CRIMPED PRIMERS

[bmiles]

I am new to reloading. My question is when trying to prep military brass cases I have read all kind of information about how to remove the crimp from the primer pocket. My question is once you remove the primer could you not just use a primer pocket uniformer to size the
primer pocket and remove the crimp. The reason I ask this question is because with all the reading and youtube reseach I have done not one person does it this way.

Thanks,
Brandon

 

[fdshuster]

Brandon: A primer pocker uniformer will only contact the primer pocket walls & the base. They normally do not cut or remove the sharp corner left from the crimp. It's this sharp edge that will catch on the edge of the primer cup & destroy it when you try to seat.

Some use a dedicated primer pocket swaging tool, like the one available from Dillon, some use a cutting tool as made by Lyman & several others, & some of us use the cutter that we attach to our Forster case trimmers.

The main concern is to create a smooth entry for the primer to start it's way into the pocket.

It's really a 2 step procedure. Remove the remains of the crimp then uniform if you feel it's necessary.

 

[amlevin]

When making the choice of which primer crimp removal tool to buy, consider how many cases you will actually have to "prep" with it.

If only a few, just get a reamer like the Lyman. If you have "buckets full" then get the Dillon Super Swage.

It's the easiest of the bunch and provides a nice uniform, centered, and radiused, primer pocket mouth.

Some people buy them off the internet ads, swage all their cases, and then sell them because swaging only needs to be done once. Unless you wear out a lot of brass, usually a "bucket full" is enough for a long time.

 

[KevinThomas]

You also need to bear in mind that this is a "one-time" operation. Once it's done the first time, your brass should be treated and reloaded just as you would any uncrimped case from that point on. Not a big deal, but what cases are you using here that need to be "un-crimped"?

 

[markm87]

As far as efficiency goes, I can chuck up the Hornady cutting bit in a drill and run just as fast as I did with my Super Swager.

I sold the Super Swager.. The hornady large and small cutters with handle is only like $20. I do a LOT of lake city .223 brass with mine.

 

[fr3db3ar]

I just use my forster swage tool. The same one I use to do the inside of my case mouths. I've done a couple thousand once fired military cases when full length trimming the first time.

 

[Shooter2112]

Markm87,

Just a thought with a little experience mixed in.............
I have swaged at least 15K pieces of LC brass in my time - all with a Dillon swager.
I have also used the 'drill bit' method and the uniformer methods on the same lots of LC brass.
I have to conclude that you won't be trying to win matches with the brass you need to de-crimp, so........

My swaged brass always held it's 'primer pocket tightness' all the way through the life of the brass. Swaging removes no material, only 'folds' away the sharp corner, thus allowing for future primers to be inserted.
In contrast to the swaging method, the drill bit and uniformer methods remove material, while ensuring that the pocket dimension is as close to 'perfect' as possible in depth and diameter. I found with this method that I got 'soft pockets' long before the lifespan of the brass was at it's end..........soft seating, primers dislodged during normal pressure load firing at about 4 reloads. This is with LC 5.56mm plinking ammo loaded to NATO spec w/H335 powder and #41 primers.
I should mention that primer dimensions play a role here too - I have used CCI400's, but switched to #41's long ago with no primer pocket issues whatsoever - they seat deep and tight and stay seated.

I prefer the swager and can swage hundreds of pieces an hour. My swager paid for itself in about 2K rounds vs. buying the brass 'processed'. I have used the swager for LC/NATO 7.62mm brass as well, thus adding to the ROI. If you are priming with a hand primer - I hope you like Popeye arms....or.......get a bench primer or press attachment - You'll be glad you did.

I use a uniformer exclusively for my match brass (it's not crimped either), but I'm not expecting long life out of that brass (2x, maybe 3x max) anyway.

Hope all this helps.........
Cheers,
S

 

[markm87]

I hear what you're saying... and I agree... that LC brass gets beaten up on it's first firing with that hot 5.56 load. So it's not a precision, competition ingreedient... (although we make some pretty respectable matchking slingers out of it)

With the swager,... I guess I never got the hang of it. It's ruin too many pockets for me. I've read guy's posts that they develop a feel for the thing... and they don't adjust for each kind of brass... I just never did get the feel I guess.

