Composite Carbon Fiber Barrels

[mike a]

Anyone know where I can find a roll of thin tape that looks like carbon fiber? I'll wrap my own. Then I can hangout with the elites. Mike

 

[hogpatrol]

Anyone know where I can find a roll of thin tape that looks like carbon fiber? I'll wrap my own. Then I can hangout with the elites. Mike

Hydro dip it.

 

[284winner]

I've really liked the carbon fiber application on things that I've had, like. . . fishing poles, golf clubs and car parts. And I seriously wanted a CF Proof barrel for my precision shooting here is AZ, but after taking a close look and doing some research, the heat issue just doesn't bode well for this kind of application. But . . . for a hunting rig I'd say it's a really good thing as you can have a stiffer, lighter barrel to haul around when hunting. . . and it looks pretty cool too.

What's the actual weight difference between the PR carbon barrel VS say Rem varmint contour barrel ? Can't believe it much difference.

 

[284winner]

Anyone know where I can find a roll of thin tape that looks like carbon fiber? I'll wrap my own. Then I can hangout with the elites. Mike

I'll send you some, been doing it for years !!! Leave the first 4" and last 2" stainless barrel exposed. It'll trick'em all.

 

[bcarico]

I do not own a Proof barrel, but thought this video was interesting. He screws it off smashes a cider block then screws it back on. Lol

 

[Straightshooter1]

What's the actual weight difference between the PR carbon barrel VS say Rem varmint contour barrel ? Can't believe it much difference.

The difference is going to depend on just which caliber you're comparing. As I recall, Proof Research says their carbon fiber barrels are about 65% lighter.

Carbon fiber is substantially lighter and stronger than steel and why aircraft manufacturers are now using so much of it on their airframes and other parts (like jet engine fan blades) to make the aircraft lighter and more fuel efficient.

PS: I sure butchered that last sentence, and just couldn't leave it. Guess I got distracted.

 

[284winner]

The difference is going to depend on just which caliber you're comparing. As I recall, Proof Research says their carbon fiber barrels are about 65% lighter.

Carbon fiber is substantially lighter and stronger than steel and why aircraft is now being used for so much of its airframe and other parts (like jet engine fan blades) to make the aircraft lighter and more fuel efficient.

Yep, I knew that part but didn't really think the difference was that significant. Typically proof barrels are larger in diameter than most heavy varmint contours. Size for size yes I know the proofs are quite a bit lighter.

 

[284winner]

I'll send you some, been doing it for years !!! Leave the first 4" and last 2" stainless barrel exposed. It'll trick'em all.

Actually kidding. You may have just gave some guys input on a cheap carbon counterfeit

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I've not commented on it because I wanted to get others' opinions before I did...but I have a Cooper 21 in 7mm-08 with a Christensen barrel that shoots as well as any hunting rifle that I've ever seen. It's a tack driver. Really, a tack driver! It seems to shoot several loads very well but with what limited testing and load work I've done with it, I quickly found a load with 110gr Speer TNT's that absolutely drills holes and weighs 7-1/2lbs with a heavy Leupold Mk IV 2.5-10x scope on it. I haven't weighed it without the scope but the bare rifle is at or slightly under 6 lbs. I bought it from a friend who I helped work up that load for. I doubt it can be much better, if I spent a lot of time trying to improve on that load. It was one of the very early Christensen barrels and he never shot it except to tune it up and to hunt with a few days a year. Bore scopes very good. I think it was a factory, probably Wilson barrel, that Christensen wrapped. If wrapping it hurt anything, I'd love to have seen it before, though.
The reason I say that is that you can still see most of the number 8 of the original Cooper caliber marking on the barrel. Back then, it could've been a Wilson or even a Lilja, from Cooper.

 

[mauser284]

My "that is nonsense meter" is going off....My first degree is in Aviation Materiel and Technology! Proof makes an accurate barrel because they make an excellent cut rifled barrel. Nothing you do to the outside of a barrel matters if the bar of steel is not drilled, reamed/honed and rifled well and consistently. Ask to see double blind research or the engineering studied performed by the government or major Universities that have strong engineering programs! If I was going to buy a proof barrel it would be their all steel cut rifled version not the exact same barrel with most of it's metal removed and replaced with carbon fiber after the fact! It is just as flawed and not scientific as the idea that a short action is stiffer in a statistically significant manner or that anything behind the locking lugs counts for anything! ZERO solid research or engineering studies! You are either a person that believes in science or in voodoo but you can not be both it is an either or situation! It is marketing nonsense that makes them a lot more money. The cost to build a truck that sells for $20K versus one that will sell for $80K is about the same yet the profit margin on each is wildly different this is more of the same!

 

[mauser284]

Funny, my thinking was that clambering up and down mountains for days on end, in mountain weather, after a big ram would subject a rifle to much more wear and tear than competition.
-

No.....If all you do is hunt especialy deer sized game or larger a hunter will never wear out a barrel in one lifetime. On the other hand if you are a serious competitor you could easily wear out a barrel in 1 to 2 seasons easily!

 

[mauser284]

If I may revive an old thread (Yes, I may.):

In the latest Shooting Times are two articles about rifles with Proof Research CF-wrapped barrels - a custom built PRS rifle, and a production Nosler Mountain Carbon Rifle.

There's much prose on the positive attributes of the CF-wrapped barrels - light weight, heat dissipation, accuracy, etc. But having owned fly rods and golf club shafts made of carbon fiber, has anyone experienced or considered the effect of physical trauma - crushing, chipping, or abrasion - on the wrap's surface skin or fibers? With fly rods or golf clubs, once you damage the CF tube, even slightly (e.g. a small nick or scratch) it's likely to fail catastrophically under bending stress.

