Anybody use Mapp gas when annealing?
- Thread starter fatelvis
- Start date
xr650rRider
Silver $$ Contributor
Mapp gas was discontinued in 2008.
The true MAPP would burn around 5700 °F, where as the replacement labeled MAP burns around 3750 °F and Propane is around 3600 °F, so you pay 5x as much for 150 °F.
The true MAPP would burn around 5700 °F, where as the replacement labeled MAP burns around 3750 °F and Propane is around 3600 °F, so you pay 5x as much for 150 °F.
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DShortt
Gold $$ Contributor
Whatever this is, it gets too hot too fast. Call it whatever floats your boat.
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Yes, that heating faster with Mapp gas can translate to less heat migration down the body. But the heat migration one gets with Propane really is not any kind of issue; at least not for me in the 8 years I've been annealing with Propane. That heat migration was a big issue for me when I started out and one of the reasons why I went to a swirl flame that heats things up just a little faster. I just haven't been able to reasonably justify paying the higher price for Mapp. . .IMHO. Even with Mapp gas, I'd probably still want to use a swirl flame head since the way the flame wraps around the neck and shoulder produces pretty uniform results.
If it makes you feel comfortable using it instead of Propane, then. . .I'd say just keep doing what your doing.
I'd guess on the plus side, using Mapp with it's hotter flame will take less time to go through a batch of brass. But is there really enough time savings to justify the additional cost?
It's impossible to soften the body when annealing. The body never gets to an annealing temp. It's also related to time at temp. Because of the higher heat it's more difficult to control. Propane should be cheaper than MAP. A fraction of a second at 600F won't anneal.
DLT
Silver $$ Contributor
Hmmm… Never ran into that problem with my AMP….
Perfect every time and never worried about running out of gas or setting things on fire.
Same as me. Could be my torch head but my time in the flame was about the same. Maybe a second faster with map
$1400 so you don't have to buy propane.Hmmm… Never ran into that problem with my AMP….
Perfect every time and never worried about running out of gas or setting things on fire.
Bottom Fodder
Silver $$ Contributor
$1400 = an gas annealer and about 100 bottles of gas. Recon how much brass you could anneal with 100 bottle of gas
"I thought" that to properly flame anneal, that you had to reach a certain temperature for a certain duration of time. Wouldn't Mapp gas get you to temperature too quickly resulting in quick removal from the heat?
Just asking.
Just asking.
To hard to control temp consistently with MAP.
Even more so if one just refills a bottle.
Which is what I've been doing with propane for some time.
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Yes, it's a certain temperature for a certain amount of time. . . not how quick you get to that temperature. The AMP machine, for example, gets to the designated temperature very quickly.
I'm not sure if the issue for controlling the temperature due to the increased speed is really a problem, since the amount of flame used can be controlled???
searcher
Gold $$ Contributor
I used (before getting an AMP) Bernzomatic Map Plus gas in my annealing machine. I was able to speed up the dwell time and found that by doing this, the case bodies did not get nearly as hot as when using propane. The slower heating with the propane allowed more heat to migrate down the case before the neck and shoulder got to the optimum temperature. That said, it takes a bit more care to set the flame reach and dwell time just right. I use a dozen old cases to get things set up before annealing any of my good brass.
If my brass had the necks turned, I could run my machine faster with the Map gas. If using unturned necks, and running fast as I did with turned necks, I think the results might not have been as good as the thicker necks were out of the dwell before they heated to the proper temperature. Because I turn almost all brass I shoot, this was not much of an issue for me - just one worth noting for those who don't. A 15 OZ. or so cannister of the Map Plus runs about $15.00 locally, while the same propane runs about $6.00. Since the Map heats considerably faster, the price difference may not be nearly as big as the price may suggest - as the Map will heat more pieces with the same 15 oz., but overall will run a bit more. If taking time savings into consideration - that changes the economics much more in favor of the map gas. If annealing 500 pieces of brass and it saves you 10-15 minutes (2-3 seconds less dwell time per piece) every time you anneal, that may be worth something to those with stretched time resources.
For those of you who do plumbing repairs or re-piping around the house with copper pipe - this Map gas is so much better than propane when sweating fittings. Good to have it around.
If my brass had the necks turned, I could run my machine faster with the Map gas. If using unturned necks, and running fast as I did with turned necks, I think the results might not have been as good as the thicker necks were out of the dwell before they heated to the proper temperature. Because I turn almost all brass I shoot, this was not much of an issue for me - just one worth noting for those who don't. A 15 OZ. or so cannister of the Map Plus runs about $15.00 locally, while the same propane runs about $6.00. Since the Map heats considerably faster, the price difference may not be nearly as big as the price may suggest - as the Map will heat more pieces with the same 15 oz., but overall will run a bit more. If taking time savings into consideration - that changes the economics much more in favor of the map gas. If annealing 500 pieces of brass and it saves you 10-15 minutes (2-3 seconds less dwell time per piece) every time you anneal, that may be worth something to those with stretched time resources.
For those of you who do plumbing repairs or re-piping around the house with copper pipe - this Map gas is so much better than propane when sweating fittings. Good to have it around.
Same
NorCalMikie
Gold $$ Contributor
Used it for years with NO issues. Too hot???
Don't keep your brass in the flame that long!!
Don't keep your brass in the flame that long!!
Coyotefurharvester
Silver $$ Contributor
For the few hundred cases I anneal a year, as long as the necks get dull red, I just use what propane type I have at hand. The camping style 1# is nice for sitting on the floor with my cordless drill resting on the floor. Correct height= no hand/wrist issues.
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