Big little stuff....

[2dogs]

Just sorta wondering out loud here, but you know how some guys have a 300 Blackout but only want to shoot super sonic loads...has anyone given any thought to a 308/204? I wonder how close it would be capacity wise to the 30 BR?

 

[357Mag]

2Dogs -

Howdy !

A big influence on the possible case capacity would be just how deeply the bullets are seated.

IMHO -
Even after a neck-up to .30 caliber, the postulated .30" cal wildcat would be a couple grains less in capacity than the .30BR.


With regards,
357Mag

 

[357Mag]

2dogs -

Howdy, again !

I took a second look @ .204 Ruger original case' spec.

FWIW:
If the .360" stock shoulder diam were retained for the wildcat, you'd only have a minimal shoulder area.

Doing the math based on a notional .012" neck wall thickness: a head-on view of the case reveals a shoulder of only .014" width all-around. In comparison, a .35 Remington is some .0205" all-around.

Such a small shoulder area would make head spacing the notional wildcat problematic.
" Blowing the shoulders out " to where the wildcat has same case taper as a _ BR case... would only allow for about .003" additional shoulder diam all-around.


With regards,
357Mag

 

[2dogs]

I really appreciate your taking time to add your thoughts here. Let me further postulate....

I'm envisioning a bit of a light weight not too mean recoil field rifle that would feed from a detachable magazine. The various AI mags feed the 223 series of cartridges fairly well. So reliable feeding, power to clobber a jack, pig, or coyote but not me, and something that won't hurt my feelings so badly if I lose a case in the field. I would otherwise probably just do a 30 BR.....

Anyway, the 300 BO can't have much more of a shoulder and it headspaces OK. I wouldn't be opposed to improving the shoulder although the 204 already has a pretty improved shoulder.

Then again necking that 204 case to 257 diameter might be kind of cool too. This should run right close to the 250 Savage and not be as hard to get as a 257 Kimber.....

 

[2dogs]

I might also add here for the interested few that I took a Remington 700 in 300 BO and fitted it with CDI bottom metal and glass bedded it into a Hi Tech synthetic specialties stock and thought I really had something until I discovered it wouldn't shoot anything but 220 grain Sierras....

And when I say wouldn't shoot, I mean it was ugly. The 220 Sierra were about MOA at 100 so something was going on. Could have been the long throat or the twist or just the way I was holding my tongue.....

Just looking for a summer time rifle....

 

[STOMP442]

If I was going to wildcat something for the uses you have listed I would go .257 all the way. I have a couple .250 Savages that I use for coyote hunting and they work awesome. My model 99 is running the 75gr Vmax with very explosive results and I have another that is pushing the 100gr match king that is actually not terrible on pelts but most importantly I don't have runners.

 

[2dogs]

I want to stay somewhere in the 75-110 weight for bullets. I was just thinking the plain ole 22-250 twisted 1:9" running a 75 A Max is a very hard hitting combination too...

It's kind of interesting to see what all everybody has out there. I have a little Marlin 25-20 WCF that is light trim and quite capable. But again, losing one of those cases gives me heart burn...

 

[muleystalker]

You may want to look at a 6mmx204, thats what I did and throated it for the 95gr SMK's and 87gr VMAX. I haven't shot it yet but I know my buddies 6x45 throated for the 95gr SMK were running about 2850fps and we shot rock chucks out to 800y with it. Almost no recoil and a blast to shoot. He also has taken numerous deer with it. Lots of bullets to choose from also and plenty enough brass around. Use 204 bushing die with a 6mm expander and forester Micrometer seater with a 6mm stem.

 

[alf]

You may want to look at a 6mmx204

Or a 22-204.....75's at 3075.....80's at 3025......

 

[Nature Boy]

I keep thinking about a "7.6 Creedmoor"

Got to be better than a .308, right?

Or better yet, a "9.0 Creedmoor" it could be everything the .358 Winchester should have been. The Nine O Creed! Kinda has a ring to it

 

[Ringostar]

I keep thinking about a "7.6 Creedmoor"

Got to be better than a .308, right?

Or better yet, a "9.0 Creedmoor" it could be everything the .358 Winchester should have been. The Nine O Creed! Kinda has a ring to it

Wouldn't a 7.6 be a 30TC?

 

[Nature Boy]

Wouldn't a 7.6 be a 30TC?

Stop. You're ruining it for me

 

[Zero333]

I think a 6x45 (6mm-223) would work for you.

