bipod problems....?

[TresMon]

So my new found coach is telling me at least half my problems @1K from prone & pod isr my technique.

I'm way ahead of the learning curve on the windage stuff when there is no wind, but what in the world is up with all this elevation? I'm shooting 9 ring @ 6clock then a 9 @ 12, then a 8 at 6clock and on and on. I'm getting Vert, dispersion sum-thin fierce!

Shots are breaking clean on the "X" with any driver error clealry seen & called.
criver and spike his AR adviser are saying it's bipod technique, or lack of.

So I read the online article "bugholes from bipods" again. The only flag i got was I'm using mostly a free recoiling technique, but then again it's a .223.

so I will try a consistent hard hold when I can get back to the range, and some more load refinement across the chrono as well. Any thing else?

Thanks,

 

[gunnermhr]

.223 at 1K??? Whats the group size?? What Bullet? If you want to be serious about 1K shooting I believe you'll want more gun! Usually vert at 1K means you need more powder.

 

[TresMon]

gunner:

Yes I know I need a lot of things, all requiring $$$$$. I'm unemployed and looking hard for a job. BUT since i have no job at the moment, i have a lot more time for load refining, gaining experience, practicing,. Bugging Criver, etc. etc.

so working with what I have currently on hand= is basis for the question. Besides, to use an old cliche' train hard, fight easy. If I learn to drive my 20" .223 gas gun at 1000 as best I can, I might actually be pretty competitive in f-class when i can afford a 6.5 sumthin or .280 Ackley bolt gun.

To answer your questions. I'm to the point where when you put me, the rifle and the ammo all together we can average 1.5 - 2 moa @ 1000, sometimes slightly better but not the norm. sometimes worse too!,f-class style optics & bipod for the scrutinizers)

75 & 80 A-max is what I'm using running "way to hot" minus 1 %,80 Amax @ 2830 +/- fps)

So what was you contribution on bipod technique?

Thanks,

Tres

 

[js223]

Definitely check the consistency,ES and SD) of those 80 A-Maxes. I tried them in a 20" AR, milder load than yours though. A short 5 shot string had an ES of 110fps! Ouch. That would cause vertical problems.

Also, don't use free recoil if you're practicing for F-Class. The rules say that the rifle will be fired from the shoulder, might as well get used to doing it that way.

 

[gunnermhr]

The contribution to Bipod technique is, I don't think that is where your problem is. If you are shootong 1.5MOA at 1K with a 223 I think you should be happy. That is why I asked the other questions.

No offence intended!! You asked for help and I'm just tryn'. Like JS223 said High ES is very bad at 1K. USUALLY MORE POWDER cures it. In a 223 I would be very happy with a 15" group.

Sorry!!

 

[memilanuk]

Some guns and/or setups from bipod can be very sensitive to 'shouldering' the gun. Shots may break on call, but still go off in the tulies high and low. Sound familiar?

Some people go for hard pressure, pushing forward and pre-loading the bipod to reduce bounce and to keep things where they want 'em. It works, but I have a hard time getting as small of groups that way.

Others go for very light pressure... almost - but not quite - free recoil, with a very light hold on the pistol grip. For me, absolute accuracy goes up with this technique, but I really have to watch a tendency to try and help 'push' on the buttplate just a smidge to adjust the crosshairs up or down. Almost every time, the shot goes high or low accordingly. Very, very frustrating, especially when you 'see' the shot break cleanly and perhaps a little high in the 'X' and the target comes back up with the spotter down in the 9 or even the 8 ring. If you do use pressure, you have to do it the same every single shot - consistency is the key here.

YMMV,

Monte

 

[jb1000br]

Rifling twist rate?

Lack of RPM's can cause a combo to shoot great at 500yds even, and all vertical at 1000...like 105 Scenars in a 6BR 8.5 twist,8fps ES = 12" vertical at 1000 and ALWAYS sub 2" at 500) hah!

So if you don't have quite enough twist, that could be an issue.

Also, there is no way I'd free-recoil a bipod. I have best like with a firm-handshake hold and preloading the bipod,lean into it)

HTH,
JB

 

[TresMon]

GUNNER:

I was very fatigued when I wrote a response to your note: I clearly see as how it can be read as "grumpy" or worse. Please know I was not offended, and was happy you had responded to my inquiry. I apoligise for "tone."

Everyone: Thanks. All good tips and advice and I will try them on the line.

My barrel is a 20" 7 twist, as purchased from White Oak.
I suppose it spinning the 80 amax adequalty. ?

More powder would mean puched primers. I'm already milking Rem 7.5BR's.

I ran the ES pread on jbm ballisitics ,,com site) and the ES is worth a 25" vertical dispersition @ 1K. Umm could that be it?!!

 

[Forum Boss]

GUNNER:

I ran the ES pread on jbm ballisitics ,,com site) and the ES is worth a 25" vertical dispersition @ 1K. Umm could that be it?!!

Yes, big ES can definitely give big vertical at 1000. Consider also that the BC among your bullets is not uniform, although the 80 AMAX will,generally) be more uniform than non-plastic-tipped bullets. Regular bullets will show bullet-to-bullet BC variance up to 0.020 on average,meaning one bullet can have a .520 BC and the next bullet has a .540 BC.)

I would carefully inspect your Amaxes and cull any bullets that have chipped, tilted, or mis-seated tips. And work on your reloading methods to reduce ES.

 

[js223]

What powder are you using Tres? Since you are already running them hot, as you say you may pierce primers if you up the charge, and thus should not do so. When you worked up this load, how was the ES/Sd at some lower velocity levels with this particular powder/primer combo?
You may need to try a different powder and/or primer to get better consistency from this bullet.

 

[criver600]

I observed a noticeable "bounce" every shot more or less free recoil on a Harris bi-pod
Tres is running all the N-150 you can get into a winchester case.
Barrel has 300 plus rounds and just been patched with Barnes CR.....bore-scope showed heavy carbon.
Run-out on loaded ammo averaged .007/.008
Going to get the barrel reasonably clean, work on the ammunition and then the shooter.