Proof barrel.......
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6mm ARC barrel recommendation
- Thread starter Ollies930
- Start date
Everything I got shows 28.1grs of Varget for the 88 to 90gr bullets.....27.7 for a 107gr another says 25.8 so you can see there is differences. I used Hodgens data because Hornadys AR data is too hot!! It seems like every damn Varget load I develop, and it shoots like a house of fire is to damn HOT!!Close to the line with LeverEvolution and over the line with Varget.
Proof is the brand?Proof barrel.......
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I was looking at the velocities not the charge. I've seen Varget as the powder used with a few that caused issues.Everything I got shows 28.1grs of Varget for the 88 to 90gr bullets.....27.7 for a 107gr another says 25.8 so you can see there is differences. I used Hodgens data because Hornadys AR data is too hot!! It seems like every damn Varget load I develop, and it shoots like a house of fire is to damn HOT!!
What are you asking?? You said, 'Was this a Ballistic Advantage barrel?" I said it was a "Proof barrel" It also said that in the description of the upper. I guess I need more info to answer your question. I don't understand what you're looking for As I remember the velocities were 2713 for the LVR and 2664 for the VargetProof is the brand?
......Thanks!!
Ok I'm asking if the company that makes the barrel is called Proof or if the barrel was designed to proof loads and then who the manufacturer was.What are you asking?? You said, 'Was this a Ballistic Advantage barrel?" I said it was a "Proof barrel" It also said that in the description of the upper. I guess I need more info to answer your question. I don't understand what you're looking for As I remember the velocities were 2713 for the LVR and 2664 for the Varget
......Thanks!!
The velocity for the Varget is over the listed Hornady velocity for an 18" barrel, the LeverEvolution load is near the maximum velocity listed.
If these are average velocities more than likely your loads are too hot.
What are you asking?? You said, 'Was this a Ballistic Advantage barrel?" I said it was a "Proof barrel" It also said that in the description of the upper. I guess I need more info to answer your question. I don't understand what your looking for......Thanks!!
Ok I'm asking if the company that makes the barrel is called Proof or if the barrel was designed to proof loads and then who the manufacturer was.
The velocity for the Varget is over the listed Hornady velocity for an 18" barrel, the LeverEvolution load is near the maximum velocity listed.
If these are average velocities more than likely your loads are too hot.
First off, yes, the company is Proof out of Montana, and they make superb barrels. Secondly you can't judge if a load is too hot by the "Velocity" listed on a loading sight!! Velocity is dependent on many different thing's barrels being one of them. Two identical barrels can produce radically different velocities. There are slow barrels and fast barrels. Seating depth can even change your velocity in the same barrel. Your brass is your best indicator of pressure. I am not seeing any pressure signs. When I was following Hornadys data I ruined close to a hundred rounds of brass because my loads "WERE" to damn hot!! I even got the Grendel belt on the brass which ruined it....Ok I'm asking if the company that makes the barrel is called Proof or if the barrel was designed to proof loads and then who the manufacturer was.
The velocity for the Varget is over the listed Hornady velocity for an 18" barrel, the LeverEvolution load is near the maximum velocity listed.
If these are average velocities more than likely your loads are too hot.
I have 2 18" 6 mm ARC with Proof Research SS barrels. I don't shoot carbon wrap barrels...Both shoot .5" 5 shot groups at about the same speed. The Ballistics Advantage barrel was a 2" to 2.5" 5 shot group barrel and discarded it for another Proof is how I ended up with 2 ARs with Proof barrels. All 1250 cases are 6.5 Grendel FL sized & trimed.
I have tried every bullet at available from 105, 107, 108, 110, 112, 115, from every manufacturer that had them in stock. You can not push the 6 mm ARC in an AR-15 because of the ultra thin Grendel bolts, but it still a pretty good cartridge for an AR-15.
But 1200 yds is asking alot...but it can be done. The best powder is Leverevolution, with 108 gr Berger, 108 ELDM, 110 SMK set it out long, has very good BC. Will work for your long range 6 mm ARC. The Proof Research SS 6mm ARC barrels I have both shoot good groups with the same the same exact ammo, and I recommend them ...Proof barrels are good in 308 too.
