Asking you 22x47L shooters about barrel longevity.

[VaniB]

My question for you 22x47L shooters is whether the downside of the 22x47L cartridge is going to be that it will give barrel life that is no better then a 22-250? The 22-250 and 22x47 sure look about the same capacity.

I was all decided on going with an 1-8 twist 6x47 Lapua PD rig for shooting the 105Amax at 3,050 FPS out to 600 yards or more.

BUT, then after comparing ballistics data, I discovered that the 22 cal 75Amax bullet shooting out of the muzzle at 3,400 FPS shoots flatter with the same or less windage then the larger 105Amax. The 75Amax is reported to hit PD varmints with complete devastation too., while the 6mm 105Amax is reported to only "expand")But will it burn out way before the 6x47L ??

 

[billmo]

But, what is that 3400 fps going to do to your barrel life? Plus we all know that some rifles in .22 cal. just will not give you those numbers without loading mighty warm. Just a thought. You decide. Bill

 

[VaniB]

Dunno. Until we hear from some of these folks, I guess it's speculation.

I researched the archives of this fine websight, and had heard many guys say that were in the middle of having a 22x47 Lapua rifle or barrel being built.

Maybe some of those folks can tell us how their 22x47L rifles have been, and how many rounds have been through it.

 

[sunbuilder]

VaniB,

There are too many variables involved to accurately estimate barrel life based solely on cartridge design.

That being said there are some good general guides.,design wise)

If you are using 6.5x47 Lapua for your base I think its fair to say in "general"

20x47L,shortest potential life)
22x47L
6X47L
6.5x47L
7x47L
30x47L,greatest pl)

Given same case powder capacity, smallest bore has shortest life expectancy,overbore). Largest bore has longest.

Overbore cartridges burn throats faster than more "balanced" ones do.

My point is, if you think a 22x47L is a good choice, then build it and see how long it lasts for you.

New enough that it is not likely many guys have shot enough rounds to determine barrel life.

To me barrels are sort of like tires on a vehicle, replace when worn.

If you like it re chamber same,or set barrel back), If you don't, then try something different.

Have fun!

Scott

 

[eddybo]

I would say that barrel life is going to be very comprable to a 220 swift as both have relatively the same capacity. I used quickload data for the swift to work up my load in my 22x47. It is very accurate and great for smacking steel out ot 800,length of my range).

I would say that it is a barel burner and that if your wanting 2000 accurate rounds look elsewhere. If you want a .22 that will shoot the heavier high BC bullets at respectable velocities with great available brass go for it.

 

[VaniB]

Not being the adventurous type, I prefer to let others have the fun building on impulse and doing all field testing and the finding-outs. Being a ho-hum and cautious kind of guy, I have yet to have ever been disappointed with optics, rifles, or equipment that everyone else already researched for me.


If you enter "22x47" into this websight's search, you will see people who started working on this cartridge last year, and who had already started shooting it at that time. One guy even said that he was ready to go on a PD trip. I don't know what the deal is, but all these people; "boiler house 7", "cheetah", "jadams", and "apache" just plum dissapeared from this sight, taking their wealth of knowledge with them.,check the date on the last time any of them posted anything.) I hope they are all still alive and well.

Anyway.....this 22x47 cartridge still has way too much more speculation and surmising about it instead of actual field experience reports. If it weren't for jadam's in depth reviews about it, a lot of us would still be practically clueless about this cartridge. I thouroughly checked other websights as well, and found the same too few tid-bits about it. I too am very capable of making case size and capacity comparisons against the 22Dasher, 22BR, 22-250 AI,220 Swift, 22-243. But, I will not base my next $2,600 rifle on these guesses. At this point I will be building the 6x47L instead, which is no longer a mystery to me, or to the tool and die makers either.

Thank you gentlemen for trying to help.

BTW.....If any of you guys are in the Bermuda Triangle and find any one of these missing guys drifting about in a life raft, would you feed em up, clean em up, and then tell them to report back to us about their 22x47L projects that they started talking about last year.

 

[jadams]

Hi Guys: VaniB
Re: .2247L I made my first one up in Jan 06. It is built on a Wichita 1375 action. The barrel is a Spencer .22cf at 29" with
a 1 in 8" twist. It has a large Harrells muzzle brake that has been modified. The piller bedding and barrel work was done by M.Sosenko.

