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6BR load with 68 Berger

The factory barrel is 29", one inch short of the 30” BenchRest model. I use Varget in a number of guns that all have shorter barrels and it is one of my favorite powders. If I cant get good groups with Varget I figure I have something wrong. 22" 30-06 and .270 sub MOA, .220 Swift with a 26" barrel, dime sized groups and now this 6MM BR with a 29" barrel is really nailing it. The only non factory is my .220 Swift. I built that around a Shilen #3 that was available at the gunsmith school for a pretty good price.

The other point is that if you are basing powder selection on how much burns in your barrel length you will never get the best accuracy. The ideal situation is that all the powder is consumed within the brass itself. So any powder that burns in the barrel is having a negative affect because the pressure curve is all messed up. You want peak in the bell and a pretty sharp drop after that. If you choose any powder figuring it will burn in the barrel you end up with a pressure curve that starts off nice but drags on rather than give a smooth falloff. Keep in mind that unburned powder also adds to the a mass you are pushing down the barrel. No small matter is that the pressure is dropping rapidly as the mass of unburned powder speeds down your barrel. This lower pressure is going to ignite some of that powder in a less efficient manner than the powder in the case, which had the benefit of over 50,000 PSI, Pressure is critical to ignition. So you may think you are pushing a 68 grain bullet, but if you are using so much powder that it has granules tumbling down the barrel, these have to added to the weight of the bullet itself, at least until they burn off.

Every barrel has a preference but you can assume that the powder density allows you to fill the case as full as possible will give you every advantage. Trying for faster powders may help but of you can only go with a 70% load density your powder may not burn consistently and be position sensitive.

All this of course provides you with plenty of issues where one thing seems better but it contradicts another rule. Try to find a powder that burns and quickly as possible without sending half it weight powder down the barrel.

If you are shooting single shot, try jamming the bullet into the lands. It helps align the brass and bullet concentricity and the extra pressure on ignition will give you a much better bell curve of pressure. The whole game is about the pressure curve. The curve determines the barrels whip and you need it the same each shot. If you don't jam, then neck tension may be different each shot and thus the pressure curve will be different as well. So each shot the bullet exits with the barrel in a different location . Try to establish enough safe neck tension to give the cleanest possible burn within the case itself. If you cannot seat into the rifling, (hunters should not unless you can fire your gun to empty it) then learn to anneal your brass so your neck tension is the same with each bullet on release. This helps the pressure curve of the burn to be the same each time. All this of course assumes you have made selections that have your bullet properly stabilized in flight.

A hotter primer can at times help with a more consistent powder ignition and thus give more FPS ( at times up to 75 FPS) and a quicker pressure curve. You can do something with each powder to establish a good curve. Of course, workup to the load, especially when introducing a new primer. Winchester primers in my gun give me 50 FPS extra while changing nothing else./ Since velocity is the correct result of the pressure, you can assume that the primer is increasing your overall chamber pressure, so proceed with caution.

every powder than can be user in your gun safely has a sweet spot. It may never have as good as sweet spot as another powder but if you are stuck for now using only a handful of powders, the quickest way to know what load is your best with that powder and bullet, primer combination is to ladder test. It can tell you in 10 shots what your charge should be for your particular combination. The results are stunning and may very well change your mind about what powders you should use and if you need to weigh or throw your charges. That is another discussion, Google how to ladder test, it will change the way you approach load development and powder selection. It will also keep you from using up your barrel, just to find the right load.

In any event, the proof is in the pudding. Every day groups in .1s and that .096 just made my day. I have over 14 powders to choose from and I keep coming back to Varget, 3 to 1 over every other powder I use.
 
