Coated bullets crimp

[PD Gohil]

Ready to start loading for a 329PD 44 Magnum.
My normal Ruger Blackhawk hunting load of 240gr XT with 24gr of w296 are pulling bullets.
Just ordered some hy-tek coated 240gr Keith bullets.
How do I get enough grip on the bullet without damaging the coating?

Thanks.

 

[DiffEQ]

I coat my own cast boolits. When doing it, I test by doing the "smash test" where I flatten the coated bullet with a hammer and the coating stays on the bullet. Thus, seating and crimping won't affect the coating.
I don't recall having to adjust the seat and roll-crimp, but I do so every time I set up anyway.
Nor do I recall changing the depth of the case belling.

Functionally, I couldn't tell the difference.

 

[SSL]

Increase your crimp. Coated bullets shouldn't be hurt by heavy crimps. The only real damage might be right at the crimp, but there should be plenty of coating left on the rest of the bullet body to do the job.

 

[Hoser]

Those lightweight revos will pull just about any bullet that doesent have a healthy roll crimp.

 

[cem]

You never will. More crimp is never enough to make up for inadequate neck tension. My own loads look like an area ruled F102 with a wasp waisted appearance below the bullet bulge. This requires a seating punch that fits the bullet nose so that hollow points and trick points are not collapsed. That said, the also required strong crimp implies using fresh or properly annealed brass for the tight crimp. As a bonus I get uniform ignition with 296/H110 for consistent velocity and fine accuracy.

 

[divingin]

One thing I'd suggest (if you don't do it already): Seat and crimp in separate steps (you can use the same die, but have to adjust going from seat step to crimp.) Trying to crimp while the bullet is still moving is likely to cause problems.

Also measure the case diameter below your crimp in a few spots - trying to put a heavy roll crimp on can bulge the case, ultimately reducing bullet hold (at best; it may cause chambering problems at worst.)

 

[No.343]

I used to shoot a 625 with coated bullets loaded on a progressive press. I found that the coating is more likely to be damaged by not opening up the case enough. I increased the bell of the case just enough and made sure that the bullets were going into the seating die perfectly straight. I also found that removing a bullet to check for damage to the coating did help. I used a kinetic puller for that. When going back to jacketed bullets I had to reduce bell of the case back to "normal".

 

[Ole timer]

I use a Lyman M die and a lee factory crimp die. As stated by No.343, make sure you bell the case mouth enough to not sheer any lead or coatings off the bullet. I have never seen a bullet move after using the LFC die. You can hardly pull them out of the case using a bullet puller.

 

[RegionRat]

How do I get enough grip on the bullet without damaging the coating?

You have heard some good pointers above, so I won't rehash all of that beyond the obvious which is to say the methods are the same ones, but the outcomes may be different...

To know one way or the other, (without firing tests), one has to know what level they like in the first place.

Say for example you like a regular uncoated jacketed bullet with a particular neck tension and crimp. If you have something along the lines of a K&M arbor press with a force pack, or a hydro-press, then you measure the force to move that bullet and use that as a guide.

The friction coefficient of your coating may or may not be similar to the jacketed examples, but the overall composite grip level of the stuff you like can be indirectly tested this way so you get at least some measure of what you are after. I found that jacketed Sierra bullets worked well at one level, and cast Keith bullets that were coated with moly infused powder coatings liked a different level.

Knowing that it isn't the same as the pull force but that it is far more convenient than tooling up to measure the pull force, the seating force can make a good measure for comparing friction coefficients, neck tensions, and crimps. It is an indirect method, but it is a decent way to measure the effects of those parameters.

I was able to get some great results doing things this way with a 44 mag using a taper crimp and Dillon carbide sizing die. As always, YMMV

 

[divingin]

I was able to get some great results doing things this way with a 44 mag using a taper crimp and Dillon carbide sizing die.

Hopefully not in that order...

I have seen some people try and resize loaded rounds (remove decapping stuff and run the loaded round into the sizer.) Generally, everything compresses, then the brass springs back, but the bullet doesn't. End result is the opposite of what was desired: less overall bullet hold (plus a bullet that is now undersized, but that's a different matter.)

 

[PD Gohil]

One thing I'd suggest (if you don't do it already): Seat and crimp in separate steps (you can use the same die, but have to adjust going from seat step to crimp.) Trying to crimp while the bullet is still moving is likely to cause problems.

Also measure the case diameter below your crimp in a few spots - trying to put a heavy roll crimp on can bulge the case, ultimately reducing bullet hold (at best; it may cause chambering problems at worst.)

I think this will be the biggest help to me. I called Lee and I think I was not keeping my die adjusted properly. The technician went to great length to explain to me about proper adjustment for bullet seating as well as for crimp. He also concurred that doing it in two stages was slower but would give me a much better overall product.

 

[wagonman]

You can hardy ever crimp enough to overcome inadequate neck tension on heavy recoiling revolver loads, your sizing die and expander diameter need to be so that your loaded round shows the bullet printing you can even see the lube groves and heel of your bullet kinda like a coke bottle, loading 360 gr cast for 454 casull taught me this.

 

[PD Gohil]

You can hardy ever crimp enough to overcome inadequate neck tension on heavy recoiling revolver loads, your sizing die and expander diameter need to be so that your loaded round shows the bullet printing you can even see the lube groves and heel of your bullet kinda like a coke bottle, loading 360 gr cast for 454 casull taught me this.

Hoping to find some 2400 powder, and ill give this a go! thanks