choice of rifle

[Ed333]

I am a member of a club with a 600 yard range, however you are not permitted to shoot from 500 or 600 yards until you have passed a qualification course. I have done the classroom portion, the shooting day is in a couple of weeks. I had planned on using my Savage M.12LRPV in .204 Ruger for that, but now have been advised that no bullets lighter than 70 grains are permitted from the 600 yd line. (I knew .204 Ruger was not a great choice for F-Class, but was going to wait and learn more before jumping to a different calibre.) There are two lightly used rifles available locally, both .223 Rem, with a 1:9 twist, priced about the same. One is a Savage 12LRPV left port (actually don't know if that one is a 1:9 or a 1:7) and I am of course familiar with the features of that, including the adj. target accu-trigger. The other is a Remington 700 XCR Compact Tactical, which has a Bell & Carlson stock, full length alum. bed. , adj. trigger.
I figure with a 1:9 twist I can go up to a 73 gr. bullet. I would trade my .204 Ruger towards this acquisition. Any clear preference as to these two rifles?
I should add that I am not even sure that I will be able to devote the time needed for semi-serious F-class shooting, or if I will even want to, I am drawn to too many different disciplines, not enough time, not enough money. But I do want to be able to shoot at distance when i feel like it.
Grateful for any advice.

 

[bozo699]

Ed,
Welcome to the forum, in your case I would opt for the Savage because of the ease of changing things around if you change your mind or needs change and they are quite accurate, if your sure you know what you want you can buy many bolt on's and many have won with a Remington action also the accutrigger is junk and no one makes a superior trigger for it, SSS or basic triggers are about as good as you can get, there good but no Jewel like you can get for the Remington, there are a lot more stock and bolt options for the Remingtons as well. My son shoots a modified Savage 12lrpv and does quite well with it.
Wayne.

 

[Cort]

Ed,

You could add a .223 Remington barrel to your Savage .204 Ruger and have both worlds. You are already accustomed to your M12LRPV so making a switch barrel rig out of it is as simple as buying an aftermarket barrel, a Savage nut wrench, an action vise and a set of go/no-go gauges in .223 and in .204. You could then shoot whichever caliber you wanted with one rifle.

You might consider a 6 X 47 or some other caliber based on the .378 bolt face. It is also easy to change the bolt head on a Savage bolt and convert your current rifle to 6BR or .308 or … and then back again.

Cort

 

[effendude]

+1 on Cort

Get a Criterian barrel in .223 from Jim Briggs, with go/no go gauges for the .223, a wrench and you are ready to go. Less than $450 invested and you have 2 rifles.

You can take the barrel and rifle to a smith, have them install and headspace it for .223 and you don't need the gauges. Once you loosen the nut of your .204 bbl, mark the depth or count threads, then you don't need to have .204 gauges if you decide to reinstall it in the future. Same thing with the .223.
Scott

 

[bozo699]

Ed,

You could add a .223 Remington barrel to your Savage .204 Ruger and have both worlds. You are already accustomed to your M12LRPV so making a switch barrel rig out of it is as simple as buying an aftermarket barrel, a Savage nut wrench, an action vise and a set of go/no-go gauges in .223 and in .204. You could then shoot whichever caliber you wanted with one rifle.

You might consider a 6 X 47 or some other caliber based on the .378 bolt face. It is also easy to change the bolt head on a Savage bolt and convert your current rifle to 6BR or .308 or … and then back again.

Cort

I also have to agree with Cort on this,...best of both worlds for sure, good idea cort.
Wayne.

 

[Hoier]

I'm with the rest of these guys. I have(had) a LRPV in 22-250 but took the barrel off and put on a Benchmark 6br and now am shooting 1k and 600 with it. Just about anything is possible with the Savage but like Wayne said there is no great triggers for them. I just sent mine to SSS and got there Evolution trigger and it is good but not great.

 

[sav12lrpv]

I have a Savage 12 lrpv with 6BR factory barrel which shoots very well after 2300+ rounds. I recently got another barrel for it and have it set up to switch barrels easily with a vise and rear entry action wrench. I got a lot of help with the barrel switch idea from an article by Norman E. Johnson originally published in Varmint Hunter Magazine. It is readily available on the web. Just search under Savage model 12 barrel switch and maybe add Norman's name. Too bad I have to put up with that sub-standard accutrigger. My best group so far was .114 at 100yds. Average 5 shot groups are in the 3's

Stick with the Savage. You can get any barrel(s) you want.

 

[skeetlee]

You have to take a class to shoot 600 yards. That sucks! I though Illinois had some crappy laws. Weird! Lee

 

[MrMajestic]

Remember also that you are not restricted to the .378 bolt face as they are cheap and swap out easily! Many shooters, and Winners, shoot that 6mm thingy! :

 

[boa454]

mate id go with the remongton, it sounds like its been tuned a bit already for what you want and the 700 is a great action, my 22-250ai and 6.5-284 are built on the 700 and i love them, as wayne said it doesnt get any better than a jewell trigger, only question id have is how well has the rifle been looked after?