I'm new to the 6BR so maybe some of you fellows can help me out. Recently purchased a new Savage LRPV in 6BR with a 12" twist. Loaded it with some old 68 gr Bruno BTHPs, 29 gr of 322 and 205M primers using Redding full length "S" type dies. Sighted it in ad then fired a 5 shot group at the 300 yd range. Measured center to center and got an a 1.25 group which I was satisfied with, but the empty cases (Lapua) and only second loading were really heavily covered in carbon. I haven't done anything to experiment with proximity to lands yet but was wondering if COL would account for the excessive carbon on these cases. I've never used a bushing die before like Redding (RCBS guy) and was thinking maybe i'm messing up there. Extremely pleased with this cartridge's performance but want to make sure I'm handloading properly. Thanks for any insight.
 
Robby: Your comment about dirty case necks with H322 verifies what I said previousely about VV N133 & N135. It burns clean. Now have 268 documented rounds fired with a new 1-14 Bartlein 6BR chambering and after giving it a normal cleaning with Butch's, thought I better scope out the bore with my Hawkeye, expecting to see enough carbon ( the same carbon that's on your case necks) & do my usual cleaning routine with JB bore paste. Not one trace of carbon in the bore ! :) It looks like the day I picjed it up at the 'smiths, 6 weeks ago. All 268 rds. fired were with N133 & most recently N135. I know from past experience if those same number of rounds were with most other types of powders, I would be doing the JB routine. On top of being very clean burning I also find it to work in any & all my slow twist barrels, and it's very consistant from one can/lot to another. Hard to find I know but the search is worth it to me. Your problems have nothing to do with loading techniques and everything to do with the fouling associated with some powders.
 
fdshuster, thanks for the response. I have a couple of pounds of N133 and just picked up a can of N135 the other day, and think I'll try the later first. Been hearing good things about the powder and now have good reason to try it. In the past I always used 322 for my .222 Rem and got good results but never so much carbon. Maybe now will be able to break that 1 inch mark at 300 with N135. ::)
 
In my limited experience with H322, you will get a lot of carbon until you get to the upper load window. And, generally speaking, carbon down on the cases indicates a low pressure load. Seems like 6BR's with slow twist barrels & the lighter bullets tend to give good accuracy at moderate pressure levels, but there may be even better performance at higher levels; you just have to work through it & see. The VV powders do seem to shoot cleaner than most others, and I've seen them give excellent accuracy over as many as 3 nodes. Until I started shooting the 30BR in score shooting, I always used VV powders in my 6BR & 6PPC rifles.
 
Curious if the guys shooting N135 are getting the vel. that VV states on their site? I shot some Benchmark @31.6 and got 3200 fps from that 22" barrel with a 70 Sierra.

Longone
 
longone 1 what kind of velocity are you looking for?
I have shot many powders that can push a 65 gr bullet at 3,500 fps mv out of a 24-26" 6BR tube with out excessive pressures, But i kind of feel and have chrony'd a few different rifle's, and it would seem that with a 65-68 gr bullet the best accuracy comes around 3,450FPS..now that's my experience.
A friend of mine was up in the 33.5gr range of N135 and we chrony'd it at 3,450 fps.with a 65gr bullet.
Now i have shot IMR8208xbr with a 70 gr sierra bk at 3,550 out of a 24" 6BR..very hot load on matched up cases.
with what i consider poor accuracy say .290's to .450's but the load has worked well in the varmint fields.
 
Was able to chronograph 32.5 of N135 with the 68 gr. Bergers, seated to touch, fed. 205's out of three 14 twist chamberings. Average velocity is 3510 fps with a maximum 19 fps between the high & low, 3520 to 3501.
 
I'm asking only to see if I'm a bit to slow or fast. I realize that each barrel, chamber, bullet combination will yield different results, with that in mind my thought was do I keep searching for more velocity and perhaps find another accuracy node or am I in a good spot at 3200 fps.? I'm not really looking to make the bench back up with each shot, I would prefer to be a little light on velocity rather than being on the edge where you need to watch the weather for temp and humidity and so on.

Sometimes the powder and bullet makers throw numbers out that are real soft for liability reasons, the real world tends to go the other way with some folks on the edge, I like accuracy over velocity, when you start getting near the pressure signs I'll take the last best group.

