Cheytac barrel life ? How many rounds ?

[Mission shooting supplies]

If you shoot a cheytac 375 do you feel it’s over boar .?Do you think there is a lot of unused case capacity but you are reaching max pressure signs . Which powder gives best fill ratios and good velocity? Hay I know that’s a lot of questions im trying to make some decisions cheytac/ lots of power or 375 enabler / witch seems under powered any one ?

 

[Kurz]

For those who haven't seen a dimension drawing for the .375 CheyTac:

 

[SmokinJoe]

The barrel will still be going strong long after your shoulder gives up .

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

For those who haven't seen a dimension drawing for the .375 CheyTac:

View attachment 1303998

Hi thanks fo the case drawings. Did I miss something or did you just send the drawings did you have some additional information or comments I’m hoping someone with a cheytac will give some insight into actual experience. I have a 416 and 50 BMG and 338XC tubs an improved 338 lapua necked down to 7MM . But never had an opportunity to reload and shoot a 375 cheytac. It’s a great cartridge but it appears that a lot of guys are experimenting with it as new wild cats .

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

The barrel will still be going strong long after your shoulder gives up .

Do you have one , if so how many rounds down the barrel? When tubs designed his 338XC-/and 375XC he said he illy got about 500 rounds before barrels was gone ?? Then MR enabler B Lutz also talked about cheytac being over boar and not utilizing powder capacity . two guys that may have a conflict of interest because they are selling a different cartridge than cheytac . So I’m looking to hear about actual use experience

 

[SmokinJoe]

I apologize for wasting some of your thread here making a little funny. I shoot small cartridges, most of which take less than 20 grs of powder, so this thing would be like artillery to me. You must shoot extremely long ranges, or at least be interested in doing so. Good luck with your endeavor.

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

I apologize for wasting some of your thread here making a little funny. I shoot small cartridges, most of which take less than 20 grs of powder, so this thing would be like artillery to me. You must shoot extremely long ranges, or at least be interested in doing so. Good luck with your endeavor.

Hay no worries it’s all good ! I think one of the 50BMG primers uses about 20 grs ! HHa I’m trying to do some long rang shooting tough to find a 1,000 yard range or even better a place out in the woods . But load development and punching holes in paper with those big dogs is fun have a great new year Mike mission shooting supplies

 

[std7mag]

Local guy had a 408 Cheytac he was selling.
Had 50 rounds down the tube.
When i asked him about barrel life i was told 1,200-1,500 and the barrel was toast.
I should have bought that rifle on the spot! Yeah, the deal was THAT good! And i had the money at the time.
I couldn't get past the money it took to feed it, nor the fact i had no place to shoot it.

 

[Kurz]

I couldn't get past the money it took to feed it, nor the fact i had no place to shoot it.

These are probably the two biggest reasons that many folks forgo starting out in Long Range and ELR shooting. Bigger actions, longer barrels with larger diameters, expensive brass and forget about the scopes and prisms. The costs add up quickly and are relentless.

Now if you have to travel to shoot, include the cost of gas/diesel just to get there and back along with the time off from work and family.

Hi thanks fo the case drawings. Did I miss something or did you just send the drawings did you have some additional information or comments

The drawing was included because CIP was having some disagreement about dimensions. I think it's important for the folks who aren't conversant with the CheyTac case, to actually see just how big it is. It ain't no 6PPC!

I've shot the .338 SnipeTac, 33XC, 375 CheyTac, 37XC, 416 CheyTac and a handful of others in the quest for longer range accuracy. I started with the .338 'Edge', one which was based on a chamber I designed and not the commercial Edge. Both make a superb hunting cartridge with properly designed bullets and a barrel long enough to make use of the powder capacity. Some of this longer barrel thinking has been tempered by a desire to try working with shorter barrels and suppressors.

Trying to quantify barrel life is simply a game of anecdotal information passed down by folks who may or may not understand how to interpret the interior condition of a barrel or knowing just when the groups start to fall off for which reason.

