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Barrel Nut - Less Enthused Now (for my use)

I was enthusiastic about the barrel nut approach on my Savage (avoids gunsmith wait), but now, with a Savage based 6mmBR (w/barrel nut), I am less enthused. Perhaps this will be the case for others (maybe not), but for those contemplating a barrel nut gun, perhaps my experience will give some insight.

I decided to build a 6mmBR using a Savage Precision Target Action. I did not use a prefit barrel, because the chamberings (reamer dimensions) were not to my liking. I wanted a tighter neck, and short freebore for my light short range bullets. Some prefit makers will use your reamer (but in one case, that was an extra $50, and it would take a while to get it done). I also wanted a cut-rifled barrel and a specific twist rate. I could not find any pre-fits that met my requirements.

I got a Brux barrel blank (cut-rifled), and had a gunsmith prepare it for my Savage, using a borrowed reamer I liked. That was sent off to the gunsmith, as he did not have a reamer with the specs I wanted. I did save money on the barrel work as there is no fitting to the action. But, the wait was long.

Once the barrel showed up, I bought a barrel nut wrench, a custom barrel nut, and an action wrench (used to hold the action while I screwed the barrel on w/nut) and a GO gauge. Close to $150 with shipping.

My total investment was now about $650+. And what did that get me? A good barrel, but one that does not have the bore curve timed to 12 o'clock, and takes more time and effort to switch barrels vs a shouldered barrel. I don't intend to switch barrels until it wears out, but the point is, a CUSTOM barrel on a Savage w/barrel nut may not make much sense vs a custom shouldered barrel. The overall costs may be closer than it would first appear.

It seems to me that the barrel nut approach is fine for those that want an off-the-shelf good button rifled barrel available in twists and contours that will suit your needs and where reamer specs are not critical and allow you to fit the barrel, at home, with a modest investment in tools. The more barrel nut rifles you have, the better the investment in tools becomes.

I am building a 6.5x47 on a Howa action. I can do this with a barrel nut, but it makes little sense. A custom fitted shouldered barrel will be exactly as I want it, not just what happens to be in the shelf. There will be no investment in a headspace gauge, barrel nut wrench, and custom barrel nut. I do not expect to have to buy a custom reamer in this case (thankfully). My round hole action wrench that works for the Savage works on the flat bottom Howa if I flip the action wrench cap over (it has a flat side).

Moral of the story? Know your wants and needs and what it will take to get their for both approaches. You might be surprised.

Phil
 
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Educate me, on your reference to 12'oclock.
A good barrel, but one that does not have the bore curve timed to 12 o'clock, and takes more time and effort to switch barrels vs a shouldered barrel.

You make no reference as to how it shoots. Does it shoot as well as a $650 rifle or does it shoot as well as a $6500 rifle.
I have a couple of savage rifles chambered in a "traditional" way with a shoulder. And more than a few with nuts.
The nuts make it easy to "test drive" a caliber if you so desire.
I won't say one is better than the other, as both have their merits and I have seen exceptional groups from both. Maybe not true BR performance, but then you don't see many across the counter mass produced actions at a BR match either.
 
When I buy shoes, I like the over the ankle 6" height shoe that was in style when my grandfather was young. They are somewhat hard to find and are not cheap in a dress shoe. Same with my glasses. Light wire frames like he wore.
They are not for everybody, but I like them. They are long lasting and functional.
But, I have a choice. The only person I have to make happy is ME.
 
Phil, you seem to be on a rant, hope you feel better now.

Some things that you have to accept in order to make life easier:

1. design, order your own reamers..this will keep you off the Zanex
don't expect someone else to have what ever reamer that you have
dreamed up. This is a hard lesson to learn.


2. Your complaining about the cost of the barrel vise, action wrench, etc is
off set by the shipping costs where you are not Mailing your gun back
and forth to the gunsmith.

3. As you get more experience, you will spin those barrel nut barrels on very
Fast, especially when you have fire formed cases you want to use as a
headspace gauge.

4. Burris signature rings will help you with any timing issues on your barrel
in the calibers you have mentioned.

5. I was not aware that Howa barrel nuts were being made now, could be
wrong.

6. In order to eliminate as many problems for you as possible in your quest for extreme accuracy, it would be prudent for you to plan on investing in
in a Borden action sometime in the future.

7. An education costs money, spend your money wisely, whimper quietly as
we all have been down this rocky road.

Phil, your journey has just begun, good luck!
 
Phil, you seem to be on a rant, hope you feel better now.

Some things that you have to accept in order to make life easier:

1. design, order your own reamers..this will keep you off the Zanex
don't expect someone else to have what ever reamer that you have
dreamed up. This is a hard lesson to learn.


2. Your complaining about the cost of the barrel vise, action wrench, etc is
off set by the shipping costs where you are not Mailing your gun back
and forth to the gunsmith.

3. As you get more experience, you will spin those barrel nut barrels on very
Fast, especially when you have fire formed cases you want to use as a
headspace gauge.

4. Burris signature rings will help you with any timing issues on your barrel
in the calibers you have mentioned.

5. I was not aware that Howa barrel nuts were being made now, could be
wrong.

6. In order to eliminate as many problems for you as possible in your quest for extreme accuracy, it would be prudent for you to plan on investing in
in a Borden action sometime in the future.

