Chassis question

[Alex Wheeler]

These new custom actions sure look pretty darn straight to me.

We used to have this thing that was used for quality checks when I worked for Fujikoki We made aluminum condenser blocks for Toyota vehicles. They would put it inside this machine and it would touch about 10,000 different places and tell you how close the part was to spec. We used to hold tolerances on the critical dimensions to something like a tenth of a micron.

I would really like to have one of those and I cannot remember what the heck it's called. Then I could take all these parts and measure them and tell everybody what is straight and what isn't straight.

As far as I can tell from reading a lot of the posts in gunsmith forums, is that the only straight parts are the ones that come from the gunsmith themselves. Every other part is pretty much crooked until it leaves their shop. But that's just my observation.

While they may look straight, they wont measure straight. They cant. I have consulted with numerous manufacturers and this is one of the biggest hurdles to overcome. Steel moves when you cut it. Some will hone the ID to straighten the bolt way, but not many will worry about the od.

To your last comment, your observation shows your lack of understanding in this area.

 

[urbanrifleman]

While they may look straight, they wont measure straight. They cant. I have consulted with numerous manufacturers and this is one of the biggest hurdles to overcome. Steel moves when you cut it. Some will hone the ID to straighten the bolt way, but not many will worry about the od.

To your last comment, your observation shows your lack of understanding in this area.

Oh, I understand a bit.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Perhaps a CMM=coordinate measuring machine

Yes!!!!

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Oh, I understand a bit.

I'm sorry, you do not.

You said everything is crooked until it leaves a gunsmiths shop. Not true. You cant straighten an action. Once the action is made you cant fix warpage or holes that wander from center like inside a bolt. What you can do is deal with them so they wont effect accuracy.

You may convince some that everything is perfect out of the box, but these issues are well known.

 

[urbanrifleman]

I'm sorry, you do not.

You said everything is crooked until it leaves a gunsmiths shop. Not true. You cant straighten an action. Once the action is made you cant fix warpage or holes that wander from center like inside a bolt. What you can do is deal with them so they wont effect accuracy.

You may convince some that everything is perfect out of the box, but these issues are well known.

What I was talking about is marketing.

Not actual engineering facts.

I suppose sarcasm loses something in forum discussions.

Ps: I'm not trying to "convince" anyone of anything. I'm not sure about other people though. I have read gunsmiths that never had an action enter their shop that didn't need to be "trued". It's kind of a thing.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

What I was talking about is marketing.

Not actual engineering facts.

I suppose sarcasm loses something in forum discussions.

Again, wrong. I charge less for going through an action than chambering a barrel. It takes longer to do the action. I wont do an action unless I do the barrel or rifle too. You dont get it. You dont do the action because you want to, you have to if you want the rifle to do well. And thats the real advertising.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Again, wrong. I charge less for going through an action than chambering a barrel. It takes longer to do the action. I wont do an action unless I do the barrel or rifle too. You dont get it. You dont do the action because you want to, you have to if you want the rifle to do well. And thats the real advertising.

Well, you keeping doing you, bro.

Just FYI, I wasn't talking about you. Although you seem to think I am (for some reason).

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Well, you keeping doing you, bro.

Just FYI, I wasn't talking about you. Although you seem to think I am (for some reason).

No, I dont know who your talking about. But, I have been trying to get people to understand that the action matters a lot more than it used to be given credit for. Thats key. If guys spend the time there, they will make good guns.

 

[rijndael]

FWIW: As someone with no dog in the fight, I read this like Alex did. If you're intending sarcasm, it's definitely not coming through.

 

[urbanrifleman]

No, I dont know who your talking about. But, I have been trying to get people to understand that the action matters a lot more than it used to be given credit for. Thats key. If guys spend the time there, they will make good guns.

Ok. Got it.

 

[urbanrifleman]

FWIW: As someone with no dog in the fight, I read this like Alex did. If you're intending sarcasm, it's definitely not coming through.

