I don't know if you read The Riflemans Journal, but Mr.Salazar has a article on setting up your chronograph. Sorry its not a direct answer to your question, but it might lead you to consider a lower cost model. He (Mr.Salazar)was using a shooting chrony in that article, and I don't recall him stating anything negative about it. I know he uses and owns other chronograph models, but I'm sure that particular line of chronys is less costly than the ones listed. I personally only own and use the Oehler and it does all I need. I don't have experience with any of the other chrony's and am not saying those are bad. Mr. Salazar was extremely helpful in answering any questions I had with some set up issues. Hope this helps you.
chronograph recommendations
- Thread starter Hydenseek
- Start date
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GLC said:
Gary, every year at SHOT Show I beg and plead with Werner Mehl, the PVM's creator to:
1. include an integrated, rechargeable battery pack that resides inside the receiver housing.
2. provide a simple data output to a USB device (netbook, iPad, and/or smart phone).
I told Werner: "We don't need a zillion options in the software. I want to be able to: a) Title and date the string; b) Record all data in string; c) get auto-calc of Average, SD, and ES." It would be nice to be able to delete particular entries, but that's not all that critical because it's so rare to get an error. An export function to a spreadsheet would be nice too, but again, not essential. Clearing strings, changing strings, changing gain can all be done pretty easily (and reliably) with the current remote control (though you will have to carry around a "cheat sheet" to remember what all the buttons do,
).Werner listens patiently, frowns, and tells me -- "The software is fine. The problem is with the Windows operating system." Hmmm. Maybe developing an iPhone or Android App would be easier then, who knows....
Hi Steve
thankyou for your your kind offer, I have limited software knowledge and expertise, I did persevere with the software on my first PVM 21 (i am on my 3rd! more on that in a minute) however I ended up preserving my sanity and resorted to writing the data, maybe I should revisit this and perhaps take you up on your kind offer, it would be nice to have software that was easy to use and not require hours of head scratching though.
now regarding qty 3 PVM21's, as Jaychris says the screens are very brittle, no1 was destroyed by my own clumsiness (i keep it in a top cupboard (safely i thought) until I lost hold of it.. shattered into several pieces which i glued and taped together, however the sensor must have been damaged so bye bye, no2 was again my fault for not extending my tripod legs for full stability, a large gust of wind destroyed it, so no3 is working fine, just like the rest, this is over a period of 5 years or so, maybe I am just unluckly or more accurately clumsy!
Its a great unit, the only chrono that has given me consistent results and readings,( i have a collection of PACT, Shooting Chrony and CED)
regards
Gary Costello
p.s wasn't aware of any software upgrades so any info on this would be appreciated.
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jaychris said:
Jay, have they changed the voltage on the unit? In 2010 Werner told me the PVM display/receiver could not be powered by the USB connection in ones laptop because the voltage is inadequate. The PVM receiver needs 12V, but a USB outlet only supplies 5 volts max. Even a two-port bridged outlet wouldn't give enough volts. There is a way to do a voltage step-up, but as electrical engineer Kelly Bachand explained to me, voltage stepup is very inefficient.
What would be great is if an in-housing battery could be removed and recharged (like my camera batts), and the data outputed directly in REAL time to a USB device.
What would be even greater is if the unit could run on 5 volts and draw USB power from a Tablet or netbook just like my portable hard drives do.
-------
To Steve regarding the software -- It's great its worked for you. I've successfully installed the software and drivers on to a half-dozen windows machines. I can use 90% of the functions. However with the majority of the machines, we have found that we can get the software launched, and it starts to record, but then, at some point, maybe after ten rounds, maybe after 50, the software will lock up and/or crash. JayChris assures me the raw data is retained in the machine, but then if you want the data for your use AT the range, you need to resort to writing things down.
I have found it easier, faster, simpler and more reliable to bring pencil and paper and write the numbers down. I don't want to have to download the numbers from the receiver box at a later session.
forum Boss:
your reply crossed with my last post.
at least you now get a 12v battery cable cable included and you can buy a battery at a local electrical shop!
a pretty ironic thing happened as I approached the Necos stand at the show, guy on it was trying to get his laptop to connect with the PVM 21! (been there done that came to mind)!
your reply crossed with my last post.
at least you now get a 12v battery cable cable included and you can buy a battery at a local electrical shop!
a pretty ironic thing happened as I approached the Necos stand at the show, guy on it was trying to get his laptop to connect with the PVM 21! (been there done that came to mind)!
Forum Boss
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GLC said:
Gary, yep a small 12v brick battery works fine, but an integrated rechargeable battery (like on a camera, portable phone etc.) would be more convenient. It would be wicked cool if the unit could be powered off the USB on my tablet. According to Werner, the power drain is minimal, but the voltage is (currently) incompatible.
Also sent you a PM on unrelated matter.
Jay Christopherson
Not An Admin
To clarify: I took the poster to mean "can capture data continuously via USB", not "can power the unit via USB". Certainly, you cannot power the controller via USB.
Forum Boss said:
Jay Christopherson
Not An Admin
Forum Boss said:
You can do a, b, and c right now pretty easily, right? When you import the data via USB into the table, it auto calculates Average, SD and ES. You can select/deselect particular entries and the calculations are automatically redone. That's pretty much the only thing I use the software for since it's just about the only straightforward function.