I forgot you don't reload! You Need to learn...no one, shoots to the potential of the rifle or shooter with factory loads...I never shoot factory loads in any rifle or pistol I own... fact...it's a waste of money. Most 6 mm ARCs with factory ammo and Ballistic Advantage barrels do 2" plus 5 shot groups and early Hornady factory ammo bullets stuck in chamber and dumped powder into the AR action in many of the early videos. Proof barrels start at $500 and handloading is your key to success...it's a time consuming learning process...but the Proof Research 6mm ARC 7.5 twist barrel should help...plus there is more to AR building than putting a bunch of parts together.
I have tried every bullet at available from 105, 107, 108, 110, 112, 115, from every manufacturer that had them in stock. You can not push the 6 mm ARC in an AR-15 because of the ultra thin Grendel bolts, but it still a pretty good cartridge for an AR-15.
But 1200 yds is asking alot...but it can be done. The best powder is Leverevolution, with 108 gr Berger, 108 ELDM, 110 SMK set it out long, has very good BC. Will work for your long range 6 mm ARC. The Proof Research SS 6mm ARC barrels I have both shoot good groups with the same the same exact ammo, and I recommend them ...Proof barrels are good in 308 too.
I forgot you don't reload! You Need to learn...no one, shoots to the potential of the rifle or shooter with factory loads...I never shoot factory loads in any rifle or pistol I own... fact...it's a waste of money. Most 6 mm ARCs with factory ammo and Ballistic Advantage barrels do 2" plus 5 shot groups and early Hornady factory ammo bullets stuck in chamber and dumped powder into the AR action in many of the early videos. Proof barrels start at $500 and handloading is your key to success...it's a time consuming learning process...but the Proof Research 6mm ARC 7.5 twist barrel should help...plus there is more to AR building than putting a bunch of parts together.
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I could not agree more, handloads have always ruled the roost regardless of type of firearm. I also agree that the 6MM ARC and I suspect the 6.5 Grendel require critical thought when building and when reloading. The designs have a thin margin of error in my opinion.I have 2 18" 6 mm ARC with Proof Research SS barrels. I don't shoot carbon wrap barrels...Both shoot .5" 5 shot groups at about the same speed. The Ballistics Advantage barrel was a 2" to 2.5" 5 shot group barrel and discarded it for another Proof is how I ended up with 2 ARs with Proof barrels. All 1250 cases are 6.5 Grendel FL sized & trimed.
I have tried every bullet at available from 105, 107, 108, 110, 112, 115, from every manufacturer that had them in stock. You can not push the 6 mm ARC in an AR-15 because of the ultra thin Grendel bolts, but it still a pretty good cartridge for an AR-15.
But 1200 yds is asking alot...but it can be done. The best powder is Leverevolution, with 108 gr Berger, 108 ELDM, 110 SMK set it out long, has very good BC. Will work for your long range 6 mm ARC. The Proof Research SS 6mm ARC barrels I have both shoot good groups with the same the same exact ammo, and I recommend them ...Proof barrels are good in 308 too.
I forgot you don't reload! You Need to learn...no one, shoots to the potential of the rifle or shooter with factory loads...I never shoot factory loads in any rifle or pistol I own... fact...it's a waste of money. Most 6 mm ARCs with factory ammo and Ballistic Advantage barrels do 2" plus 5 shot groups and early Hornady factory ammo bullets stuck in chamber and dumped powder into the AR action in many of the early videos. Proof barrels start at $500 and handloading is your key to success...it's a time consuming learning process...but the Proof Research 6mm ARC 7.5 twist barrel should help...plus there is more to AR building than putting a bunch of parts together.
Maybe I got extremely lucky with my Aero Precision and the 16" Ballistic Advantage barrel. My rifle is a complete an Aero Precision rifle as possible. However when first shooting mine I sighted in and after I have shot 10-5 shot groups with factory Hornady Black 105 grain. I have zero issues with fired brass. The average was 1/2" at 100 yards, I no longer shoot 100 yard groups as the practice is uninteresting for me. I practice CQB and 2 shot field drills out to 650 yards. My rifle was a CQB, general purpose concept, I will shoot 1 load all the time so that whenever I use it the performance is always the same.
