Compressed Loads and Seating Die Wear

[daj]

I've discovered that my Redding Competition Seating Die is starting to wear badly and wondered if it is because my loads are compressed.,.308W, 155 Scenars over 46.2 Varget, 104.5% Load Density)

Despite the parts being well lubricated with a light machine oil,gun oil) before each reloading session, the Seating Stem has worn a step in the Bullet Guide at the desired seating depth.

Approximately 1,400 rounds have been loaded with this die but I use a comparator and usually double or triple pass the ram while incrementing the seating depth until the COAL is spot-on.

Redding makes the point that their Bullet Seating Dies are NOT Powder Compressing Dies but I would have thought 104.5% is only a mild compression that any seater could handle.

Are the compressed loads causing the wear?

Should I lubricate the parts with a grease rather than light oil?

Is the Bullet Guide available as a spare part?,still waiting for a reply from Redding)

Thanks for any advice.

Daj

 

[JERRYHM]

This is what I found when testing the Lapua 155s in a chamber that was set up for Sierra 155's.



Lapua 155 bullet test.

The S155 bullet is 1.135” long and the Lapua is 1.280” about 0.145” longer.

Do the the height of the powder column Winchester cases were used. Lapua cases did have the room for the powder charge.Powder is Varget lot # 1029034133.
I could not seat the L155 with out vibrating the the powder charge, the powder column height was reduced by 0.120” which allowed the L155 to be seated to jump 0.015”.
The powder charge for the L155’s was vibrated to reduce the powder column so the bullet seating would not compress the powder. Without vibrating the bullets and the seating die were damaged and the OAL was not repeatable.
A 50 round loading tray was bolted on top of a vibrating case tumbler and the cases were vibrated from 2 to 5 minutes. A 0.292” diameter pin the same length of the L155 bullet was made to check the powder height, so the powder was below the bullet’s,OAL) seating depth..


.

 

[daj]

Thanks JERRYHM.

Fortunately my chamber is long throated - 2.915" OAL with the ogive just touching the lands. Powder compression is slight and there is no damage to the bullets.

I like the tumbler and powder height gage ideas. Did you add any weight to your tumbler to limit its vibration?,Last time I held a full case against my tumbler I had a mess of Varget to clean up)

Do you know if Redding sells parts for their Competition Seating Die?

 

[JohnJ]

I had notices this post on anouther forum that i go to

12667.15 in reply to 12667.1

My Redding die was sent back for repair twice. Seating stem tends to bell out when seating Sierra 77's. Message sent back with the die after the second repair was that I was abusing the die by seating heavy bullets over compressed powder charges and that they would not repair under warranty again. Bought a Forster Die and have had no problems since. Same bullets, same powder charges, same cases and several thousands of rounds loaded. I keep the Forster adjusted for the 77's and keep the Redding die set for the 80 seated out. For what it's worth, I think the Redding die was designed with lighter bench rest projectiles in mind, not the heavier rounds we use in highpower.

hopes this helps

JohnJ

 

[daj]

Thanks John,

I think you may have nailed the cause.

Although I rechecked the die and found the seating stem to be in as-new condition, the stem mouth could well be belling out under load. That is certainly consistent with the wear I am seeing.

 

[ronemus]

I used a Redding seater for a few years with loads that weren't compressed, but the stem eventually belled. I switched to a Forster Ultra Benchrest Micrometer, and have used it with no problems. The Forster stem is a better match to VLD bullets, and the combination of its geometry and metallurgy makes it less prone to problems than the Redding. I evened ponyed up the bucks to have Forster make a custom seater for a caliber that wasn't on their production list, even though it was available from Redding.

 

[daj]

Thanks ronemus.

Redding hasn't bothered to respond to any of my emails regarding replacement parts so if I have to buy a complete new seating die I will switch to the Forster.

 

[jb1000br]

Daj, call Redding and speak with Patrick Ryan...he should take care of you. If not, Forster is easy to deal with

JB

 

[ronemus]

Thanks ronemus.

Redding hasn't bothered to respond to any of my emails regarding replacement parts so if I have to buy a complete new seating die I will switch to the Forster.

If the stem is belled but not cracked, you can squeeze it in a collet,a lathe, or a Hornady CamLock bullet puller for example). That will reduce the OD and allow you to use it for a while.

 

[daj]

JB,

Thanks for the contact name.

According to our local importer/distributor, Redding has been tied up with a gun show for a week or so and is behind with their emails. He has offered to call them on my behalf to see if the damage is covered by warranty. However, from the comments on this thread so far, I may be better off trying a more robust brand - Forster ?


ronemus,

The stem is like new, not marked or distorted in any way. Only the sleeve is worn. Clearly the stem is much harder than the sleeve.


Lynn,

You painted a grim picture there.

Did the problem manifest itself in excessive run-out on the projectiles before you replaced your dies?

Like you, I approached Sinclair for replacement parts. As a rule they have always been great to deal with but on this matter their silence was deafening.
I took the hint.

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

Quite a while back a friend who is a very experienced handloader recommended Redding Type S sizing dies and Forster Ultra Micrometer seater dies. I took his advice and after reading this thread I'm glad that I did!

In my experience Redding has been less than easy to deal with in terms of customer service, while Forster has been fantastic.

 

[daj]

Update:

Redding is sending me a replacement stem and guide at no charge.

According to my Redding agent, this is a known problem with .223s and compressed loads,see Lynn's post above). First the stem splits, then the guide gets damaged.

Since mine is a .308, and the stem is good, and I am not over-compressing my loads, I am being given the benefit of any doubt - this time.

Thanks for all the feedback.