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jaychris said:
Jay, your points are well-taken. But I would like that data available from the controller (or a printer like the Oehler) so I could have the "crunched numbers" immediately on finishing the string, without having to tote a laptop to the range or download later. The PACT, Shooting Chrony, CED, and of course the Oehler 35P give you all this info as soon as your string is done, without having to export/import to a separate device. If I need a separate device for import/display, a smartphone or small tablet would be ideal.
The only chronograph I have been around is my bottom of the line Shooting Chrony. As long as I shoot through the middle of it and it is not in the shadows I get readings. My problem with it is on occasion I have set it up and shot through it all day and as the sun moves across the sky my velocities change with it. I can see 100-150fps difference in the same load shot at say 9am and 4pm with the set up never being moved. I think it has to do with the angle of light source (the sun) and I'm curious if the 35p suffers the same kind of "handicap" since it doesn't use an IR screen. I have came very close to buying a 35p more than once but have resisted so far. Setup time doesn't bother me that much but consistency does. I also wonder if on the PVM-21, do you have to put something over the top or sides of it to block the sun for it to work right or does it work just like it is?
Jason
Jason
Paul,
Just out of curiosity: what are you doing with this information at the range?
Just out of curiosity: what are you doing with this information at the range?
Jason,LRPV said:
The PVM-21 does not change reading, regardless of light conditions. It would work in total darkness. The infrared source and receptors are oriented laterally and seem completely unaffected.
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sleepygator said:
What the data shows me (at conclusion of string) helps me make a decision whether to keep testing. If, for example, ES is real bad, I might try altering the powder charge, change seating depth etc. (we are able to load right at the range)
Or, when I get lucky and bugholes coincide with good chron data, I know the job is done and it's time for a beer! ;D
Basically having the data immediately available is like what car race teams are doing now. Car comes in, techs check the sensor data, and they might change suspension setting or FI map or wing setting and back out on the track they go to test a new config.
With real time ES, SD and Average I can make the most of my time at range.
nar0107,
You asked what is the best bang for your buck, so the answer has to be the Shooting Chrony. I've had a Beta Master for years, and it does everything I need it to do.
You just have to honestly ask yourself "Just how often am i really going to use it?" I use mine to work up a load with a new barrel, then to check said load about once a year and that's it. I don't need to spend mega bucks for all the bells and whistles so the Beta Master does what I need it to do. Some guys shoot over thier chronograph EVERY time they go to the range, that's ok, but it's just not for me.
Danny
You asked what is the best bang for your buck, so the answer has to be the Shooting Chrony. I've had a Beta Master for years, and it does everything I need it to do.
You just have to honestly ask yourself "Just how often am i really going to use it?" I use mine to work up a load with a new barrel, then to check said load about once a year and that's it. I don't need to spend mega bucks for all the bells and whistles so the Beta Master does what I need it to do. Some guys shoot over thier chronograph EVERY time they go to the range, that's ok, but it's just not for me.
Danny
The manufacturer refers to them interchangeably. Here is a link to the product brochure. You'll see what I mean.johara1 said:
http://www.kurzzeit.com/kurzzeit_PVM%202008%20e.pdf
jscandale said:
Is it safe to assume you have/had a Pact XP and don't like it?
I have one and it's great. An XP Professional with IR sensors. Works every time. Doesn't care about lighting like my cheapie Shooting Chony which would quit working when the Weather Forecast changed.
One thing that may help with the PACT, I did read the instructions rather than just assuming I knew everything.
No assumptions made, read the directions. When the chronograph does not register shots and then goes into an electronic loop that it cannot recover from, I doubt it is from not understanding the directions.amlevin said:
When the unit is sent back to Pact for repair and then starts acting up shortly after it is returned, I highly doubt it is from assuming that I knew everything.
When I talk to others who have had the exact same problems, the only assumption that I would make is that I was a sucker for buying a substandard product without having read the poor reviews on most of the retailer websites.
I also tried the IR screens as recommended by the manufacturer, resulting in the same unusable results.
When you talk to the manufacturer about fixing the unit, all they want to do is boast about how it's made in America and how it couldn't possibly any fault on their part. Frankly, their insistence on an American made piece of junk insults me as a flag waving American who bleeds red, white, and blue! It is strong evidence of the mentality of why other countries are beating the hell out of us in the manufacturing sector.
I have even given the arrogant manufacturer the benifit of the doubt and returned it at cabelas for another that shortly acted the same substandard way. I have used the Oehler, excellent, used others that also got the job done, but not 2 Pacts, one of which has been back to the factory for "top notch" American service. As much as I hate to say it, my Chinese made CED Millenium has worked flawlessly for 5 years in any light condition.
So, my friend, maybe you should know the facts before accusing someone of not knowing how to work a simple piece of electronics. If you have to go to school for engineering, which I did, to know how to work a chronograph, I don't want it and would try to spread the word to every possible person I could in the hopes of saving them some of the trouble that I have been through.
I have even gone to such lengths as calling the manufacturer every couple of months to let them know of all of the people that I have shared my information with so that they would not suffer from the same extortion that I have. Naturally, my admission fell on deaf ears on their end which just made me realize something. Throughout time, people have bought such things as Edsels and pet rocks, which proves PT Barnum's theory on suckers. After I came to grips with that reality, I let my animosity go, but I'll still share my story.
JS
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