I bought plenty of the Hornady Black for a few reasons, I wanted a baseline of performance, I needed brass and the ammo provides time for me to shoot the rifle while I develop my own loads.
I researched powders and LeverEvolution is the only powder that makes sense for the weight bullets that make sense for my style of rifle. If I develop a load that averages max velocity as listed in the Hornady data over 10 shots I'll back off. I'll accept maybe 1 or 2 out of 10 that equal max listed velocity but not 5 or 6 that are over velocity producing a max average out of 10. That's granted that I achieve near maximum velocity without issues. My practice in this case will be to utilize my chronographed factory loads as maximum average. In the field if I can make consistent hits on 1/2 silhouette sized targets at 600 yards it will be because of consistent performance from my rifle, ammo and me not some silly 30 more FPS.
Handloaders sometimes push loads from data but I believe that Hornady may have listed peak velocities rather than average and with a design like the 6MM ARC it begs consideration.
True, and some BA barrels shoot good to acceptable about 1 in 3 for me, the 300 black out, and one 308 in their premium line MOA guarantee would actually do that or better, the 308 more finicky about the ammo it liked . The more expensive Proof Research has been consistent in shooting good groups, so I quit buying BA Barrels these days. Schilen make some good barrels, Wilson Combat has for me had a high percentage, but also sent one back after borescopeing it. And had to rechamber a new Oden Works 9MM barrel.I could not agree more, handloads have always ruled the roost regardless of type of firearm. I also agree that the 6MM ARC and I suspect the 6.5 Grendel require critical thought when building and when reloading. The designs have a thin margin of error in my opinion.
Maybe I got extremely lucky with my Aero Precision and the 16" Ballistic Advantage barrel. My rifle is a complete an Aero Precision rifle as possible. However when first shooting mine I sighted in and after I have shot 10-5 shot groups with factory Hornady Black 105 grain. I have zero issues with fired brass. The average was 1/2" at 100 yards, I no longer shoot 100 yard groups as the practice is uninteresting for me. I practice CQB and 2 shot field drills out to 650 yards. My rifle was a CQB, general purpose concept, I will shoot 1 load all the time so that whenever I use it the performance is always the same.
I bought plenty of the Hornady Black for a few reasons, I wanted a baseline of performance, I needed brass and the ammo provides time for me to shoot the rifle while I develop my own loads.
I researched powders and LeverEvolution is the only powder that makes sense for the weight bullets that make sense for my style of rifle. If I develop a load that averages max velocity as listed in the Hornady data over 10 shots I'll back off. I'll accept maybe 1 or 2 out of 10 that equal max listed velocity but not 5 or 6 that are over velocity producing a max average out of 10. That's granted that I achieve near maximum velocity without issues. My practice in this case will be to utilize my chronographed factory loads as maximum average. In the field if I can make consistent hits on 1/2 silhouette sized targets at 600 yards it will be because of consistent performance from my rifle, ammo and me not some silly 30 more FPS.
Handloaders sometimes push loads from data but I believe that Hornady may have listed peak velocities rather than average and with a design like the 6MM ARC it begs consideration.
So I'm prejudice against barrel companies that do not make a lot of accurate barrels right from the start..and that is a short list. The more I chamber the more I go to those expensive barrels in bolt guns, or buy them for gas guns...Bartlein has become a favorite in the past few years...I just purchased a Faxon 3 twist a few months ago...it was the worst looking barrel inside I've ever seen the 3 twist was galled torn rifling, and pits one across the groove...but it's the only chambering in that caliber. Ran a cleaning patch through it, it came out rusty with slivers and small chunks of metal... So I lapped it with 240 silvon carbide before installing. It's not much of a shooter but has promise with a few loads, but the site load data is way over pressure on the 225 gr, and the lead core super sonic came apart in the muzzle brake damaging the third baffle, and the Magneto Speed bayonet...ordered 500 copper bullets to see if they stay together at supersonic speeds... so far the 8.6 blackout is the worst and most limited cartridge I've ever tried IMO ...unless you just shoot subs and the unattainable 350 gr hunting bullet where it would appear to be at it's best. A big waste of money and not like the versatility of tbe 300 blackout...I ask Faxon for an 8 twist but they haven't responded to, or addressed any of my concerns about the barrel...their 223 barrel was okay but I wouldn't buy another, and gave it away.
