dented shoulders

[rocketron]

how are you chambering the round? single load (hand feed into chamber) or mag feed

 

[Gene Beggs]

There is something seriously wrong here! Stop what you're doing immediately before you get hurt and get someone that knows what he is doing to look at everything. You obviously don't know what you're doing and need help.

I'm not trying to be rude and hurt your feelings but when I read this thread I just could not remain silent. This is serious.

Is this a new or newly acquired rifle? Ever shot it before?

The loaded rounds in your photo don't look like 223, they look more like 22-250.

Gene Beggs

 

[Pres100]

They look like 223 to me, just a longer bullet.

 

[expiper]

I agree with Gene ,,stop and get help ,,,is this ammo being used in a rattle gun or a Savage with the bbl installed improperly,,,there are a million possibilities,,,Roger

 

[Sniper338]

Yes STOP!! Figure it out with unloaded brass... something is way way off... resize your new brass before loading it the first time.... that is excessive force to make a dent like that!!

 

[Sniper338]

Only time ive seen that is with feeding issues with an AR15.. bolt slams shut, brass shoulder hits the bolt locking lugs..

 

[M14AMU]

ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS.....load a dummy round and check for proper operation and FLS new brass!

 

[ericbc7]

yep all is stop till i figure this out...bullets being pulled and powder saved. switching to my proven Forster fl dies. then i plan to take a careful series of tests on my new Redding body die to see if it will work with my Co-Ax press and shell holder.

 

[fguffey]

I just loaded up 40 rounds of .223 in new Winchester brass.

[/yep all is stop till I figure this out...quote]

I would start with new, over the counter factory ammo. I would not shoot it I would save it and use it to compare reloads with. If the factory ammo will chamber I suggest making reloads that match the dimensions.

Then if I decide to determine the effect the chamber has on a fired case I would chamber a factory over the counter case then fire. If the new ammo is not measured before firing, start over.

F. Guffey

 

[savagedasher]

The dent is from trapped air or too much oil. Clean your dies and use less lube..
That is my finding. Larry

 

[fguffey]

The dent is from trapped air or too much oil. Clean your dies and use less lube..
That is my finding. Larry

He loaded 40 rounds without noticing the dents?

Air: air is fluid, it flows and can be compressed. Oil is fluid, it flows but can not be compressed.

I clean my dies with a towel on a dowel, the towel on a dowel works for chambers also.

F. Guffey

 

[fguffey]

I just loaded up 40 rounds of .223 in new Winchester brass. I used lee collet die to make neck tension, but found out that this brass would not chamber.

He loaded 40 rounds without noticing the dents?

F. Guffey

 

[Elkbane]

Here's my guess - happened to me before loading for a gas gun with pre-primed bulk brass. If you didn't use a sizing die that touched the shoulder, the problem is not in your sizing, it's in your seating die. If the cases are a little long or inconsistent length, the crimp portion of the die is hitting the neck mouth and driving the case neck toward the base. The resulting bulge shows up at the neck/shoulder junction. Then when you try to chamber a round, the neck/shoulder junction of the chamber puts a dent in the expanded section of the case (that's where the new contact point resides).

To test, make two dummy rounds - no powder or primer. Use the same sizing procedure that you have been using. On the first one, seat a bullet the way your seating die is currently set up. On the second one, loosen the seating die lock ring, turn the die out a half turn, then reset the seating stem for the same OAL. If it's teh crimp area hitting the neck mouth, you'll see and feel the difference in the way #1 vs #2 chambers.

ELkbane

 

[Gene Beggs]

Eric, I don't think you have told us what kind of rifle you are using. If you did, I missed it. I ask again,

Is this a new or newly acquired rifle? If so, have you fired it before?

It has been suggested that the dents in the shoulders are caused by oil or solvent in either the chamber or the sizing die. I don't think so. If I understand correctly, the loaded rounds have no dents in the shoulder before you attempt to chamber them and obviously if you have been unable to chamber a round and fire it, the dents are not caused by solvent or oil in the chamber.

I'm very concerned about what kind of action your using. Is it a bolt action or semi-automatic? If it's a semi-automatic, I can see how releasing the charging handle and letting the action slam forward might dent the shoulders if they hang up on something during feeding. If it's a bolt action, I'm very concerned if you are slamming the bolt forward hard enough to dent the shoulder in an attempt to 'force' the round into the chamber. Either could result in a slam fire with the bolt out of battery if you happened to have a primer that was seated a little high.