Far too many like to resort to mathematical variations on a theme in an attempt to quantify all sort of things including barrel life. In reality, there are far too many variables which have a detrimental effect of barrel life, e.g. I had a .416 barrel which went absolutely south after 52 shots using acceptably mild loads. The problem was not the load or the cartridge but the barrel steel itself. Now, should we castigate this cartridge as being supremely overbore and add this number of shots into a math equation? No. I sent it back to the steel maker who sheepishly admitted it was from a batch of milder steel earmarked for another end user. He replaced the whole 20 ft. stick as an apology.

Mild, slower, cooler powders will usually make for longer barrel life when we tryout a new to us large capacity case. But they work better as far as velocity is concerned when you use a longer barrel. Are there exceptions? Sure. Someone here will tell us just the opposite, happens all the time.

Here is a load:



https://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/08/17/rifle-reloading-data-my-pet-loads-for-target-and-hunting/

Scroll down for .375 CT load.

This is from 2019 this forum:

https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/load-data-for-375-cheytac.3980380/

From another related source:

http://www.californiapredatorsclub....3912-load-development-for-a-2-mile-cartridge/

Enjoy the process!

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

Local guy had a 408 Cheytac he was selling.
Had 50 rounds down the tube.
When i asked him about barrel life i was told 1,200-1,500 and the barrel was toast.
I should have bought that rifle on the spot! Yeah, the deal was THAT good! And i had the money at the time.
I couldn't get past the money it took to feed it, nor the fact i had no place to shoot it.

That’s encouraging . Man heart breaker on missing a good deal but it’s hard to find a place to shoot out far enough to justify the expense and to really use a gun like that . But they are sooo cool . Thanks for the input Mike mission shooting supplies

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

These are probably the two biggest reasons that many folks forgo starting out in Long Range and ELR shooting. Bigger actions, longer barrels with larger diameters, expensive brass and forget about the scopes and prisms. The costs add up quickly and are relentless.

Now if you have to travel to shoot, include the cost of gas/diesel just to get there and back along with the time off from work and family.



The drawing was included because CIP was having some disagreement about dimensions. I think it's important for the folks who aren't conversant with the CheyTac case, to actually see just how big it is. It ain't no 6PPC!

I've shot the .338 SnipeTac, 33XC, 375 CheyTac, 37XC, 416 CheyTac and a handful of others in the quest for longer range accuracy. I started with the .338 'Edge', one which was based on a chamber I designed and not the commercial Edge. Both makes a superb hunting cartridge with properly designed bullets and a barrel long enough to make use of the powder capacity. Some of this longer barrel thinking has been tempered by a desire to try working with shorter barrels and suppressors.

Trying to quantify barrel life is simply a game of anecdotal information passed down by folks who may or may not understand how to interpret the interior condition of a barrel or knowing just when the groups start to fall off for which reason.

Far too many like to resort to mathematical variations on a theme in an attempt to quantify all sort of things including barrel life. In reality, there are far too many variables which have a detrimental effect of barrel life, e.g. I had a .416 barrel which went absolutely south after 52 shots using acceptably mild loads. The problem was not the load or the cartridge but the barrel steel itself. Now, should we castigate this cartridge as being supremely overbore and add this number of shots into a math equation? No. I sent it back to the steel maker who sheepishly admitted it was from a batch of milder steel earmarked for another end user. He replaced the whole 20 ft. stick as an apology.

Mild, slower, cooler powders will usually make for longer barrel life when we tryout a new to us large capacity case. But they work better as far as velocity is concerned when you use a longer barrel. Are there exceptions? Sure. Someone here will tell us just the opposite, happens all the time.

Here is a load:

View attachment 1304362

https://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/08/17/rifle-reloading-data-my-pet-loads-for-target-and-hunting/

Scroll down for .375 CT load.

This is from 2019 this forum:

https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/load-data-for-375-cheytac.3980380/

From another related source:

http://www.californiapredatorsclub....3912-load-development-for-a-2-mile-cartridge/

Enjoy the process!

Thank you .! Great insight on barrel life and usable information. And your closing statement ( enjoy the process) says it all . some times I think designing and putting all the components together and working up loads for accuracy is as much fun as a great day if shooting thank you sir Mike

 

[mikecr]

Far too many like to resort to mathematical variations on a theme in an attempt to quantify all sort of things including barrel life.

