"Cleaning" a 22?

[Ohio Varmint Shooter]

When I 'clean' my 22, I don't use a brush, just a dry patch or two, then an oil patch or two, then another dry patch or two to remove any residual oil.

My Savage Mark II has been pretty accurate with CCI SV. I had heard you don't use a brush until accuracy falls off. Then after using a brush, you need to shoot several rounds (50-100?) before accuracy will come back.

I had not shot my 22 since January. Two weeks ago I took it out to fire a few rounds to see if it's still centered in order to get ready for squirrel season. I set up a target at 30-35 yards. The gun was cleaned (no brush) back in January, and should have the ever-so-slight layer of oil in the barrel. I fire the first round..and it's 4 inches below the center. The next 5 rounds are all less than a quarter size on the bullseye. (Prone, not bench rest)

It bother's me that my first shot was 4 inches low. That's a LOT for that distance. And to have the remaining shots all be on target following the first one, is even more puzzling. To have a thin layer of oil cause the bullet to be THAT much off target is odd.

I have not cleaned the gun since. Not even a dry patch. I have been out several times and have not missed a squirrel yet. I do remember last year having a few issues with consistency problems. I've been going hunting about every 4 days this month, so it's not like the gun's going to be sitting for a long time. But I'm concerned about cleaning it, and having that first shot be so off. And it could very well be the only shot of the day.

 

[JamesnTN]

That's a lot of drop for a first shot. I clean mine and even with a brush and I've not seen any impact shift on a clean cold bore shot.

 

[Tim s]

You don't have a barrel full of oil, it's full fo crud. Learn to clean it....with a brush and boreguide and solvent.
Use them every couple boxes.
Almost every benchrest gun gets cleaned on a regular basis.

 

[Shynloco]

If you are concerned about using a copper bore brush, consider using a NYLON bore brush as it will help to avoid a build up of the crud and a variety of lubricants left by varying manufactured bullets we shoot. Personally, I used to clean my Anschutz using both a bore brush, bore guide and lots of wet and dry patches. Some rifles actually like "fouled" barrels, not dirty ones. But I will say, after cleaning, my rifle usually took 20 shots before she'd start to perform up to par. And I'd clean my barrel after a match or when 100 rds had been fired.

Alex

 

[Jose_Luis_G]

I'm a prone shooter and my yearly consumption is of about 5,000 shots per year.
Anschutz 2013 with wooden stock, ss barrel and above 500,000 shots nowadays, as it has been widely used for ammo testing at the Eley and other factories.
It is quite common among us in the club, not to deeply clean the barrel. but with one or two felts, one way through, until the next session next week.
It is now a long time that we discovered that a deep cleaning with solvent, brushes, etc, wipes away the accuracy for the next 15 - 20 shots... or more.
The remains of parafine in the barrel are of utmost importance when it comes to the first shot next session.
Normal speed bullets leave very little residual of lead in the barrel, and that is a basic reason to extend the deep cleaning to some 1,000 shots.
For a deep cleaning, we use a bronze brush, one way through, carefully watching the exit of the brush at the muzzle. If the brush comes out together with a cloud of 'smoke' that means that lead is being removed.
This passes are repeated until there is no more smoke with the exit of the brush.
One more felt goes afterwards, and the cleaning is over.
Just my two cents.

 

[Ohio Varmint Shooter]

This isn't a bench rest gun. It's a $175 pencil barreled Savage. And like Shynloco said, some barrels like fouled barrels. And I've come to learn, that's usually the cheap, mass produced lower end rifles....like mine. So a deep cleaning every few boxes shouldn't be needed.

I do have a nylon brush too. But haven't used it this year.

 

[Tim s]

If you are concerned about using a copper bore brush, consider using a NYLON bore brush as it will help to avoid a build up of the crud and a variety of lubricants left by varying manufactured bullets we shoot. Personally, I used to clean my Anschutz using both a bore brush, bore guide and lots of wet and dry patches. Some rifles actually like "fouled" barrels, not dirty ones. But I will say, after cleaning, my rifle usually took 20 shots before she'd start to perform up to par. And I'd clean my barrel after a match or when 100 rds had been fired.

Alex

I personally have never seen a quality match rifle need more than 4-5 shots to settle right in. If you use quality mtch grade ammo, your barrel is " fouled" in two shots.

 

[patriot]

I agree with Tim. The barrel is warm and in match condition before I am. I clean after every outing, raised by a Marine Rifleman, whether it is a $5000 target rifle or a $200 plinker. A friend that didn't has frost at 6 o'clock with less than half the rounds down my barrel. Cleaning includes 5 or 6 one way passes with a brass brush. Plus at the start of the season I JB the throat. I friend that didn't clean deeply had a barrel go bad. When he removed the carbon ring the accuracy returned.

Mark

 

[sofarfrome]

Here is the process I follow. It came from Dan Killough. If anyone knows about cleaning rimfires it is this man. He built me a rifle last year and I follow this to a Tee. It has not failed me yet.

""One of the most common questions I receive on the phone and at the test range is "What is your cleaning procedure?"

I will share what we do and why. At the range, we clean after every 90-100 rounds. I do not have any of the data, but the engineers from Eley tell me that clean guns shoot better than dirty guns. They get this opinion from all of the data collected from the three Eley Test Ranges. They keep the test information from every rifle that has ever been tested in an Eley Test Range. When testing a rifle we note when we clean the rifle and data is collected on the fouling shots. They have crunched the numbers from this information and come to the conclusion that cleaning is a good thing for rimfire barrels. I have also drawn the same conclusion from my experience shooting benchrest. It has been my experience that every barrel loses accuracy once it becomes dirty, the point at which it loses accuracy is different for each barrel. Almost all of the competitions across rimfire whether 3-P, Benchrest, or Silhouette require somewhere between 25-100 shots before a competitor can easily clean their rifle. I also have not personally seen a rifle that could not shoot at least 100 rounds before losing accuracy due to fouling. So, we settled on 90-100 rounds in between cleanings.

