Bolt Single-shot vs. Bolt Repeater in Long Range Tactical

[58weasel]

The responses to a previous post about a Ruger No. 1 as a tactical rifle were very interesting.
Here is one for you.
For long range tactical, given the advantages of the single-shot bolt action for precision shooting, does the advantages of the repeater fade? Or is that extra slot in the repeater really not so adverse to action stiffness, and racking the brass into the chamber really not so adverse to accuracy? Note the target sizes in F-Class vs High Power.
I personally (as a reloader) am inclined to the single-shot by a considerable margin.

 

[Smalltruck]

If its a run & gun type match where time limits are short the single shot is at a big disadvantage.

 

[CatShooter]

The responses to a previous post about a Ruger No. 1 as a tactical rifle were very interesting.
Here is one for you.
For long range tactical, given the advantages of the single-shot bolt action for precision shooting, does the advantages of the repeater fade? Or is that extra slot in the repeater really not so adverse to action stiffness, and racking the brass into the chamber really not so adverse to accuracy? Note the target sizes in F-Class vs High Power.
I personally (as a reloader) am inclined to the single-shot by a considerable margin.

I built two M-24 Clones, a 308 repeater, and a 300 Win Mag single shot. Built the 308 first for the Carlos Hathcock matches, and our team got our clocks cleaned by a Swedish team with 300-WMs

So I built the 300-WM. There was no disadvantage using a single shot. There was a BIG advantage with the 300-WM on the 1200 meter "E" targets.

 

[flatlander]

The theoretical advantage of a more rigid single shot action vs. a repeater is no match for the ease & speed of reloading from a magazine when you're under time limits. A well-made repeater isn't going to give up much in the way of accuracy to a rifle built on a single-shot action - at least, not enough of a difference to make up for not getting all your shots off in a timed practical match where there are no scoring rings on the steel targets. And every shooter I've seen who's serious about competing in these matches uses DBM for quick magazine changes, along with 10rd magazines when needed. All my competition practical rifles are repeaters with DBM.

OTOH, all my LR prone rifles for conventional NRA prone matches are single shots. When I started doing my own barrel & action work, I bought commercial aluminum single shot plates & glued them into the bottoms of my M700 actions with Devcon. Made feeding single rounds into the bbl easier, though I don't know whether it increased the rigidity of the action by filling in the magazine cut-out or not. Today, all my prone rifles are built around custom single shot actions with coned breeches - but I'd hesitate to bet money that they're measurably more accurate than the best of the old M700-based rifles.

 

[Eric Leonard]

I dont shoot matches but my tactical rifle is a Stiller Tac 30 repeater,28 inch 8 twist 6.5x47L shooting 130 VLDs at 3025 ,stock is AICS 1.5 with Atlas bipod and spigot mount,,I shoot from 5 and 10 round AI 308 mags and out to 1200 or so is an absolute hammer,,

 

[Minesweeper3433]

My limit is 800 yards. Inside of this for "tactical" type matches a repeater is better at least for me. Past this however I will always be willing to pay a little time to have a little more accuracy and precision on my side instead of a fast follow up shot. So if the match is going to be shot at all stages inside of 800 I leave the single shot at home. If any stage might be shot further I bring my single shot.

PS my really long range gun is a repeater action in a repeater stock however it is only shot single shot as the rounds don't fit into the magazine.

 

[CJ6]

If its a run & gun type match where time limits are short the single shot is at a big disadvantage.

I've saw a young lady run 10 rnds in 20 seconds at 1000yds and do NOT too shabby with a SS Bat..

 

[Bindi2]

If its a run & gun type match where time limits are short the single shot is at a big disadvantage.

Right hand bolt extraction left hand port loading dosent give any thing away using a rest and rear bag

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I have never seen a trend that single shots are more accurate than mag fed actions. I also dont know where the stiffer the better theory came from when it come to all things rifle related.

 

[dantiff2]

I recently shot at a local "tactical" style match. I only have the internal box mag that holds three rounds and can't express how much of a disadvantage I was at. Most courses of fire required 10 rounds down range in a limited time. I could get a few accurate shots off but having to break hold and position to fumble for more ammo and throw it in single shot after the initial three rounds was a pain in the a**. Most guys were running ten rounds and had time left over with ease while I was trying to load under pressure and stress. Make sure you have a mag fed gun, I would suggest to get a couple different capacity mags like a 5 round and 10 round. It is a fun game but your only hurting your chance at success with a single shot.