In the case of a wrapped barrel, there's a steel core to support the tube, so it's not going to fail catastrophically. But it's not unlikely that damaging the wrap could upset the vibrational integrity of the barrel, or alter the uniformity of heat transfer. Too, once there's a breach in the wrap, moisture can enter. It seems that a proper repair would be needed to extend the viability of the barrel. How does one repair a damaged CF wrap, if it's even practical to try? It's akin to mending a crack in an eggshell in my mind.
-

It is not possible for this carbon wrapped barrel to dissipate more heat or the same amount of heat faster than that barrel int he exact same profile rendered in all steel. The Delta T simply can not work that way. All you need to know is the mass and the density of the material and any high school kid that has chemistry or a college student taking 101 basic chemistry class can do this math in their sleep.In fact I recall one time in class having 60 seconds in class to solve such a problem with General Motors Big Block of heated to a specific temp being dropped into a pool of water and having to quickly compute the rate of change and how long it would take for the block to cool to the ambient temp of the water in the pool. I think I was 36 at the time it was my 2nd time going to college. So these companies count on people not knowing how to do basic math and how to compute these things to decide what is true and what is less than truthful marketing spin and buzz words!

 

[mauser284]

P.S. Carbon fiber in a stock makes fantastic sense! Carbon fiber in a barrel is not a prudent engineering call at all and not the best way to spend money in the creation of the best hunting or competition rifle!It will not hurt anything but it can not help anything either and is a waste of money if you value money or have to work hard for it. Toyota's Super Car under the Lexus brand used massive amounts of carbon fiber for the body. It did not use carbon fiber for the engine block, pistons, rods, crank shaft, transmission, engine accessories etc....Carbon fiber can be great if used wisely or it can be an exercise in waste and stupidity depending on how it is used. How you use a material matters and high tech materials do not help anything when used in a way that is not intelligent. A sword made from titanium, aluminum, ceramic, carbon fiber, cardboard, glass, stainless steel can be done but it would be truly stupid to do a sword in those materials because they are not good materials to use for a tough, durable, sword that can take a keen edge, retain that edge, and sustain the impacts and bending moments that a sword needs to do what a sword does in combat. You would not have a hard time selling a sword made from those materials because you will always have people with plenty of money that have to own what ever is trendy or in demand in spite of it not being a wise choice! Just look at all the nonsense that sells on late not TV infomercials!

 

[dmoran]

@mauser284
Carbon wrapped barrels is nothing new, that has been around a long time, and getting more popular every year.
Simple reason why; weight
Which is why they will always have a certain amount of following and a purpose, regardless of your judgement or input.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[butchlambert]

@mauser284
Carbon wrapped barrels is nothing new, that has been around a long time, and getting more popular every year.
Simple reason why; weight
Which is why they will always have a certain amount of following and a purpose.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Weight, OK, but if hunting you will be stirring the air when a heavier barrel will hold your aiming point.

 

[dmoran]

@butchlambert
Enlighten me if you would to: "stirring the air" ????

 

[butchlambert]

Donovan, I'm sure you are a hard holder, but most folks that hunt aren't using a sandbag to hold their rifle, but a light barreled rifle is much harder to hold on target than one that is heavier.

 

[Nature Boy]

most folks that hunt aren't using a sandbag to hold their rifle

I’m using a little one

 

[dmoran]

Donovan, I'm sure you are a hard holder........

Have no clue what you mean by a "hard holder" ????

..... but most folks that hunt aren't using a sandbag to hold their rifle, ......

Agree 100%.... and I don't either

.... but a light barreled rifle is much harder to hold on target than one that is heavier.

Every carbon barreled rifle I have shot and/or held up to my shoulder, were awesome to aim & hold steady with.
All of which had muzzle brakes or suppressors on them, that likely helped the balance.
One in particular that I've shot offhand, was a 26" Proof barrel with a SSG titanium V-port brake on a Defiance action and thumb-hole stock, chambered in 6.5x47. Could hold that one steady on target it seemed like forever!.... and was no problem shooting in the 10-ring at 500yds (it likely is the best feeling high-power rifle I've ever shot offhand).

 

[Brians356]

Have no clue what you mean by a "hard holder" ????


Agree 100%.... and I don't either



Every carbon barreled rifle I have shot and/or held up to my shoulder, were awesome to aim & hold steady with.
All of which had muzzle brakes or suppressors on them, that likely helped the balance.
One in particular that I've shot offhand, was a 26" Proof barrel with a SSG titanium V-port brake on a Defiance action and thumb-hole stock, chambered in 6.5x47. Could hold that one steady on target it almost seemed like forever!... and was no problem shooting in the 10-ring at 500yds (it likely is the best feeling rifle I've ever shot offhand).

Interesting. It occurs to me that a longer/heavier barreled rifle will oscillate slower, all else being equal. However, that effect does not consider the muscles and bones supporting the rifle. It's not unusual for a rifle to be barrel-heavy enough for a particular shooter's physique to induce instability and even flutters in the muscles trying to support the rifle offhand. Shooter comfort probably trumps barrel mass more often than not from most shooting positions, especially standing erect. Obviously there is a sweet spot for a particular shooter, rifle, and barrel combination, but it would be elusive to nail down objectively. You know it when you feel it, as your experience with that Defiance would suggest.
-