6mm BR vs 6mm Creedmoor

[savage110nut]

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com...action-optimized-for-6-dasher-and-6br-family/

This is a good read also...

 

[shoot4fun]

I guess you forgot one point ... how well does it shoot? Saw too many of the super expensive guns for PRS. go to a long range BR. match and leave with after they got beat soundly. They disregard all the thing it takes to to shoot small for speed and easier bolt cycling, they don't need a accurate rifle like Br.... so 3100 out of a Dasher is a quarter min. gun with 34 gr powder and 3100 with 42 gr. of powder is the cats a$$? I put be missing something....... jim

If a shooter disregards the things that let his/her rifle/ammo perform its best then it's on the shooter. My 6 Dasher repeater on a Curtis Vector will stay right there with my 6 Dasher barrels screwed on the BAT. My repeater 6 Creedmoor can also hold its own against the Dashers. The BR guns don't have to cycle rounds from a magazine but a PRS rifle does. I have ten minutes to shoot my group in BR but usually two or less to shoot ten rounds in PRS. Also, the two minutes you have for firing that ten rounds includes the time you need to use for building your position, setting your scope's elevation, etc. That is why a PRS rifle needs to feed from the magazine not only smoothly but 100% flawlessly.
The one thing I didn't mention is that my Dasher repeater does cycle from the magazine but it requires me to add the BR kit from HRD Gear to make that happen. So, you buy an $85 magazine and then add a $50 kit to it. That is something you do not have to do to shoot the 6 Creedmoor from a mag.

 

[lawrence97]

I am running a 6br out of magpul AICS mags and have not encountered any feeding or mag related issues at all. This is with a bighorn tl3 and a 26” Krieger. Mine likes the 107smk’s at 2870ish

 

[Delfuego]

If I were going into PRS I would order all the 6XC stuff including the reamer from David Tubb and never look back. I would shoot his reamer, brass, and bullets, and probably his scope reticle too.

David Tubb doesn't shoot PRS. The original 6xc reamer was a problem. His reticle is a mess. The lastest production run of DTACs are poop. And there is better brass too with alpha and Lapua 22-250. Several top shooters I know have walked away from 6xc and into 6BR variants.

Let the bread bakers bake the bread. This shooting discipline has been evolving and gear and shooters evolving with it. DT has never been in this game and is really only focused on ELR currently.

This is all fun, but if the OP really only wants to shoot a couple local steel matches, this is all moot. You can do that with damn near anything. Who cares "What The Pros Use" or what shoe Lebron wears...

 

[Sheldon N]

I shoot a lot of PRS comps, currently have both Dasher and 6BRA barrels .... If I had to be boxed into a single caliber it would be 6BRA.

If you want to keep things simple, longer barrel life, and inexpensive, roll with the 6BR. Throw a 26-28" barrel on it, 30gr of Varget behind a 105, and go to town. Ballistics don't win matches.

 

[Delfuego]

@urbanrifleman I would advise you to stay in your lane. I don't give advice on F-Class or BR for this very reason.

@PilotPhill Listen to Sheldon, he plays this game.

 

[Sheldon N]

No David does not shoot PRS. As his daughter said the other night at dinner, it is because he is 62 and has two replacement knees, or he would be shooting PRS. He does however train elite special forces snipers and SEALS and private security snipers at his facility in Texas (which is what the sport of PRS is based on). PRS is in fact, a bunch of guys WISHING they were elite military snipers. And his ELR and Adaptive rifle system, reticle, etc etc was developed while training actual professional snipers.

All of my SOF and elite mil friends who I regularly shoot PRS with would beg to differ.

Nothing against Tubb, but to imply there is a lack of talent, real world experience and legitimately qualified shooters in PRS isn't accurate.

 

[Delfuego]

Please ask him why they changed the DTAC again next time you have him for dinner. Cause the newest version blows compared to the RBT version

 

[johara1]

If a shooter disregards the things that let his/her rifle/ammo perform its best then it's on the shooter. My 6 Dasher repeater on a Curtis Vector will stay right there with my 6 Dasher barrels screwed on the BAT. My repeater 6 Creedmoor can also hold its own against the Dashers. The BR guns don't have to cycle rounds from a magazine but a PRS rifle does. I have ten minutes to shoot my group in BR but usually two or less to shoot ten rounds in PRS. Also, the two minutes you have for firing that ten rounds includes the time you need to use for building your position, setting your scope's elevation, etc. That is why a PRS rifle needs to feed from the magazine not only smoothly but 100% flawlessly.
The one thing I didn't mention is that my Dasher repeater does cycle from the magazine but it requires me to add the BR kit from HRD Gear to make that happen. So, you buy an $85 magazine and then add a $50 kit to it. That is something you do not have to do to shoot the 6 Creedmoor from a mag.

If feeding is the big deal and the 40 degree shoulder is a problem, go to the BRX they shoot better than a Creedmoor and the 30 degree shoulder will feed better. .... jim

 

[johara1]

I shoot a lot of PRS comps, currently have both Dasher and 6BRA barrels .... If I had to be boxed into a single caliber it would be 6BRA.

If you want to keep things simple, longer barrel life, and inexpensive, roll with the 6BR. Throw a 26-28" barrel on it, 30gr of Varget behind a 105, and go to town. Ballistics don't win matches.

