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And Another HBR Question:

ebb said:
At the point I shot yours I was shooting the Indian Hammock "matches" with a Ruger 308 VT. I shot some really nice short range BR rifles. I wound up with an old Hall vintage BR rifle in 6PPC. Between Capt. Bob's, Jon's rifles and yours I kind of got hooked. Jon had a 30BR, and a 22 waldog that both would really shoot. He also had a hunter BR that got lost in the shuffle.
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Do you know where Jon's rifle went? Is Capn Bob still around?
 
Jon's sons took control of his rifles. I asked to buy the 30BR and was told no. I know the son that's an attorney cannot load for it and was told the one that owns the marine construction business can load. I used Capt. Bob to do transfers, but it got to be a long drive and I went back to one of my fathers student that is local and has an FFL. Capt. Bob told me he was going to get a membership to the Lorida shooting club and he would call me to come try it out and see if I wanted to become a member. Never heard from him. I miss our trips to the Hammock.
 
Capt Bob made some ammo for the guy that owned the Hall I got from him. When Bob brokered the exchange, he told me the cartridges in the box are weighed and put in the box in order. I am like "What?" The first is the lightest and the last is the heaviest and they are in order. Why? He says Mikey only bought 100 and I didn't have enough to sort them in batches so when you shoot 5 shot groups the 5 will be the closest to each other. I have only ever taken one cartridge out of the box at a time, and they shoot well that way. One of these days they will get so bad I have to tumble them, and I will have to start all over again. never heard of it being done this way, but I have shot zeros with this gun when the temp is right.
 
Coondogkid said:
Pete, that was brought up at the 2023 Nationals, and voted down 100%
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Are you saying 100% of the people voted no? if so, that is not the case. I and several others voted to increase the weight. But there were two to three times as many no's than yes's, so the motion did not pass.

I too think the extra 8 ounces could be used on scopes. If you already have a 6x scope, then you can add the weight to the stock, or barrel, or even add a tuner.
It's easy to add weight, it hard to find a 6x scope.
 
Only allow the 8 oz added weight if you're not shooting a 6x scope ( that means no more than 10# 8oz.) there are 6x scopes out there to be had just watched 2 Burris 6x hbr scopes sell on eBay there are two Leupold 6x scopes on there right now not cheap but can be had I have picked up and sold 4- 6x scopes and sold to help guys out saying your scope is broke is a many times a poor excuse for bad shooting
 
Ron IA said:
Only allow the 8 oz added weight if you're not shooting a 6x scope ( that means no more than 10# 8oz.) there are 6x scopes out there to be had just watched 2 Burris 6x hbr scopes sell on eBay there are two Leupold 6x scopes on there right now not cheap but can be had I have picked up and sold 4- 6x scopes and sold to help guys out saying your scope is broke is a many times a poor excuse for bad shooting
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The real problem is those who sold the scopes will not fix them. They offer replacements that aren't usable. Eventually, all the 6x scopes suitable for HBR will no longer hold POI so then what do we do? HBR rifles aren't easy on scopes but I have seen them fail on 22 RF rifles as well so it's often becomes a question of when.

Something will need to be done.
 
As it turns out, there is at least one place that is rebuilding scopes. I bought one he had for sale and it, so far, is performing well.
 
I have very mixed feelings about this. I know the 6X scopes are no longer made and hard to come by. But they are still out there if you search hard enough. Watch EBay, etc. However, one day they will all dry up. It has to happen with none being made.
But, requirements slippage never reverses either. Raise the weight to 10.5 lbs and soon someone says why can’t we just shoot out light varmint with the three inch fore end. (This was floated a couple of years ago). A couple more changes and we are right where group shooters are today. Shoot one gun for both classes. Presto, we no longer really have a real two gun as we do have today. And yes, I know you can put a big scope on a Hunter rifle and shoot it in VFS. But you pay a pretty big penalty in recoil and gun management due to the narrow fore end.

So yes I am puzzled about saving what is truly the legacy class.
 
JoeDuke said:
I have very mixed feelings about this. I know the 6X scopes are no longer made and hard to come by. But they are still out there if you search hard enough. Watch EBay, etc. However, one day they will all dry up. It has to happen with none being made.
But, requirements slippage never reverses either. Raise the weight to 10.5 lbs and soon someone says why can’t we just shoot out light varmint with the three inch fore end. (This was floated a couple of years ago). A couple more changes and we are right where group shooters are today. Shoot one gun for both classes. Presto, we no longer really have a real two gun as we do have today. And yes, I know you can put a big scope on a Hunter rifle and shoot it in VFS. But you pay a pretty big penalty in recoil and gun management due to the narrow fore end.

So yes I am puzzled about saving what is truly the legacy class.
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Joe, I'm an advocate of upping the HBR weight to 10.5 lbs. solely because of the scope situation. That single change would make it much easier for competitors that want to build a HBR gun. With the popularity of the Two Gun increasing, as competitors we're missing the boat by not advancing what many feel is a win/win rule change. For those that have a good stash of vintage 6X target scopes, they would get to add 8 oz. to their gun. For those building a new rig, the increased weight allows options for existing variable scopes that weigh a bit more than the vintage target 6X scopes. Both approaches end up with the guns able to weigh the same...seems pretty even, to me.

I think we competitive SR BR shooters (as a group) are a lot like one of our political parties...they've shown a remarkable ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. :oops:

Good shootin' :) -Al
 
Apparently quite often scopes don't work right because of the old lubricants in them they were assembled with get gummy or hard and cause havoc. Exercising the turrets they tell us it a solution to those particular scopes. So, this outfit in Montana and I have heard there may be another one out there somewhere working on old scopes. There aren't that many parts to go bad if one thinks about it, I have watched some YouTubes on guys fixing their own scopes. Some of them make and add their own springs but it didn't appear to me the springs are the problem. The hardest part seems to be knowing which parts are glued together and being careful not to get things too hot when melting the glue. I've lain in a half dozen old re-done Burris Mins and HBR II's which hopefully will see me out. :) Interestingly enough, the latest Leup HBR's seem to be the ones now that are "unfixable".
 
Pete Wass said:
Apparently quite often scopes don't work right because of the old lubricants in them they were assembled with get gummy or hard and cause havoc. Exercising the turrets they tell us it a solution to those particular scopes. So, this outfit in Montana and I have heard there may be another one out there somewhere working on old scopes. There aren't that many parts to go bad if one thinks about it, I have watched some YouTubes on guys fixing their own scopes. Some of them make and add their own springs but it didn't appear to me the springs are the problem. The hardest part seems to be knowing which parts are glued together and being careful not to get things too hot when melting the glue. I've lain in a half dozen old re-done Burris Mins and HBR II's which hopefully will see me out. :) Interestingly enough, the latest Leup HBR's seem to be the ones now that are "unfixable".
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I had a Burris go out on my 2 years ago at the Nationals. I still have it. I think I will.send it in for a good once over.

Thanks @Pete Wass
 
Speaking of Turrets, if someone would make some great replacement turrets, we'd be all set. I think I remember a company that used to make replacement turrets years ago.
 
If the old Stoney Point Target Knob Turret you could buy would fit on the Leupold FX-3 3-9 EFR scope would be A good back up even with the duplex reticle. I have one from my air rifle and they are a dandy. This is a backyp scope for HBR
 
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