But if you want something a little different you can do a 6.5x45 or 7x45.

 

[2dogs]

Something with a 223 based case would certainly ease my OCD fears of losing a high end piece of brass in the grass.

I can guarantee if I did the 223 as the base case I would do an improved version. I have three 223 AI's and they are fantastic but too heavy for all day carry. Of course, the 204 would eliminate the need to fire form to 40 degrees. So it's down to 6mm or 257 caliber. One thing in favor of the .257 is the whole slew of cast bullets for that caliber.

Along these lines, I have been looking at stocks. The lighter weight stocks have like tripled in price since I last looked at them. Holy Smokes! What are you guys using for a all day carry stock?

 

[2dogs]

Nature boy, I might have to have a clothes pin on my nose if I ever drank beer with you to keep from snorting it out while laughing my ass off....

 

[smokinghole]

What about something based off the 6.8spc case or even the .224 Valkyrie (same variation of the SPC)? The Valkyrie brass should be plentiful for now and relatively cheap as many adopting it aren't reloaders and you could get 1x fired soon enough.

 

[johnfred1965]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I was looking at a 6.5x204 with 100 gr partitions for light deer hunting. My question is this: I was going to have custom dies made and they want 3 fired cases. Do I simply expand the neck of the 204 to 6.5 and just fireform these to my chamber? Don't know how to get fired cases without rube goldberging loads to start with.

 

[Kurz]

Something with a 223 based case would certainly ease my OCD fears of losing a high end piece of brass in the grass.

Here is a comparison between the .300 BO, .30 Apache (one version), .223 Rem.

Originally designed by 2 gunsmithing students mainly for Silhouette competition. But here is another version of the story:

otes: Historical Notes: The .30-223 showed up in the mid-1980's in the metallic silhouette circuit. Actual originator is unknown, but is possibly Joe Apache of Raton, New Mexico. In any event, he appears to be the one most prominently associated with it. Roy F. Dunlap built a rifle for it and published the results in the 1986/40th Annual Edition of Gun Digest. The cartridge is made by necking-up the .223 Remington case to 30-caliber. This is about as far as one can go in necking-up the .223 Remington and retaining anything resembling a shoulder. After that, it simply becomes a straight rimless case. (It has actually been necked-up to .338-caliber.) Although there is only a slight shoulder, no headspace problems have been reported with the .30-223. General comments: The .30-223 is about as unlikely a cartridge as anyone could come up with, but nevertheless, it appears to work quite well. It is loaded with either a 168-grain match bullet at a muzzle velocity of 2190 fps or the 190-grain Hornady match bullet at 2100 fps, for metallic silhouette shooting. A 150-grain bullet has also been loaded and develops 2250 fps. All of this according to Roy Dunlap. Although intended as a silhouette cartridge, the performance with the 190-grain bullet closely approximates the ballistics of the old .303 Savage, which was, in its day, considered a good deer and black bear cartridge for hunting in the bush or woods. A 150-grain bullet at 2250 fps just about duplicates the time-tried .30-30, all of which means that the .30-223 is not only a good silhouette cartridge, but must also be classed as a potential big game number for deer-size animals. (Cartridges of the World 6th Edition)

And don't forget about the TCU versions of the .223 Rem. either!

 

[Kurz]

One thing in favor of the .257 is the whole slew of cast bullets for that caliber.

John Wootters worked with the .25 Copperhead for several years. His information is in the Wildcat Cartridge vol.2. Then as mentioned above there is the 257 Kimber which is on the .222 Rem. Magnum case. One or two of the larger favorites is the .25 Pronghorn on the WSM case and the .257 Banshee on the 6.5x68 Schuler case.

But now that we have the .25 cal. 131 grain BlackJack bullets, a whole new vista has been opened for the inquisitive. Anyone want to try the 25/221 Fireball with 131 grain VLDs? It's somewhere around 2,000 and 2,100 fps with the bullet seated WAY OUT!

 

[KMart]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I was looking at a 6.5x204 with 100 gr partitions for light deer hunting. My question is this: I was going to have custom dies made and they want 3 fired cases. Do I simply expand the neck of the 204 to 6.5 and just fireform these to my chamber? Don't know how to get fired cases without rube goldberging loads to start with.

Another way to get a custom die is to take our 6.5x204 reamer print and send it to Whidden. He can make a perfect die from a reamer print. He has done a couple for me.