Keep us informed. Have you contacted another shooter in your area to look at the situation?

Later,

Gene Beggs

 

[savagedasher]

Eric, I don't think you have told us what kind of rifle you are using. If you did, I missed it. I ask again,

Is this a new or newly acquired rifle? If so, have you fired it before?

It has been suggested that the dents in the shoulders are caused by oil or solvent in either the chamber or the sizing die. I don't think so. If I understand correctly, the loaded rounds have no dents in the shoulder before you attempt to chamber them and obviously if you have been unable to chamber a round and fire it, the dents are not caused by solvent or oil in the chamber.

I'm very concerned about what kind of action your using. Is it a bolt action or semi-automatic? If it's a semi-automatic, I can see how releasing the charging handle and letting the action slam forward might dent the shoulders if they hang up on something during feeding. If it's a bolt action, I'm very concerned if you are slamming the bolt forward hard enough to dent the shoulder in an attempt to 'force' the round into the chamber. Either could result in a slam fire with the bolt out of battery if you happened to have a primer that was seated a little high.

Keep us informed. Have you contacted another shooter in your area to look at the situation?

Later,

Gene Beggs

The dent is in a un fired case. Two things that makes dent in brass from sizing is trapped air. Big dents are from trapped air and the small ones are from oil. Clean your dies and Don't lube as much. Problem Solved. Larry

 

[bigedp51]

The OP is having problems and three NEW unfired Winchester cases had dented shoulders after chambering. He also stated when using his Redding body die it did not fix the dented shoulder when chambering problem. He has a Forster Co-Ax press, Lee collet dies, Redding body dies, etc. This does not sound like a rookie newbie, BUT I for one would like to find out what happens when he uses his Forster full length die. And what the problem actually is.

Some of you need to read every post, the shoulder dents were not caused during sizing. :

Also remember today the quality control of our reloading supplies are controlled by the stock shareholders.

I just loaded up 40 rounds of .223 in new Winchester brass. I used lee collet die to make neck tension, but found out that this brass would not chamber. in fact all three rounds i tried to chamber dented the shoulder of the cases. I tried to size em down with a Redding body die but even with hard contact with shell holder the shells still dent when i try to chamber them.
what is going on?

must i pull all 40 rounds and run em through the forster fl sizing die?

I used a forster co-ax press and shell holder.
here is my picture

they all dented when i tried to chamber them. I ran a couple through a redding body die with hard contact with the shell holder on my forster coax
what the hec is going on?

Hey John, thanks for the information. fact is i use the lee collet die regularly, but these were new brass. what i cannot figure out is why i cannot run them through the redding body die to make them chamber.

yep all is stop till i figure this out...bullets being pulled and powder saved. switching to my proven Forster fl dies. then i plan to take a careful series of tests on my new Redding body die to see if it will work with my Co-Ax press and shell holder.

 

[bigedp51]

CatShooter just sent me a PM below, and I edited and deleted 75% of it, BUT lets just say dented shoulders are not life threating.

Good morning Edwardus... how in God's name did this madness get so far. It is a guessing foray from a Chinese kindergarten.

You should be ashamed of yourself for getting involved.

CatShooter, come back to the forum and join all the fun, this is Accurate Shooter forum after all. :

At least we didn't get into "arguing about particulate absorption" by our resident "Reloading Engineers". ;D

P.S. And WHY am I the only one getting beat up by you, come back to the forum and do your own fisticuffs with the people in our "Chinese Fire drills".

 

[brantfredrickson]

ericbc7, I got dents like that once when I used neck lube with imperial application media(graphite coated ceramic balls). I body sized with Imperial wax, then neck sized with graphite coated balls. Some of the balls stuck to the shoulder and it looked just like what you have. I have since moved to a FL sizing die brushing the neck id's with graphite power and don't use the ceramic coated balls in the sizing process.

 

[Gene Beggs]

Guys, I give up! :

Everyone seems to be on a completely different page.

This thread reminds me of the famous quote by Strother Martin in the movie "Cool Hand Luke."

"What we have here is failure to communicate."

Good luck, take care and good shootin'!

I'll go away now.

Gene Beggs

 

[expiper]

HI Gene,,,,,,,dont fret ,,most of these guys have never shot competetivlely or even know how a good rifle shoots...an ole' "B"enchrest shooter like you can get frustrated real quick,,,hahahah,,,Roger