D-Day: Sobering little-known facts

[JLT]

To some extent, but in the end they stopped the daylight slaughter flights.

That is not true. After the losses suffered on the Schweinfurt/Regensburg raids in 1943, daylight operations were dialed back and targets revaluated for several months. Arrival of the P-51B and subsequent models and retrofitting P-47 fighter groups with additional fuel hardpoints and four-blade paddle blade propellers, things started to change. Fast, well-armed escort fighters dramatically reduced losses to enemy fighter activity and rapidly cut into the number of experienced, veteran Luftwaffe pilots. Luftwaffe opposition to daytime raids diminished rapidly, to the point where the escort fighters were often cut loose after the bombing run to seek out and engage targets of opportunity.

The early air war in Europe was indeed a terrible thing. B-17 and B-24 losses were indeed unsustainable when the targets selected were in Germany or installations critical to the German war effort, like the Ploesti oil fields and refineries and the ball bearing manufacturing facilities of Schweinfurt and Regensburg. The Mustangs and the Thunderbolts changed everything. Shortly after escort capabilities reached full strength, the Thousand Bomber raids began, and persisted through the remainder of the war.

"Flying Forts" by Martin Caidin and "Thunderbolt!" by Capt. Robert S. Johnson are recommended reading, along with the official historical documents of the Mighty 8th. Some may recognize Robert S. Johnson as the 2nd highest scoring ace of the ETO and the first to surpass Eddie Rickenbacker's 26 victories in the First World War. He flew P-47s with the 56th Fighter Group, Zemke's Wolfpack, alongside the ETO's top scoring ace, Col. Francis Gabreski (31 victories). Almost all of the 56th's air-to-air victories were achieved in the bomber escort role.

Edited to add: Gabby Gabreski became a jet ace in Korea, adding 6 MiG-15s to his victory total, while flying F-86 Sabres.

One more edit: I would be remiss by not explicitly stating that every single American owes a great deal to the hundreds of thousands of bomber pilots, gunners, navigators, bombardiers, radio operators, fighter pilots and ground crewmen that demonstrated remarkable resolve, gallantry and courage during the air war of the ETO. "I knew the war was lost when I saw Mustangs over Berlin." - Hermann Goering, June 1945

 

[searcher]

Whatever caused the powers to be to think that daylight raids over Germany would succeed was just sinful. They had good intel on German air and anti-aircraft defenses. What a blunder!

Yeah - I assume it was akin to the Doolittle Raid on Japan - more about breaking the will of the people.

 

[Eagle Six]

I think the Doolittle Raid was more about building the will of the American people.

 

[searcher]

I think the Doolittle Raid was more about building the will of the American people.

I guess one would have to toss a coin and ask whether dropping bombs on Japanese cities bothered the Japanese more than we felt good doing it.

 

[Eagle Six]

"I guess one would have to toss a coin and ask whether dropping bombs on Japanese cities bothered the Japanese more than we felt good doing it."

I spoke with four Japanese many years ago, all were from Tokyo. Two were soldiers, two were civilians. Neither liked the Doolittle raid, but all said it bolstered their will to destroy America. Now the fire bombing and two big bombs did effect the civilians, not so much to the soldiers, they were willing and ready to fight on.

 

[searcher]

"I guess one would have to toss a coin and ask whether dropping bombs on Japanese cities bothered the Japanese more than we felt good doing it."

I spoke with four Japanese many years ago, all were from Tokyo. Two were soldiers, two were civilians. Neither liked the Doolittle raid, but all said it bolstered their will to destroy America. Now the fire bombing and two big bombs did effect the civilians, not so much to the soldiers, they were willing and ready to fight on.

Yes - I can imagine how we would feel if our mainland were bombed.

 

[dave@aDave]

When my father (USN VPB-120) traded in his PBY-5 for the new PB4Y-2, He said there causality rate was higher during training than in actual combat.
One problem that took a while to discover and fix was the fuel transfer pump. Seems the motor for the pump sparked a lot.

 

[nakneker]

Anything World War II is sobering, the amount of sacrifice known and unknown can never fully be appreciated. I enjoy hearing and learning about it as much as I can. With today’s flag stomping, flag burning, kneeling it amazes me how quickly people forget. As much as I hate Hollywood I feel like every Impressionable young person should have to watch saving Private Ryan or sit down and talk with a Vet for an hour and listen to what they have say.

I spend a far amount of time in Hawaii and I visit Pearl Harbor annually. You would be surprised at the amount of Japanese that visit there too and I’ve talked with many of them. The healing from WWII is still taking place, here, Europe, Japan ….. everywhere it touched has scars. That generation doesn’t have many left, cherish them while you can.

 

[Shooter13]

I can imagine how we would feel if our mainland were bombed.

Yes you can, 9/11 will give you a "feel".

 

[searcher]

Yes you can, 9/11 will give you a "feel".

I was not thinking of a terrorist attack - but of a conventional bombardment of military. In the world of today - that does equate to the same - especially in lives lost. I'll never forget watching those planes that morning on the tv.

 

[searcher]

I was not thinking of a terrorist attack - but of a conventional bombardment of military. In the world of today - that does equate to the same - especially in lives lost. I'll never forget watching those planes that morning on the tv.

I enlisted in the Marines during the Vietnam war as retribution for my best friend's father being killed while over there as an "advisor" years earlier. I can't imagine how many men and women enlisted to go to the desert after the twin towers. I would have joined back up - but too freaking old. A lot of old geezers on this site would have come in handy as overwatch.

 

[ebb]

The thing that made daylight raids less of a slaughter was a fighter escort with the range to fly to Berlin and back. But even then, the Army Air Corps tactics had to evolve to where the fighter pilots could fly well above the bombers and dive into approaching German aircraft. The 332nd fighter group was said to be the best.