory ammo by which you can benchmark its accuracy.
It's well worth the cost for the time/frustration it will save you. http://www.grafs.com/vendor/browse/118/445
And you don't know your bore twist is what the factory says until you check it yourself, which is pretty easy to do with a tight fitting patch/jag on your cleaning rod.
Were it my rig, I'd try some Lapua factory ammo in 90 grain,Scenar).
Not trying to be a jerk here ... but just how good of a shot were you before you took up the 6br? What did you shoot before, and how did you do? Apparently it was better than 3 inches.
The build, brand and caliber will not make you a crack shot. Look inward as well and answer some tough questions like was I prepared to shoot this rifle, was I overly excited, was I jerking the new trigger or bucking while thinking it would kick a lot, and was I in a hurry and worried about breaking it in, cleaning it and fetching the fired brass, or impressing my friends.
When I first shot the M-14 in the Marine Corps I was pitiful, the weight and recoil shocked this country boy who was used to .22s and shotgunning. When I became familiar, all went well. Shooters' problems often begin with themselves. Have some patience and give yourself a break.
Having said that, I have shot a lot of calibers, but I will be shooting my first Savage 6br for the first time next week and I'm taking your problems to heart and mind with me. Hope I listen to my own advice.
Oh, one other thing, bring only the new rifle with you to the range when you're taking a new one on ... that way you'll focus on just that one.
The build, brand and caliber will not make you a crack shot. Look inward as well and answer some tough questions like was I prepared to shoot this rifle, was I overly excited, was I jerking the new trigger or bucking while thinking it would kick a lot, and was I in a hurry and worried about breaking it in, cleaning it and fetching the fired brass, or impressing my friends.
When I first shot the M-14 in the Marine Corps I was pitiful, the weight and recoil shocked this country boy who was used to .22s and shotgunning. When I became familiar, all went well. Shooters' problems often begin with themselves. Have some patience and give yourself a break.
Having said that, I have shot a lot of calibers, but I will be shooting my first Savage 6br for the first time next week and I'm taking your problems to heart and mind with me. Hope I listen to my own advice.
Oh, one other thing, bring only the new rifle with you to the range when you're taking a new one on ... that way you'll focus on just that one.
Shot the gun again on sunday,same load)and it was a totally different rifle. Shot a 1' 10 shot group at 200yds in a light wind. The only difference other than the wind was the temp was 20 degrees cooler. I finally found some Varget powder.
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