I think I shot and tested about one million loads with it. !!
Last year with about 1400 rounds through it. I used it at the 600
yard NBRSA Nationals in Sacramento. I finished seventh overall in
group. I plan on shooting it in the 600 Nationals again in two weeks at Sacramento. It now has about 2200 rounds through it.

I have not scoped the barrel, but it shoots good. By the way, I only shoot with mollyed bullets., For what that,s worth )

My load is 41.0 of Re-22 with a Berger 80vld or the 80 Hornady.
The Vel. is about 3425 as I recall. The primer is CCI450 only.
My old favorite was the Rem. 7½, but they have changed it to a
three anvil primer and I believe it's made in Brazil. It is my
experience that the Fed. GM205M is the most accurate/consistent
primer available, but it will not hold the same high pressure as
the 450. I do use Quickload with all of my loading.

I do have another Wichita in .2247L with a broughton barrel. I also have a RLR Viper .2247L it has a barrel block on it and after a year of foolin around with it I can keep it on paper at 100 Yards., second barrel )

I,m playing with some new toys.
Wichita action .22 BRK
Wichita action .243 BRK,2)
Wichita action 6.5 SOS , same as a BRK )

I'll sum it up by Reminding you that I've said my Wichita action
.22 Dasher is my most accurate gun. It has about 2500+ rounds through it and last month it shoot a perfect 60x60 on our Varmint silhouette match. M.Sos was shooting it.

Enough, John

 

[VaniB]

John, I think you're the only guy on the net that can provide such thourough information on this cartridge. And, if am to seriously consider his cartridge, then what you have already provided is a gold mine to me! I hope you wouldn't mind sharing some more of your hands-on information about this cartridge with us.

2,000 rounds through your barrel is very good news to me. And, unless something's changed, you had previously been able to shoot some 1/4" groups?...right? I would be using this gun 99% of the time for paper punching....so thus it being able to at least keep up with my 20Tac rifle,which shoots 1/4 to 3/8" 5 shot groups) would be a nice thing. I can live with shooting the 75Amax, or 80Amax at no more then 3,300FPS. It would help prolong barrel life anyway. Unlike other fine shorter 22 BR based cartridges, this one will feed through my Rem 700 magazine. If my smith can't figure out how to get a round to feed reliably through my rifle, then I won't pursue it. Even though I normally always feed cartridges individually into the chamber, I don't care for a non working magazine. To me, it amounts to a broken rifle.

I have been set to go with the 6x47L, but have trouble getting excited about a 500-600 yard varmint round that will be doing about 3,050FPS at the muzzle. If we can believe computer ballistics programs, the 22x47L is superior to the 6x47L and would easily be shooting at least 250FPS faster,flatter, and with virtually the same wind resistance, but with less recoil. And for PD shooting, the 75-80 Amax are reported to expand more violently then the 105Amax. The reason I say "if we can believe"..... is because in spite of these heavier weight 22 bullets having such good .435-.453BC ratings to shoot flatter and resist wind almost exactly as well as the 6x47 105Amax bullet do, I still don't see their use being much mentioned in long distance shoots. I'll just stick with the posted math and assume ballistics tables about trajectory and windage don't lie.

Excellent dies for the 6x47L are offered by Redding and Forster, and a great Wilson in-line bullet seater too, BUT I WOULDN'T KNOW WHERE TO START FOR 22x47L dies. Can you advise?

BTW; Did you ever make progress in preventing bullet blow up by going to a 1-9 barrel?.....or did you then suffer less accuracy for it.

 

[kochie]

i have a 22x47lapua being build and i know you can get dies from redding but there custom and will cost you more. my 22x47 will have a 1&12 twist for light bullets does any one have any load data thanks kochie

 

[VaniB]

Kochie,
I've decided to proceed with the 22x47L and have already ordered the Redding Custom dies. Yea, the 4 dies and bushings are costing me $300.
As far as your desiring load data for your 1-12 twist barrel and the 22x47L, I'll bet you can do a search and find starting loads that guys are using in the 22BR, or in the 22-250AI

I guess when our buddy John signs off of his posts with "enough, -John", he ain't kiddin! He writes a good post and then disappears for weeks or months at a time. I guess this just idicates that he has a life while I hang around here too much. I wanted to know if he had luck with the larger bullets and a 1-9 twist barrel. Last year he wrote that he intended on trying one. If anybody cares to know......Hornady tells me that a 1-9 twist for a 75-80Amax up to 3,400FPS is the optimum twist, with the mathematical RPM formula indicting this too. If anything, the faster you go over 3,300- 3,400 FPS, the slower the twist will need to be. Seems like most folks go with a 1-8 twist, but the 1-8 twist is better suited for AR15 .223 velocities of about 2,700fps.