7. An education costs money, spend your money wisely, whimper quietly as
we all have been down this rocky road.

Phil, your journey has just begun, good luck!
A Borden would be the action I would buy if I had to start over, I love the looks, lines of the Borden
 
Well, the only good way to look at it is; how does it shoot??? I did the same thing with a Ruger American. Thought it would make an acceptable "truck gun" and of course.....zero chance. Between the "adjustable" {all the way down to} 12 pound trigger and the "pre-pitted and worn out" barrel, to the sponge soft stock.....one could argue that the barrel nut was just about the only thing that did work!!! At the end of the day I could have had a Sako.
I don't have anything against a barrel nut, and as barrel nuts go I like the smooth almost inconspicuous one on the Ruger. I just don't see any advantage at all. All that said, I am happy to report that my polished junk shoots very good. To the point that, based on reports about Sako these days, it will probably easily out shoot one. I have had some friends try to buy it...but at my age and station in life I no longer sell guns that shoot. Can prove just too hard to replace sometimes.
 
Thanks to all for your comments. I don’t know if it is possible to quote multiple responses into one reply, so I just copied and pasted a few here with my comments.

“One more realizing the shortcomings of the nut. Perfect for a mass produced loose tolerance manufacturing environment but not for pure accuracy for those that know the difference”.

I intentionally avoided the topic of accuracy with regards to a barrel nut vs a shouldered barrel. Plenty of opinions on that already. I was only speaking about OTHER pros, cons, and observations of the two barrel attachment methods that I saw. There were a few other considerations raised that may be relevant for some (not me). Those were:

1) You can switch any barrel with any action.
2) Can test drive other calibers.
3) A good gunsmith will only need the action for the FIRST barrel job (if insurance carrier allows).

“Phil, you seem to be on a rant, hope you feel better now”.
To be clear, I was not on a “rant”, nor is there any complaining. Just observations from my own experience that others may want to consider if thinking about a barrel nut vs a shouldered barrel attachment method.

“…design, order your own reamers..this will keep you off the Zanex don't expect someone else to have what ever reamer that you have dreamed up. This is a hard lesson to learn…”.
I did not find it a hard lesson. I WAS surprised that I could not find any gunsmith with a 6mmBR reamer with a short free bore. No matter, I will just get my own reamer when necessary.

“Your complaining about the cost of the barrel vise, action wrench, etc is offset by the shipping costs where you are not Mailing your gun back and forth to the gunsmith”.
There is no “complaining”. Really…, there isn’t. Just passing along info to others, nothing more. I did not say “offset”, but mentioned these costs as ones to keep in mind. Yes, it can be costly to ship a rifle back and forth…unless the gunsmith is local.

“As you get more experience, you will spin those barrel nut barrels on very fast, especially when you have fire formed cases you want to use as a headspace gauge”.
Maybe I misunderstand, but I will need a properly headspaced barrel to obtain a fire formed case, meaning I will need a headspace gauge on initial assembly. What am I missing?

"Burris signature rings will help you with any timing issues on your barrel in the calibers you have mentioned".
I do have those rings on my rifle. I assume you are talking about the rings with the plastic inserts?

“I was not aware that Howa barrel nuts were being made now, could be wrong”.
Yes, they are available. Criterion, McGowen, Sin-Arms (gunsmith) provide prefit barrels with nuts. There may be others.

“In order to eliminate as many problems for you as possible in your quest for extreme accuracy, it would be prudent for you to plan on investing in a Borden action sometime in the future”.
I have used a custom action (BAT), and they are indeed a work of art and work wonderfully. I have seen Bordens and they are ultra-nice! I may get something like that in the future, if it makes sense for my usage. For instance I do not need a slick low effort action to shoot quickly as one might need in a match, because I don’t compete. On the other hand, it sure is a joy to operate!

“An education costs money, spend your money wisely, whimper quietly as we all have been down this rocky road”.
No worry, not whimpering. Just hoping to pass on some observations to others. This forum is like the Library of Congress for accurate shooting information, and it has helped me immensely. Just trying to return the favor by sharing my experience and observations.

As an aside, I certainly have learned a fair amount on stocks, the HARD way! I will post about that, but will need help in this area.

Phil
 
I think that Phil spoke very well trying to educate others that are about to go down this same road.

Phil, I had my own zero freebore 6 BR reamer ground with web dia and neck dia that I wanted. I think that I have half a dozen barrels on it, everyone is a shooter with 55g to 65g! Drove me crazy till I started ordering my own reamers.

I think of a rifle as a "Platform" for many barrels, saves me a bundle...the only way I can manage my barrel addiction.

I only have three nut jobs, they all shoot bug holes, but the 12 o'clock orientation is not an issue due to the fact that I only shoot shorter range and my impact is usually within 2" switching barrel to barrel. There are some gunsmiths on this site that do a heck of a job on "Nut Jobs", and that is an understatement...and with cut rifle barrels.

I could recommend a gunsmith or two on this board that has short freebore 6 br reamers...send me a pm.

Phil, I think you did a great job of showing some of the pain in working through putting a rifle together for first timers that care about the details. I think that you are very fortunate to question the gunsmiths about their reamers, and they told you the truth. I had to learn to wade through the lies and bull crap. Two rifles I waited a year to get, just to get an education on what a smooth talking, lying SOB that guy was! Another guy kept my Hugh Hendrickson reamer that I waited a year to get, I thought I was going to go to jail over that issue.

This board is priceless in finding some world class gunsmiths to work with!
 

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