Longone
 
Longone: I actually pay no attention to the velocities as quoted by the ammo, powder, etc. manufacturers. To me they are meaningless: I only care about what my rifles & load combinations do. I am like you though, will sacrifice velocity to favor group size, the reason I was satisfied with the 30 grs. of N133. I knew it was on the mild side, groups were excellent, but would come up short sometimes at the 300 yd. line. That's why I was pleasently surprised to find the improvements at 300 yd., and even with a limited number fired at 400 yards, with the 32.5 grs. of N135. Bolt lift, primers, extraction etc. are all normal, so pressures are not an issue. You'll have to make the decision as to what is "too slow or fast". :)
 
ah you guy's got me wanting to take another look at the N135 myself..
Now i need some N135 to retry in my new rifle. I will allways keep shooting the RL10 as long as it keeps shooting but I'm now trying to deal on some N135, I have different loads for different things , ie. like match, longrange,varmint hunting etc.. I also set up different case Lot's for that also.
My powder cabnet looks like the local sportshop.
I am a velocity nut,I like the speed. i like to able to shoot through the wind and i do shoot varmint's out to 600-750 yard area,so the more i can get and still maintain extreme accuracy the better. But i will give up the velocity for accuracy or i would be shooting AA2460(witch i still have a can of) I have pushed a 65 Gr V max over 3,650 Fps MV out of a 26" barreled 6BR with AA2460 . but it was 3/4 moa at best. so I found a sweet load of H335 with the 65 v-max at 3,450 something MV . The great thing about H335 was when the temp's got into the high 90's to 100's H335 just pounds them in a hole. then i found RL10 and been hooked ever since, ain't' The 6BR fun?
 
I'm very new to score shootin that's why I am with the 6 BR. It's the old game of velocity VS. weight. If you can chuck a 68 at 3400 fps will it beat the 118 gr. or at least be close? I have shot exactly 3 score matches, two @ 200 and one @ 100. The last score @ 100 was a 248-9 so I think there might be a little hope for me. My plan is to shoot this next season with my current rifle and try to learn something, I see the rests and bags that the top finishers are using and understand that this is an equipment race as well. I have discovered that I am a competitive person from the many years of X-course shooting that I have under my belt. I enjoy competition, it gets my ticker going.

I have been looking for N 135 but just can't find any in my area and with winter closing in time is getting short to test, so I will try some RL-10 that I was able to come up with and see what that does till I can locate some.

Longone
 
wow ... i've been sleepin over a yr doesn't anyone use varget in the 6Br..?
i skim'd thru the pages of thread didn't read all... but also didn't see any mention of varget

i just spon off my 30 today an stuck my 6Br back on an have some 70 sierra's an a can of varget i'd like to use up though i'd check in an see watts cook'n my older notes aren't to clear "hoping" ... if anyone has a good varget load for a 70gr.. they would like to share if you will... please do....

my barrel is 21" w/ 14tw on a 700 action

thanks
 
RichG: I keep the Varget for 80 gr. and heavier bullets. Tried VV140, ( same burn rate as Varget) with the mid & heavier weights, but Varget was "the winner". So, I use VV for the lighter weights only. I also prefer 205 & 205M primers with VV and CCI BR4's with Varget, just my way of doing things. Whatever works for you. ;)
 
Thanks FD"""
it dawnd on me to go to the home pg.. ;) ... i found some info under 6Br i could use as a start place ..

i see better performing powders but i'l play with watt i have an save the good stuff for more inportant shoots

for now i'l just stretch out the barel fit the stock an site in.....
 
western powders powder burn rate chart list n135 and n530 about the same...n530?slightly faster? i have some of the n530 and very little of n135. anybody tried the n530 with the 68s?
 
Thanks guys. Bullets arrived today and I haven't had a chance to load any but took some measurements with the hornady guage and there's not much bullet left in the case. Say roughly eighth of an inch down in the neck from the top from a hard jam (Thanks Eric)!!. Ill try them jumped 20 thou as that will give a little more bullet in the neck and see how it works out.
 

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