 

[eddybo]

VaniB

I thought that a one in 8 twist would be sufficient for the 90gr bullets using the same rational. I was wrong. My schillen will not stabilize them even at max velocity. The 80s however are a different story they shoot bugholes. Good luck with it.

 

[VaniB]

Eddy,

You probably already know this, so I'll I'll post it for the benefit of the newbies;

In order to choose the perfect barrel twist, one must decide the weight and style bullet that he intends to shoot, as well as the velocity he thinks he will hand load for. Because I intend to shoot my rifle for both target and long distance PD shooting, I intend to stick with 75 and 80 grain Amax bullets. I spoke with two different reps at Hornady. These two Amax bullets are not VLD bullets. VLD bullets are longer and require a faster twist rate to stabilize. VLD bullets would especially need faster twists at 5.56 AR15 velocities. At a modest 3,300 fps that I intend to hand load for,,not 3,400 fps) a bullet in a 1-8 twist barrel will spin at 297,000 RPM. Hornady states 280,000 as the preferred max, and 300,000 as the ceiling before the bullet is liable to break apart in mid flight. This is not etched in stone, as factors concerning the bullet's jacket construction from lot to lot, bore smoothness, and air temperature have some bearing on this as well.

Therefore, I will be proceeding with a 1-8.5 twist which will deliver an RPM rate of 279,529 If I hand load my rounds for 3,400 FPS instead, then the rate increases to 288,000 RPM....still in a safe margin, a bit below mid-air bullet disintegration.

BTW, I spoke with two different barrel makers. I won't mention the names because I don't want them to appear as incompetent. But one well known barrel maker I spoke with on the phone,starts with a "K")initially told me to go with 1-8 barrel. He then changed the story when I stressed to him that the velocity I was going to be using was about 3,300fps. He said, "Oh....I thought you were going with the usual AR15 velocities of about 2,600 fps. Well, if you're shooting at 3,300 then perhaps you're better off with the slower twist. I'm really not sure, as most folks don't shoot the heavier bullets this fast". Huhhh???....folks don't shoot heavy .224 target bullets at long range competition?

The other barrel maker,starts with a "B") left me a message on my voice mail. "You need an 8 twist" . Then when I spoke to him on the phone, he started using the same numbers that I was using and changed the story to "Yes, looks like you need an 1-8.5 to 1-8.7 twist."

 

[eddybo]

Let us know how it goes. Just wanted to make you aware of my experiance. Good luck with it.

 

[missed]

I'm planning on building one. CFO said new house first..... I'm going with Whidden on the dies and JGS for the reamer. They actually had the reamer in stock when I talked to them last. Dies were$250 if I remember off the top of my head. I want something I can get 10 rounds in an AICS magazine and not act like an idiot, 22x47L will. I'm planning on ~3200fps for plinking steel, and I'm hoping to have some ~3400fps varmint loads. At 3200 I'm estimating long couple thousand life. I think with the steeper shoulders the barrel life will be better than the shallower shoulders of others. But at 3400 nothing is going to last a long time. Hopefully I'll have mine done next spring

 

[trevort]

I have a 22x 47l with a slow twist barrel for shooting it flat out. I load 39gns of varget behind a 55gn vmax for 4000fps. I ordered a no 6 lilja and quickly decided I should have ordered a 7 so I have messed around with this barrel not concerned with wearing it out, including seeing how fast a 40 gn NBT would go. got to 4440fps before running out of test loads and no pressure signs. I'm guessing that I have around 500 rounds down it and the smith can see firecracking with his borescope but it still smacks furry things very effectively. I just used my 6x47l dies with a 22 bushing and all seems fine.