Now part 2, how do we actually clean. We use a bore guide that fits the cleaning rod tightly and the bore guide does not go all the way to the barrel, it stops at the loading ramp. I like to see the rod as it goes into the barrel so I can verify that it is going down the center of the barrel. I use a Kleen Bore Jag because it is the same diameter as my cleaning rod, we use Pro-Shot 1 1/8" square cleaning patches, and we use Pro-Shot 1-Step Solvent. I push one wet patch down the barrel and remove the patch at the muzzle. I then use a Short 10" cleaning rod with a .22 caliber Nylon brush and I scrub the first 2-3" of the barrel with a back and forth motion for about 10 strokes. This is to remove the combustion ring. I then push more wet patches until they come out clean. Typically this is about 4 patches. If we are still shooting the rifle, then I finish with a dry patch. If we are finished shooting, then I finish with a wet patch. I have bore-scoped many .22 barrels and I have not found one yet that the nylon brush would not remove the combustion ring. In the past, I used a bronze brush, JB Bore Cleaner, or Iosso polish. They will remove combustion ring, but JB and Iosso are both removing metal from the barrel. They are removing very, very, little metal, but they are removing some. I do not believe the bronze brush will damage the barrel, but many people do not like to use bronze brushes on rimfire barrels. Now the Nylon brush could not possibly damage the barrel and I know it is getting the job done, so that is what I use.

Also, if you are testing your rifle with us and you have a different cleaning regimen, we will be happy to follow it for your rifle. It is your rifle, and we will do everything we can to accommodate you.

I hope you find this information helpful. Perhaps it is not the best cleaning regimen, but it has served me well. We only shoot lead bullets and the forces for a rimfire are not what a centerfire rifle is subjected to. Cleaning the rimfire is relatively easy and can be done in just a couple of minutes and I think it is extremely beneficial for accuracy. If you are not currently cleaning your rifle on a regular basis, I strongly urge you to do so.

Until Next Time,

Dan Killough""

 

[TheOtherZilla]

I rarely clean my 22's.. And when I do I use some Hoppe's #9.. 69 years old and that has been my habbit since I was a wee lad.

 

[SBS]

You can never expect the first shot from a clean barrel to impact in the same spot as one that is well fouled; certainly not close enough for head shots on a squirrel. Even well broken in match barrels need some fouling after cleaning before settling down. Poorer quality barrels often require more fouling shots to settle in. You might benefit by bedding your squirrel rifle. Unbedded rifles (particularly new) often shift in the stock from handling and may be a cause of excessive zero shift when first being shot after cleaning and can add to the non-fouled barrel impact shift.

 

[patriot]

You can never expect the first shot from a clean barrel to impact in the same spot as one that is well fouled; certainly not close enough for head shots on a squirrel.

Ever chronograph the first shot out of a fouled barrel? All will become apparent. Clean or dirty, you have to know your hold off.

Mark

 

[SBS]

Ever chronograph the first shot out of a fouled barrel? All will become apparent. Clean or dirty, you have to know your hold off.

Mark[/QUOTE

Not necessarily true with match rimfire barrels. I've shot many match targets where the first shot out of a fouled barrel hit where the following rounds did -- no hold off required. Centerfire barrels are in a different category as they heat up very quickly and go from cold to warm/hot in a hurry, and I do have a slight shift in zero in the first few shots even with a fouled barrel -- and it is a match grade barrel also.

 

[stork]

I've enclosed a copy of a post (and a link) I made on GunTalk-online about 5 years ago. Thread was started by a shooter having issues with CCI SV ammo.

Still holds true.

Here's my post.
Stork

"Your accuracy experience with CCI SV definitely is contrary to my own. I religiously shoot CCE SV for matches because it always goes off and will shoot under 2" with EVERY 22 target pistol I own and under 1 1/2" with 7 out of 8. Including 3 Hi Standards and 5 Rugers.

May I suggest scrubbing out your bore. I used to be an adamant proponent of never cleaning the 22 bore, but a test I did last winter changed my mind. My shots were just not on call. I was recuperating from rotator cuff surgery so I wasn't sure at first. Then I did a 2 handed rest from the bench at 50ft and you can see the difference after I scrubbed out the bore (see link). This was the same pistol, same shooter, same box of CCI ammo, same night.

I hadn't scrubbed out my bore for (guessing) 40-50,000 rounds so there was a lot of buildup and yours may be a lot less. Just a thought.

http://s838.photobucket.com/albums/zz30 ... %20fouled/

FWIW"

Link:
http://www.guntalk-online.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3211&highlight=cleaning

 

[Fotheringill]

Perhaps I have been lucky. A clean gun is a happy gun for me. I clean when I see a difference in accuracy, generally 100-125 rounds. A bore guide is important. There are dozens of products out there that will "more or less" do the same thing. It takes me 10-12 fouling shots to return to center bull. First shot is always about 1.5" high and at 1 o'clock then creeping to the center. I am sure there are people out there who never clean and are happy with MOS (squirrel). If you are shooting targets and/or in a competition, you will see what others are doing. Lead buildup is one thing, carbon is quite another and is going to adversely affect accuracy sooner rather than later.

 

[patriot]

Not necessarily true with match rimfire barrels. I've shot many match targets where the first shot out of a fouled barrel hit where the following rounds did -- no hold off required.

I have a 1913 that was re-barrelled by Anschutz that shoots the same zero at 50 feet until the barrel is too fouled, but not at 100 yards where the velocity has more of an effect on vertical. It would be fun to run you rifle(s) through the chronograph.

Mark