Case length question/trim-to-length dimensions

[MarTay6]

I'm new to reloading, getting set up to reload 6.5 Creedmoor, and am a little unclear about case trimming- as far as the dimension to trim brass length to.
Looking at the dimensions of the round, I see the case length listed as 1.920", and in some resources, see a trim length of 1.910". I'm assuming/guessing that means the maximum length should be 1.920", and when I trim it- trim it to 1.910"- am I correct?
I'm still trying to figure out the best method for trimming cases to length- Lee doesn't make a spindle for their case length trimmer for 6.5 Creedmoor- I could special order one, but need to give them the dimension for the spindle- and not sure which dimension to give them.
Or if there's a better way to go than the Lee?? Open to suggestions and recommendations. Pretty much have the neck trimming/sizing figured out- planning on going with a K&M expander- and either their neck turner or the PMA. Planning on using a drill to drive the operation.
Thanks for any advice!
Wes

 

[IrishJim]

Hi Wes.
Lee does have them, they are listed under New Products, then Case Conditioning. http://leeprecision.com/gauge-holder-6.5-creedmoor.html
I believe MidwayUSA also carries them for your 6.5 Creed at the same $5.98 price. You may already have the cutter and lock stud that come with a lot of the Lee press kits, if not you will need those as well. That Lee Case Trimmer is manually operated, and okay for trimming a few cases at a time but I imagine it will get tiring with any volume. I have not used one, but the spindle comes pre-set for the case length. Once you put it together and insert a case, it will either cut a long case to the correct SAAMI length, or it will not cut because the case is good to go. I do not know your rifle situation, but if it is a factory rifle perhaps neck turning may be more than is needed for a factory chamber, and I might suggest a Lee Collet Neck Sizing die to get you started. It will deprime and size the neck, maintains your fire-formed dimensions, does not stress your brass, does not require any lube, and is cheap. I have no stock in Lee, I am just trying to suggest some inexpensive and easy tools to help get you started into loading for your new 6.5 Creedmoor. Congratulations, and have fun with your new equipment! Jim

 

[RickyNY]

Wes, I have the Lee cutter and lock stud and 3 different spindles for my cartridges and I got to tell you they have worked very well for me. They cut exactly to the trim length every time. Ricky

 

[MarTay6]

Thanks for your help, Guys- I located the spindle with your help.
Thanks!!
Wes

 

[Sniper338]

Are far as finding your max length for your brass in your chamber... there are inserts made to use with a cut back piece of brass... personally i find max length nothing to worry about...

Personally.. i measure all my brass... the trim to the shortest one... them keep that measurement written down to always trim to with that brass...

 

[MarTay6]

Personally.. i measure all my brass... the trim to the shortest one... them keep that measurement written down to always trim to with that brass...

Which, of course, you could not do with a fixed pilot cutter such as the Lee... any other suggestions??
Also- should new brass be trimmed/neck expanded/neck sized before shooting???
In the case of the 6.5 Creedmoor- Hornady brass. BTW, the build is a custom build- a Savage Single Shot Target action, tuned/trued, with a Bartlein barrel, Evolution trigger... action/barrel by Fred- at Sharp Shooter Supply. Stock by Alex- at Master Class- Whidden aluminum bedding block/pillars in the walnut stock. Believe the chamber is a no-turn chamber.... PTG reamer.
Wes

 

[Sniper338]

Yeah thats true... kinda hard with lee stuff..

 

[amlevin]

Which, of course, you could not do with a fixed pilot cutter such as the Lee... any other suggestions??

Lathe type case trimmers are great if you want to trim to a non-standard length. I've used an RCBS trimmer for years just recently replacing my old "collet type" to a new one with universal case holder. I also have it equipped with a 3-Way Cutter which I've upgraded by adding a carbide cutter. Not only do I trim to a desired length, but I also Chamfer and de-burr at the same time. So easy that I can trim after every firing which insures that every case has a nice square mouth on it.