Yep

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

These are probably the two biggest reasons that many folks forgo starting out in Long Range and ELR shooting. Bigger actions, longer barrels with larger diameters, expensive brass and forget about the scopes and prisms. The costs add up quickly and are relentless.

Now if you have to travel to shoot, include the cost of gas/diesel just to get there and back along with the time off from work and family.



The drawing was included because CIP was having some disagreement about dimensions. I think it's important for the folks who aren't conversant with the CheyTac case, to actually see just how big it is. It ain't no 6PPC!

I've shot the .338 SnipeTac, 33XC, 375 CheyTac, 37XC, 416 CheyTac and a handful of others in the quest for longer range accuracy. I started with the .338 'Edge', one which was based on a chamber I designed and not the commercial Edge. Both make a superb hunting cartridge with properly designed bullets and a barrel long enough to make use of the powder capacity. Some of this longer barrel thinking has been tempered by a desire to try working with shorter barrels and suppressors.

Trying to quantify barrel life is simply a game of anecdotal information passed down by folks who may or may not understand how to interpret the interior condition of a barrel or knowing just when the groups start to fall off for which reason.

Far too many like to resort to mathematical variations on a theme in an attempt to quantify all sort of things including barrel life. In reality, there are far too many variables which have a detrimental effect of barrel life, e.g. I had a .416 barrel which went absolutely south after 52 shots using acceptably mild loads. The problem was not the load or the cartridge but the barrel steel itself. Now, should we castigate this cartridge as being supremely overbore and add this number of shots into a math equation? No. I sent it back to the steel maker who sheepishly admitted it was from a batch of milder steel earmarked for another end user. He replaced the whole 20 ft. stick as an apology.

Mild, slower, cooler powders will usually make for longer barrel life when we tryout a new to us large capacity case. But they work better as far as velocity is concerned when you use a longer barrel. Are there exceptions? Sure. Someone here will tell us just the opposite, happens all the time.

Here is a load:

View attachment 1304362

https://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/08/17/rifle-reloading-data-my-pet-loads-for-target-and-hunting/

Scroll down for .375 CT load.

This is from 2019 this forum:

https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/load-data-for-375-cheytac.3980380/

From another related source:

http://www.californiapredatorsclub....3912-load-development-for-a-2-mile-cartridge/

Enjoy the process!

Your 338 Edge ? What powder capacity did you use, was it based on a parent cartridge, do you still hunt with it ? Sounds like you’ve had experience with a bunch of the cheytac bigger and smaller type long range guns . What is you favorite for target at 1000+ yards Did you find the cartridge that did what you were hoping for ?? Have you shot the 375 Enabler or have you heard any feed back either way regarding its performance ? I put out a question regarding load data or experience with the enabler and received no response. I felt there was maybe a valid mid ground between the cheytac and the enabler depending on case design . With the targeted powder capacity being right in the middle . My thoughts were a shorter fater case , less body taper , a 30 degree shoulder and a long neck to allow for heavy/ long for caliber bullets with a rebated rim to make it compatible with the 640 cheytac rim size actions . Ive designed the reamer ( mason ) built it , RCC is doing the brass . Gun is built , brass week or two out still . I was thinking I could use start load for cheytac and max load for enabler to arrive as a mid point ( maybe) a good comparison for a starter load for my new case ? Always a nerve racking first round trigger pull ! I recently designed another new 375 cartridge based on a shortened 50 BMG case ( 2” ) , That uses 150/160 grs powder , same rim as 416/50 cases . It was a great success and tons of fun ! You can see it at mission shooting supplies .I can’t thank you enough for your help and the leads to additional information . Do you have a project in the works for long range shooting ? Hope your new year is an exciting adventure! Thanks Mike

 

[Kurz]

The .338 Edge and Edge +P are the creation of Shawn Carlock. He has these designs protected so we as the general public do not have direct access to the designs without buying from Shawn. No biggie, Shawn's entitled to compensation for his hard work.

https://defensiveedge.net/338-edge-p/

https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.338+Edge.html

I started working with the RUM cartridges the minute brass was available. The original .338 RUM was slightly shorter than the .300 RUM but most of us side stepped this by necking up the .300 RUM cases and working from there.