There's no fight.

I don't bed actions into stocks, or true them, or sell that service (and don't want too). Soooo... I literally have "no dog in that fight".

Full disclosure, I do sell chassis and stocks with aluminum blocks. They shoot quite well. I haven't seen that they needed bedding. We are doing a few tests to see if any improvement is realized. One or two customers have bedded in the blocks and said they saw an improvement. Hundreds of others (including some top shooters) did not bed.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Recently MPA has added a recoil lug tension system to their chassis. They claim it shoots better. Although they never made any specific claims.

 

[rijndael]

Recently MPA has added a recoil lug tension system to their chassis. They claim it shoots better. Although they never made any specific claims.

I just got one with my MPA Pro chassis, I planned to test it out. It took me a while to figure out what it was since it ships from the factory like you bought it used ... no marketing material, instructions or anything else.

 

[urbanrifleman]

I just got one with my MPA Pro chassis, I planned to test it out. It took me a while to figure out what it was since it ships from the factory like you bought it used ... no marketing material, instructions or anything else.

I totally agree I never knew what it was for. One of my customers told me and I went and got the little plastic baggies out and started testing it

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Ya, no fight at all. Just two different view points

 

[SGT. Slaughter]

Is there ANY accuracy downside to a chassis?

Specifically, would an action such as a BAT be less accurate in a chassis then if the same action was properly mounted in a McMillan BR stock?

I am thinking about a new rifle and not sure what direction I want to go so I would like to leave some options open.

I would like to shoot at least 600 yards but I am not finding a place within an hours drive of home where I can shoot more than 200 yards. That doesn't look to be likely to change in the forseeable future so for the time being it is 200.

I'm thinking a BAT action, probably 6 BR although I am not ruling out 6 PPC.

Thanks!

There's been 3 new pending records shot at 600 yds In the tactical gun class this year sent in to the records committee and 2 shot at 1000 yds in the tactical gun class this year that was sent in to the records committee shot at Red White&Blue in Tennille Georgia shot by Mr. Ronnie Milford with a chassis rifle that he built in a 6br. I would say that not only will a chassis rifle shoot with a regular br stocked rifle you can set records with those chassis rifles. Ronnie Milford can shoot with the best of the best and win while setting records with the rifles he's building! Congratulations Ronnie Milford!

 

[Fuj]

I won't tell anybody what to do or what's wrong or what's right
but, I'm a chassis guy. I work mainly with MDT chassis and mod
what I think needs modded for a particular rifle then take it to a
match for testing. I do not bed anything on a v-block nor do I
bed the lug. If the action is fubar in it's outer dimensions, I don't
really care, but I do take that action and wrap crocus around it and
rub it back and forth on the v-block to remove any burrs. After that
I go and start my load development. The one I'm working on now
Will shoot in the two's easily and this last batch of ammo I tuned
with it made it in the ones, and I took a second at the last 300 yard
UBR match. I'm doing things that are so far out of the box the guy's
look to see what I brought this month. Bottom line is, I take a Savage
PTA with it's stock red blade stock accu trigger and start hanging
stuff under it......It's a fun journey. This coming weekend will be a
major test for it......Heading back out to the shop. I have a new pistol
grip design modification that needs looked at......Stay Tuned !!

 

[mfendley]

I just got one with my MPA Pro chassis, I planned to test it out. It took me a while to figure out what it was since it ships from the factory like you bought it used ... no marketing material, instructions or anything else.

There are full instructions on their web site. https://masterpiecearms.com/parts-drawings-manuals/

 

[mfendley]

I just got one with my MPA Pro chassis, I planned to test it out. It took me a while to figure out what it was since it ships from the factory like you bought it used ... no marketing material, instructions or anything else.

Sort of marketing - Phil walks through all of the features here:

 

[rijndael]

Thx. I did Google it when I found no directions.