 

[ColWhitecakes]

First, I'd look for a different range that wasn't run by Nazis. Then, if your hankering for a new rifle, and who doesn't, I'd go with the Savage, for many of the reasons previously mentioned. Otherwise, go with the rebarreling of what you currently have. I'm a believer in the Savage system myself. I could be wrong, but I've never really heard of people having to spend close to a grand blue-printing a Savage. Also, I guess it may be because I have never shot with anything "better", but my accu-trigger rocks. It breaks at 1 1/4# with absolutely no creep. For myself, if it was any lighter, I'd start having accidental discharges. Maybe if I shot from a bench, lighter would be ok; but, from prone, I like to feel my trigger before it releases.
In reality, I think perference of actions is mostly a personal thing. Kinda like a Ford vs. Chevy musclecar kinda situation (where Chevy always wins, of course).

 

[Bob R]

If I am correct he is shooting at the St Louis Bench Rest Club. They had a subdivision built over the back side of the main impact berm. A ways off, but still over the berm. They have a mountain for an impact berm, but the class is a Safety Check to make sure you have any business shooting that far from what I am told.
Trust me there are lots of folks with hunting rifles who have no business shooting that far without going to the class.
Then you have the folks who want to shoot pop cans and milk jugs on the ground, and not targets set infront of the impact berms. The class I am sure addresses this issue also.

For F-TR you need either a 223 or 308. Anything else and you are shooting in F-Open against the big boys.
I built a Remington 700, because I had a 700 with a 223 bolt face to build on.
Mine has a 26" 1/7 Brux barrel. I set it up for an economy Multi Range F Class, 600 Yard F Class, Sniper Match, Varmint/Tactical 600 Bench Rest, as well as a Coyote Gun. I am running 2 Log Book Drop Charts one for 90 grain Bergers for serious work. I have to load them single shot. My second Drop Chart is for 77 Sierras that will magazine feed from my AI magazine. Handy for Varmint hunting and tactical matches.

If I were going from scratch and did not already own the 700, I would build a Savage for all the reasons listed above. The Savage is very easy to switch barrel at home in the shop. Now days you have a good choice in stocks and AI Magazine Comversions. They have a great laminated factory stock. Dual Port, etc. Buying new you can buy a Savage Dual Port Target Action with Target Trigger as cheap as a doner 700 that you break down to get an action, and you still will need a trigger more than likely. Show up at a Bench Rest Match at our Club. Take away the aftermarket Custom Actions, and you will have almost all Savage Based guns left.

Bob

 

[Ed333]

Update: I have shot my first F Class match, 3 strings at 600 yds, using a borrowed .308, with Hornady 168 gr. Superformance A-Max rounds, having fun. The .308 started out as a Savage F/TR, and the owner re-stocked it with a Savage F Class open stock, but adding an F/TR cheekpiece and a tapered piece of wood on the bottom of the rear portion of the stock to better fit the rear bags. I have ruled out .223, and the universal local advice is to go for a Savage 12 F-Open in 6mmBR. However, I find these to be scarce; plenty of back-order situations with unknown waiting times. The other currently available calibre for the model 12 F Open rifle is 6.5-284, and there are plenty of these available, some at good prices. I have been warned about the short barrel life on the 284, but am also considering the advice on the ease of barrel changes for the Savages. Thinking of going ahead with the .284 just to get shooting, and if I have to replace the barrel down the road, it won't be hard to do, and it's only money. Gotta sleep on this again, but I want to get out there shooting, and it isn't fair to be keeping my friends .308 all summer long. I think I have found my Tribe.

 

[MrMajestic]

Good for you! Sounds like a good time had.

 

[JASmith]

I am still baffled about the bullet weight restriction. I do know that folks do compete with the 20 BR and do well on calm days. That 55 gr Berger does a good job.

Having said that, have you looked at the .260 Remington or the 6.5 Creedmoor? I know a couple of F-Class shooters who use the .260 a fair bit. They like it because the caliber gives good performance at distance while somewhat reducing recoil fatigue.

I've also looked at the .243 Winchester and am curious about why more folks aren't using this caliber for their long-range shooting.

 

[sdneil]

Bob R--I dont think ED 333 is talking about St. Louis Benchrest Club he seems to be in Maine--but you are right, there are shooters who have no business shooting at 500-600 yards with out some serious instruction!!! STL BR CLUB is making members take a class and qualify to shoot out past 200 yards.... Neil G member STLBR CLUB

 

[peterf225]

I like the choice of the F class savage.

As far as the range class, our local club here in south LA requires a safety class before shooting 300+ yds on the 600 yd range because of new buildings being built on the back side of the safety berm. Also it's required to have another person in the pits when shooting 300+ yds.

 

[jr600yd]

260 is a wonderful caliber and will take you from 100yd to 1K. Felt recoil is about 20% less than a 308 and the 6.5's have a wide choice in bullets and excellent bullet BC's. Many a 600yd match has been won with this caliber. Barrel life is good, about the same as a 308.

The main problem with the 243 is barrel life. Like the 6.5/284 in a hunting rifle where you only shoot 20 or so rounds a year it will last you a lifetime. In a competition rifle only 1 season.