Some data from Berger:



The current trend towards modifying your long action for the longer boxes allows seating some of the longer bullets and the solids out a little further in an effort to increase the case capacity of the Edge (.300 RUM Improved) case. I work with bigger actions instead especially for longer range target shooting. I keep the hunting rifles in the approximately 3.600" boxes since so many of the hunting bullets are cup and core which results in slightly shorter bullets. I don't find many needs to exceed the 250 grain bullets either. Most hunting here in the U.S. doesn't need more power than what the .338 Edge can supply with the 250 grain bullets. If I want a 300 grain Match bullet I go with a bigger cartridge. Yes I still hunt with the Edge when I have the opportunity and the need.

ADG makes headstamped .338 Edge brass but there is a bigger selection of .300 RUM brass which is used with modifications to provide the .338 Edge cases. Case capacity varies with the original manufacturer used. Shawn states that his brass measures 118.2 grains of H2O capacity. I've had some fireformed brass run just a tad more but it's insignificant.

The .338 and 375 EnABLER are fine cartridges but I have different ideas which I use.

In general, right after the release of the 7mmBR and ultimately the 6mmBR cases, it was all the rage to develop any cartridge using the short, fat concept. The release of WSM and RSAUM case spurred even more experimentation. Some worked well while others worked but could be matched by currently existing cases. We shortened the .338-378 Weather case but found little to shout about when tested. On and on...

Enjoy the process!

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

The .338 Edge and Edge +P are the creation of Shawn Carlock. He has these designs protected so we as the general public do not have direct access to the designs without buying from Shawn. No biggie, Shawn's entitled to compensation for his hard work.

https://defensiveedge.net/338-edge-p/

https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.338+Edge.html

I started working with the RUM cartridges the minute brass was available. The original .338 RUM was slightly shorter than the .300 RUM but most of us side stepped this by necking up the .300 RUM cases and working from there.

Some data from Berger:

View attachment 1304643

The current trend towards modifying your long action for the longer boxes allows seating some of the longer bullets and the solids out a little further in an effort to increase the case capacity of the Edge (.300 RUM Improved) case. I work with bigger actions instead especially for longer range target shooting. I keep the hunting rifles in the approximately 3.600" boxes since so many of the hunting bullets are cup and core which results in slightly shorter bullets. I don't find many needs to exceed the 250 grain bullets either. Most hunting here in the U.S. doesn't need more power than what the .338 Edge can supply with the 250 grain bullets. If I want a 300 grain Match bullet I go with a bigger cartridge. Yes I still hunt with the Edge when I have the opportunity and the need.

ADG makes headstamped .338 Edge brass but there is a bigger selection of .300 RUM brass which is used with modifications to provide the .338 Edge cases. Case capacity varies with the original manufacturer used. Shawn states that his brass measures 118.2 grains of H2O capacity. I've had some fireformed brass run just a tad more but it's insignificant.

The .338 and 375 EnABLER are fine cartridges but I have different ideas which I use.

In general, right after the release of the 7mmBR and ultimately the 6mmBR cases, it was all the rage to develop any cartridge using the short, fat concept. The release of WSM and RSAUM case spurred even more experimentation. Some worked well while others worked but could be matched by currently existing cases. We shortened the .338-378 Weather case but found little to shout about when tested. On and on...

Enjoy the process!

The 338 edge you are talking about that you are fire forming to achieve the additional case volume. Have you ever tried the hydrolic case forming dies . I was thinking about using one on an improved 338 lapua that I necked down to 7 MM sounds like a great way to save on powder ,bullets ,and barrel life . I would have to agree that elk , Mose and maybe some bears don’t need the bigger guns . But they are sure lots of fun to build . You said enabler and cheytac are fine BUT you have a different idea of what you would use . Can you share your ideas , I was hoping for some new fresh thoughts and ideas . What would you use or build, and I’m thinking long range paper punching kind of cartridges ? With the latest cartridge just being developed by some of the big names in amo and firearms . And there designers seem to be more the fater case type at least when compared to longer older cases that have the main stay for years. Is it a fad , and they are going down that road because people think that’s what they need . and they are just feeding the market? You said that some of the cartridges showed no improvements, did you mean just no increase in velocity , or accuracy as well ? what about the thought that a compact ( shorter) column of powder burns more consistent, have you noticed smaller ES in velocity with short fat cases ? There are so many different factors involved im not sure how to quantify the result let alone the questions . But sure make for a great discussion . I have heard it’s the journey not the destination that brings us joy!