Dan

 

[CatShooter]

I have never seen a trend that single shots are more accurate than mag fed actions. I also dont know where the stiffer the better theory came from when it come to all things rifle related.

Me neither...

I think it comes from "intuition"... more steel, less holes mean stiffer - and since Bench matches require single loading, the mental jump to assume is obvious.

But the advent of left/right ports, and bottom eject receivers quickly discredit that "theory" that one port is better than two.

 

[dantiff2]

I also want to add that my Savage bolt gun will run in single shot mode all day long at the range or under no stress. I can throw a round in and it lays on top the feed lips and runs into the chamber like butter. I can tell you what happens when you are in very tight time window under stress with your heart rate above 120 bpm is another story. Throwing the next round into the chamber meant it was crooked and tip down and sideways and every which way that would jam the bolt up!! Never had an issue like that before but trying to run and gun changes everything Get a detachable mag

 

[FatBoy]

My most accurate rifle is probably a 6BR on an old Ted Williams M70 long action. Even out to 1k. It gets it's azz handed to it by wind, but will still hold excellent elevation. It was a repeater. I have about a half a dozen solid bottom actions, all custom, and though they all have attributes that make me like shooting them more than my old factory actions, they are no more accurate. GAP built me a 6.5x284 repeater on a M700 LA with a 26" barrel that was awesome at 1000y it's entire 850 round life ;/

You have to build within the rules, to take advantage of every option you can without cheating. If that means a repeater, built a repeater and enjoy it. Best to have a safe full of choices ;D

 

[Minesweeper3433]

If its a run & gun type match where time limits are short the single shot is at a big disadvantage.

Right hand bolt extraction left hand port loading dosent give any thing away using a rest and rear bag

You don't get a rest and rear bag at tactical matches usually. And usually your off hand is trying to hold your rifle on what ever sort of contraption that has been decided for you to shoot off of.

 

[Smalltruck]

I also want to add that my Savage bolt gun will run in single shot mode all day long at the range or under no stress. I can throw a round in and it lays on top the feed lips and runs into the chamber like butter. I can tell you what happens when you are in very tight time window under stress with your heart rate above 120 bpm is another story. Throwing the next round into the chamber meant it was crooked and tip down and sideways and every which way that would jam the bolt up!! Never had an issue like that before but trying to run and gun changes everything Get a detachable mag

Saw this at a recent tactical match I was an RO for. When the timer is ticking and you are moving, a single shot is screwed. Not from an accuracy standpoint, but from a to many things going on at once.

CJ6 if you are shooting the SAME target each time then that really helps. But the same 10 shots done 2 at a time from 600, 725, 900, 1000, and 1330 means you won't get that done in 20 seconds even from an AR platform

 

[Dgd6mm]

If you have ever been to a tac match where you shoot a 8"mover at 500- 600 yards, you know you better have a repeater. That thing goes at whatever speed they set it on, usually 4-6 mph. It comes out from behind a safe house travel 50 yards, go back behind another safe house, come back out and travel back to where it started from. 10 rounds and sometimes they make you have a mag change. You are not doing this with a singleshot successfully.

 

[CJ6]

CJ6 if you are shooting the SAME target each time then that really helps. But the same 10 shots done 2 at a time from 600, 725, 900, 1000, and 1330 means you won't get that done in 20 seconds even from an AR platform

Totally agree on that.

 

[Lapua40X]

IMO, given the fact that a properly bedded action has a recoil lug to "stiffen" the action against flex in recoil, there is no real advantage to a single action over a magazine fed rifle in competition. My single shot rifles work fine in competition where twenty rounds in ten minutes is the rule. But five rounds in under a minute is pushing it - really pushing it. For those two reasons I'm voting for the magazine fed rifle.

 

[Scott Harris]

I have never seen a trend that single shots are more accurate than mag fed actions. I also dont know where the stiffer the better theory came from when it come to all things rifle related.

+100

We have always used repeaters in mid-range and long-range F-class and never had any problems achieving the same level of accuracy as single-shots. We glue a single shot follower into our F-class stocks, which gives us the option of using a repeater setup with the same action and different stock.

 

[22BRGUY]

Usually, an advantage of a single shot is that you can build longer OAL reloads and chamber them without the length limitations of magazine length reloads and whatever advantages that may offer ( ex: a bit more powder capacity available). Pros and cons to everything.
Best Wishes