FWIW, letting your brass grow so it fills more of the chamber has the benefit of reducing the amount of room that carbon can fill at the end of the chamber. Measure the chamber length first (Sinclair sells a simple tool) and leave about .010" for safety. Just trim frequently if you do this. Most "trim to" lengths assume that the case will only be trimmed once and will be discarded before it exceeds a safe length for the rifle.

 

[MarTay6]

Could you give me a reference to that chamber measuring tool you referred in your post??? Thanks!
Wes

 

['Freak]

Sinclair Chamber Length Space Gauges, order #749-000-783 for a 6.5mm.

 

[gotcha]

The tool olefreak refers to couldn't be used with the lee trimmer stud. The case must be shortened at the neck considerably in order to use the Sinclair gauge. You'd need an adjustable trimmer to yield a shorter case. Can your Smith provide you with a reamer drawing ?

 

['Freak]

A hacksaw works well enuf. He’ll need a different trimmer anyways, one that’s adjustable allowing the trimming of cases to a specific length less than the measured length of his chamber.

 

[MarTay6]

Thanks. Found the case length gages. And understand the concept behind them. The rifle is chambered with a standard PTG 6.5 Creedmoor reamer... so it would be their standard reamer as I understand.
Looking at the Wilson case trimmer, I see they use individual case holders unique to the cartridge. The thing I don't quite understand, is they have case holders for new brass- and fired brass... I do not see a holder for fired brass in 6.5 Creedmoor- only a new brass trimmer. Some calibers they list both.
???
Wes

 

['Freak]

Sinclair item numbers for Wilson Trimmer Case Holders, 6.5 Creedmoor, fired brass case holder # 749-001-791, and new brass case holder # 749-001-792.

 

[Ackman]

Many don't know any better and shorten their brass using the "trim to" length in a reloading manual. Before you even think about trimming cases, find out how long the chamber is. Get a plug from Sinclair. And when you know the chamber length you'll wish you could add length to the cases instead of removing it. Standard chambers can be .025" - .030" or more longer than brass. Meaning there's that much chamber neck diameter between the casemouth and where the leade starts. The last thing you want to do is increase that distance by making the brass even shorter. I think "trim to" length is actually a minimum length, and to not go any shorter.

 

[gotcha]

+1 for olefreak and Ackman. But, keep in mind that SOME cases (like 6 BR) The fired case holder will trim BOTH fired and unfired brass. Anyone use a 6.5 Creed fired case holder that could confirm they accommodate BOTH fired & unfired cases??????.............. Why buy two case holders if one will do?

 

[tcoz]

Trim-to length is often 0.010 under max case length and lies somewhere between minimum and maximum. If you trim to that length you'll find that you don't have to trim again until after a few firings.

 

[Brians356]

Trim-to length is often 0.010 under max case length and lies somewhere between minimum and maximum. If you trim to that length you'll find that you don't have to trim again until after a few firings.

Trim-to Length is almost always midway between Minimum and Maximum Case Length. I'm not aware of an exception.

What I am aware of is a vendor, Nosler, who feels it admirable to trim 223 Rem cases shorter than Minimum Case Length, and in fact a full .015" shorter than Trim-to Length. So for those present who like to leave cases longer than Trim-to Length (since most chambers do permit that) you might want to avoid Nosler brass. Forewarned is forearmed.

 

[MarTay6]

Thanks for all the great responses here, guys- you have greatly enhanced my understanding of what's going on with case length. I spoke with Wilson yesterday and got the part numbers for the 2 different holders, and placed the Wilson trimmer and the shell holders on order. Also the Sinclair plug for measuring case length. Think I should be just about set! Will be interesting to see where my Hornady brass falls when I start measuring everything. At least I know what direction I'm headed in.
Thanks again!
Now if someone could just tell me where to find the time in my busy schedule to do all this! :
Sheesh, I retired- and now have less time than when I was working! Of course, it might have something to do with the fact I worked a 4 day work week before I retired, and now have a part time job working 5 days a week! WTH????
Wes

 

[Brians356]

Also the Sinclair plug for measuring case length.

Actually, it measures chamber length, but since it delimits maximum allowable case length, it's a not inapt description.