 

[Kurz]

I have heard it’s the journey not the destination that brings us joy!

Here is a link to a fun discussion (little) and list (61) of those who have found this phrase useful as a need to express their attitudes:

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/08/31/life-journey/

I used a similar quote on the first day of teaching new classes in order to help the students to understand the idea. Some did, others merely wanted the destination...

I do fireform rather than use the Hydraulic Method of case forming. I make a fireforming barrel specific to a cartridge and chamber. I'm afraid of melting when I get splashed by water! It's just a choice that I'm more comfortable with.

For me, it's easier to work with other parent cartridges than the .338 Lapua. I chose the .300 Norma Mag. as the basis for a 7mm cartridge several years ago with a friend who wanted to pursue this idea. It's slightly improved but with a 35 degree shoulder. Nice cartridge and great for the longer range hunter. I still shoot it occasionally. Gunwerks also brought one to market using the .300 PRC case. The brass has been the hold back in this instance.

With the latest cartridge just being developed by some of the big names in amo and firearms . And there designers seem to be more the fater case type at least when compared to longer older cases that have the main stay for years. Is it a fad

Some will be labelled as fads when we get a better perspective a little further down the road but a few will prove out the design by actually performing up to the expectations of the crowd. The difference is that the discarded designs were not fully vetted by the designers and manufacturers before release but rather were just following the trend hoping to make a bunch of money easily. Others worked out quite well and provided shooters with an improvement over the original choices. No matter which, the short, fat cases become an important part of our journey.

The concept of short/fat cases has been explored for several decades now. Some were pushed to extremes of diameter as well as length. The unfortunate discovery of unburned powder at the junction of the case wall and base of the head indicated that the extreme had been reached and we needed to regroup.

As to new ideas and cartridge development, there is a small group of tenacious shooters who think they have the answer to a particular improvement. They stimulate the rest of us into working through to a potentially better idea or the original one proves out. Either way the shooting community wins.

I'm still fascinated by the process as a part of the journey. Arriving at the destination can be a little bit of a let down.

 

[Mission shooting supplies]

Here is a link to a fun discussion (little) and list (61) of those who have found this phrase useful as a need to express their attitudes:

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/08/31/life-journey/

I used a similar quote on the first day of teaching new classes in order to help the students to understand the idea. Some did, others merely wanted the destination...

I do fireform rather than use the Hydraulic Method of case forming. I make a fireforming barrel specific to a cartridge and chamber. I'm afraid of melting when I get splashed by water! It's just a choice that I'm more comfortable with.

For me, it's easier to work with other parent cartridges than the .338 Lapua. I chose the .300 Norma Mag. as the basis for a 7mm cartridge several years ago with a friend who wanted to pursue this idea. It's slightly improved but with a 35 degree shoulder. Nice cartridge and great for the longer range hunter. I still shoot it occasionally. Gunwerks also brought one to market using the .300 PRC case. The brass has been the hold back in this instance.



Some will be labelled as fads when we get a better perspective a little further down the road but a few will prove out the design by actually performing up to the expectations of the crowd. The difference is that the discarded designs were not fully vetted by the designers and manufacturers before release but rather were just following the trend hoping to make a bunch of money easily. Others worked out quite well and provided shooters with an improvement over the original choices. No matter which, the short, fat cases become an important part of our journey.

The concept of short/fat cases has been explored for several decades now. Some were pushed to extremes of diameter as well as length. The unfortunate discovery of unburned powder at the junction of the case wall and base of the head indicated that the extreme had been reached and we needed to regroup.

As to new ideas and cartridge development, there is a small group of tenacious shooters who think they have the answer to a particular improvement. They stimulate the rest of us into working through to a potentially better idea or the original one proves out. Either way the shooting community wins.

I'm still fascinated by the process as a part of the journey. Arriving at the destination can be a little bit of a let down.