So I gravitate to things that work for me...but even reputable companies put out a rare unacceptable product...then it's how they respond to the customer, with a valid complaint...
I've had several put together and I have different standards depending on their use. My varmint and custom game rifles I want as good as can be. They all shoot average 1 1/16" at 300 yards with field furniture.True, and some BA barrels shoot good to acceptable about 1 in 3 for me, the 300 black out, and one 308 in their premium line MOA guarantee would actually do that or better, the 308 more finicky about the ammo it liked . The more expensive Proof Research has been consistent in shooting good groups, so I quit buying BA Barrels these days. Schilen make some good barrels, Wilson Combat has for me had a high percentage, but also sent one back after borescopeing it. And had to rechamber a new Oden Works 9MM barrel.
So I'm prejudice against barrel companies that do not make a lot of accurate barrels right from the start..and that is a short list. The more I chamber the more I go to those expensive barrels in bolt guns, or buy them for gas guns...Bartlein has become a favorite in the past few years...I just purchased a Faxon 3 twist a few months ago...it was the worst looking barrel inside I've ever seen the 3 twist was galled torn rifling, and pits one across the groove...but it's the only chambering in that caliber. Ran a cleaning patch through it, it came out rusty with slivers and small chunks of metal... So I lapped it with 240 silvon carbide before installing. It's not much of a shooter but has promise with a few loads, but the site load data is way over pressure on the 225 gr, and the lead core super sonic came apart in the muzzle brake damaging the third baffle, and the Magneto Speed bayonet...ordered 500 copper bullets to see if they stay together at supersonic speeds... so far the 8.6 blackout is the worst and most limited cartridge I've ever tried IMO ...unless you just shoot subs and the unattainable 350 gr hunting bullet where it would appear to be at it's best. A big waste of money and not like the versatility of tbe 300 blackout...I ask Faxon for an 8 twist but they haven't responded to, or addressed any of my concerns about the barrel...their 223 barrel was okay but I wouldn't buy another, and gave it away.
So I gravitate to things that work for me...but even reputable companies put out a rare unacceptable product...then it's how they respond to the customer, with a valid complaint...
I had the Rifler build a 450 Marlin bolt for me and you don't expect a dangerous game guide rifle to shoot super accurate but reliability is an absolute. Mike knows his stuff and the Shilan Barrel shoots like no tomorrow and function is perfect. Of course, 5 - 5 shot groups in one day and you need rest, but if you can hold it, it shoots one ragged hole at 50 and 100 with 500 grain projectiles. Not bad for something designed for Kodiak bear.
I wanted an AR that would work really well (as good as an M@ Carbine) in close but exceed the accurate reach of an M4 in 5.56 x 45. I didn't expect the Aero M4E to be as accurate as it is, but I'll take it. So far it's a peach but hand loads require expert work.
There was an enormous amt of published data and user arguments on the 6.5 Grendel bolt lugs and face because of this very issue, the 6ARC shares the same bolt head face. 3 parts I do not go cheap on; bolt, trigger and barrel! Everything else is furniture, excluding optics ofcourse. Atleast you made the right decision going to JP.Had a surprising event happen to me yesterday out load testing some 90gr Bergers. I was using 28grs of varget and I sheard off a bolt lug!! Could not believe this happened!! I can't remember the brand of the bolt, but I know it was not a top name one. I didn't figure I would have a problem since I never go over the recommended load data. I even shied away from Hornady data because it ran on the hot side esp with Varget. I ordered a JP bolt last night from Brownells so I hope that will cure the problem....
I can’t make an informed statement yet as my AR platform rifle won’t arrive until next week. I sent my parts off to Mark Chanlynn and had him build a 21 inch barrel. I wasn’t aware of it at the time but Marks barrels are cut rifled which I knew but I wasn’t aware he does a left hand twist. I’ll get it this coming week and at some point in time hop on and give a run down. I’ve had Kreiger, Bartlien, Boots, Marquart, but they were all on rifles. I have high hopes but will find out soon.
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