I don't mind removing some material. I literally can not keep up with the quantities of .223 brass I have. If I get 3 loadings out of the brass I have now, and never pick up another piece... I'll need to live to be 300 years old to run out of casings!

 

[GrocMax]

I use large amounts of once fired 223 mil brass for PD rounds in a Dillon, I found I don't need to do anything with the crimp, maybe 1 out of 100 will be too tight when trying to seat a new primer, it gets thrown away, the brass was cheap. Found it just wasn't worth spending the time on fixing the crimps. I could imagine on 308 or other cases maybe the crimp HAS to be dealt with, but not for me on 223.

 

[Lesloan]

I bought one of these a year or so ago, and de-crimped 500 cases with it right off the bat. It's the bee's knees -- dead simple to set up & use, and does a great job. I notice that what they're advertising now is a complete kit, for both crimp removal and priming. I bought just the decrimping setup for maybe $10-12 less. You may still be able to get it that way if you don't want the repriming stuff. FWIW, I decided I needed one of these after trying a hand reamer on a mess of cases & then finding I couldn't get the primers in maybe half of them.

http://www.ch4d.com/catalog/priming/419000

 

[markm87]

I use large amounts of once fired 223 mil brass for PD rounds in a Dillon, I found I don't need to do anything with the crimp, maybe 1 out of 100 will be too tight when trying to seat a new primer, it gets thrown away, the brass was cheap.

This is true too. Much of the current "XM" ammos have such a mild crimp, it's almost not there.

 

[bmiles]

Thanks for all the good replys. I have lots of brass I am need to get done. It seems like I need to get a good swagger to get started.
Looking at midway I noticed they have a RCBS kit. It has good reviews on their website. Does anyone have any experiece with this.

Thanks,
Brandon

 

[Bob L.]

Brandon,

I have the RCBS and it works. However, when I began to reload once fired 223 in mass, I got the Dillon. It is much faster.

Bob

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

I rarely have to deal with crimp removal anymore, but the times that I do I use my RCBS Trim Mate with the military crimp removal head. It deals with the crimp in a few seconds and I use the Trim Mate for a whole host of other tasks. I have the RCBS swagger set, somewhere. I have not used it in maybe 20 years.

 

[KevinThomas]

There's one point I haven't seen anyone mention thus far, and it's worth considering; the swage methods actually do work harden the head/primer pocket area somewhat, which is a good thing. Many shooters aren't aware of this, but case makers occasionally strengthen case heads by increasing the size, depth or numbers of characters on a headstamp, just to increase this work hardening. Same thing with swagging vs. cutting to remove a crimp.

Of course, the easiest, fastest and best way to do this, is on a Dillon 1050, which swages during the reloading process. Doesn't get any easier than that!

 

[markm87]

Anyone come across those LC cases with the Stakes? I think it may be from the M855a1 variant... but I'm not sure.

 

[XTR]

I've done it with a cutter and with a Dillon. I prefer the Dillon.

 

[amlevin]

Anyone come across those LC cases with the Stakes? I think it may be from the M855a1 variant... but I'm not sure.

Yes, I have. This may be the new "standard". Staking like this doesn't deform the primer pocket as much as the full circle "crimp". Lots of foreign made 5.56/.223 has used this before LC.

 

[amlevin]

Many shooters aren't aware of this, but case makers occasionally strengthen case heads by increasing the size, depth or numbers of characters on a headstamp, just to increase this work hardening.

Ahah! Maybe this explains all the extra "dimples" on LC bras that nobody was able to adequately explain previously. I've seen comments like "this is a factory code" to "manufacturing marks on the tooling".

At least this explanation makes some sense.

 

[Shooter2112]

MarkM87 -
Oh yes I have seen stakes.......most commonly in CMP Greek M1G ammo. The dillon swager made those go away too. No problem inserting #34 primers after that. Before I swaged the stakes....forget it. I use a forster bench primer that has a ton of leverage too.