What velocity are you getting with Varget in the 6BR. Imp. with H4895 I have no problem hitting 3000 with a 28" barrel and it will shoot under .2 all day, 2980 with 26" barrel. Drop back to 2992 with a ES of 3 it goes in a .1 or less ..... jim

 

[Sheldon N]

What velocity are you getting with Varget in the 6BR. Imp. with H4895 I have no problem hitting 3000 with a 28" barrel and it will shoot under .2 all day, 2980 with 26" barrel. Drop back to 2992 with a ES of 3 it goes in a .1 or less ..... jim

I know guys who get decent velocity but not that high. For the PRS game it's far more important that the gun run reliably in crappy condition. Imagine standing in a farm field, covered in mud, getting rained on and being told your next stage is to shoot three different prone positions where you had to run between each of them and you had 90 seconds to shoot 9 shots at 3 different targets. You need a load that will continue to work regardless. The difference between 0.5 vs 0.1 group gets lost in that situation.

Right now I run my 27.5" 6BRA at 2910 fps with a 105 hybrid, 30.4 of H4895. Shoots in the 0.2's.

 

[lawrence97]

I have reamers for the dasher, bra and BR. For prs the choice is simple.... 6br unless you care about 150fps more velocity with a Dasher or bra which also involves fireforming or paying more $$$ for hydroformed brass!

If I wanted the 150-200 fps more over the 6br I would just get a 6 creedmoor and buy brass which is readily available from several manufacturers. The 6 creed is also accurate but if you practice a lot, the barrel life is short.

 

[Sheldon N]

Side note, when I was shooting Varget in my last 6BRA barrel I was at 31.6gr and 2960 fps, 26" barrel. Shot a match in rainy/muddy conditions like described above and it was NOT happy. Tough bolt lift, loosened up primer pockets, made for a very long day.

 

[johara1]

I know guys who get decent velocity but not that high. For the PRS game it's far more important that the gun run reliably in crappy condition. Imagine standing in a farm field, covered in mud, getting rained on and being told your next stage is to shoot three different prone positions where you had to run between each of them and you had 90 seconds to shoot 9 shots at 3 different targets. You need a load that will continue to work regardless. The difference between 0.5 vs 0.1 group gets lost in that situation.

Right now I run my 27.5" 6BRA at 2910 fps with a 105 hybrid, 30.4 of H4895. Shoots in the 0.2's.

If I wanted to do that again I would go back in the Marine Corps and do it for real. Playing games, I prefer to stay away from the mud and sand.....LOL... jim

 

[shoot4fun]

What velocity are you getting with Varget in the 6BR. Imp. with H4895 I have no problem hitting 3000 with a 28" barrel and it will shoot under .2 all day, 2980 with 26" barrel. Drop back to 2992 with a ES of 3 it goes in a .1 or less ..... jim

It isn't the shoulder that is the issue. It is the length. AICS mag feed lips don't work well with the shorter case of the 6BR based cartridges.
That is why the spacer kits are out there. Magpul AICS mags will work sometime and MDT has a new mag (with spacer in it) for the 6BR. But MDT specifically states that their 6BR mag will not work with the three lug actions (Curtis Axiom, Vector, etc).

 

[shoot4fun]

I have reamers for the dasher, bra and BR. For prs the choice is simple.... 6br unless you care about 150fps more velocity with a Dasher or bra which also involves fireforming or paying more $$$ for hydroformed brass!

If I wanted the 150-200 fps more over the 6br I would just get a 6 creedmoor and buy brass which is readily available from several manufacturers. The 6 creed is also accurate but if you practice a lot, the barrel life is short.

The 6BR is not hard on a barrel and that would make it a great choice for the volume of PRS shooting. IME, the 6 Dasher makes a quick tomato stake. For me, the 6 Dasher barrels go south much sooner than my 6 Creedmoor barrels do.

 

[johara1]

The 6BR is not hard on a barrel and that would make it a great choice for the volume of PRS shooting. IME, the 6 Dasher makes a quick tomato stake. For me, the 6 Dasher barrels go south much sooner than my 6 Creedmoor barrels do.

I had Dasher barrels go 3000 round and still shot in a 1/4 min. Explain to me how you can burn more powder and go faster and last longer with a Creedmoor barrel ? That is like saying a 6.5x284 will last longer than a 6.5x47 and we sure know that ain't going to happen....jim

 

[dgeesaman]

The Dasher or BRA with the new Borden action would be the ticket in PRS.

I don’t shoot PRS but as soon as I get my Borden Super Short 6 6BRA I will report back.

Jim is having magazines made with a spacer built in so everything should be plug and play.

David

 

[shoot4fun]

I had Dasher barrels go 3000 round and still shot in a 1/4 min. Explain to me how you can burn more powder and go faster and last longer with a Creedmoor barrel ? That is like saying a 6.5x284 will last longer than a 6.5x47 and we sure know that ain't going to happen....jim

My Dasher barrel that I shot the small group with at the 2016 IBS 1,000 yard nationals had under 1,500. When I got home after that match I cleaned and inspected with a bore scope. The first 5" of rifling past the throat were gone and it had fire-cracking for 2" past that. I have others that show moderate throat erosion and cracking after 400 rounds. My 6 Creedmoor barrel has well over 2,000 rounds of 3,100 FPS 105's and is in no worse shape that the 400 round Dasher barrels. I didn't make a SWAG when I said what I said. It was based on MY EXPERIENCE. But I am guessing you are the smartest poster on the internet?

 

[Sheldon N]

IME, the 6 Dasher makes a quick tomato stake. For me, the 6 Dasher barrels go south much sooner than my 6 Creedmoor barrels do.

Generally the consensus in PRS is that a 6 Creed will go south sooner than a Dasher. Most guys I know pull Dashers at around 2k from match shooting, though they can last longer (my original Dasher barrel is up around 2300 and still shoots great but I don't take it to matches.

For the PRS game velocity is a big part of why guys ditch a barrel. Once it starts shedding speed it's not longer predictable for trajectory. That happens a fair bit sooner in the creed, on average.

Not saying your experience isn't true, just that the average round count when a shooter will pull the barrel from match rotation is probably like 1400-1500 for 6 Creed and 2000 for Dasher.