6.5mm Creedmoor reloading -- greatest accuracy; questions

[BlueWater]

Question: Seeking the most-accurate powder and bullet combination that people are finding, for the 6.5mm Creedmoor. Wanting to know what you 65CM reloaders have found through experience, despite what the loading guides do or don't say.


Would like to take advantage of the high-BC abilities of some of the more capable bullets (ie, Hornady 140gr ELD-M, Hornady 135gr A-Tip). But, accuracy first, for me.

I realize every given gun is slightly different, given varying tolerances from manufacture, variability in the reloaded cartridges.


Range: 200-500yds will be occasional, 500-1000yds will be frequent.
Purpose: general target shooting, no competition.
Gun: Savage 12 LRP 6.5 Creedmoor 1:8" twist 26" heavy bbl
Scope: Athlon Cronus BTR scope, FFP, I.R. mil reticle, 4.5x29x56mm
Reloading components: Starting with Lapua 65CM SR brass, CCI SR primers, and seeking the most-accurate and least-variable powder for this purpose. Starting with Hodgdon H4831SC, Hodgdon Superformance, Hodgdon H4350, Alliant Reloder 16 and Vihtavuori N150, for initial load batches to see how each performs in this gun.
Reloading steps: Will be prepping the primer pockets, flash holes, verifying neck thickness uniformity. Will be measuring the chamber on this gun, to know the gun's CBTO (base to ogive). Will be full-length bushing sizing with specific neck tension, micrometer bullet seating, and checking for concentricity. Considering annealing. Will separate out the most-egregiously variable units from the batch (using those for 100-200yd plinking rounds). Will be calibrating the powder scale(s) and the first couple of cartridges made in each reloading batch, measuring against the ideal. Will start slow, working up gradually to a decent load; but would love to start with what many have found to be a great 'accuracy' load.

I've scanned a few of the burn rate charts, out there, for powders. Most of the reloading guides suggest 65CM loads somewhere between Vihtavuori N150 and Hodgdon Superformance (ie, burn rate chart @ LoadData, and burn rate chart @ Hodgdon/IMR). Few of the reloading guides indicate an 'accuracy load' they recommend. Few indicate measures of variability on velocity.

Have a half dozen different reloading manuals, listing loads. And have a few from the online sources (mostly the powder makers).

Some specific questions:

1. What are your particular 65CM powder and primer choices for exceptional accuracy 500-1000yds? (If you're willing to provide.)
2. Have you used a custom "match" cut barrel and noticed huge improvements in accuracy and reduction in variability?
3. Have you used a longer barrel (ie, 27-29") for the 65CM and noticed improvements in velocity while maintaining sane pressures and retaining exceptional accuracy? Or have you and all the manufacturers noted that 26" is the "sweet spot" such that gains aren't attained beyond 26" in the 65CM load?
   

 

[358WCF]

Dont discount RL26 with the heavier (140gr +) bullets.

 

[Bc'z]

Search "Secret Carolina Load "

 

[Retired Grunt]

My Savage 12LRP likes 36.4 Varget and Berger 140VLD's, I just got back from the Range testing Accurate 4350 with Hornady 140 BTHP Match, Shot great. I was using Hornady three times fired LRP with LR Magnum Primers.

 

[wbm]

Have three 6.5CM's at present. Two for general hunting/varmint and one 110 Tactical for whatever.

Best overall load I have fired so far in any 6.5CM was with 140gr Nosler RDF's and 6.5 StaBall powder. Hornady brass, Federal 210M Primers, 41-43gr StaBall....42.5gr did best. COL was important with the RDF's in all the Savages. COL of 2.850" was the "magic" number for the Savage 110T.

 

[lawman29]

Shot F class and hunted with 6.5 creedmoor.
1) H4350, Federal 210M and 130 Berger VLD.
2) Both barrels custom Bartlein on "700" actions. Both upgraded triggers - Jewel.
4) ~ 24" barrel (3b contour) Manners stock on hunting rig. Finished ~ 29" straight contour McMillian stock on F class. Can't compared apples to oranges.

 

[BlueWater]

Interesting, about that "Secret Carolina Load" thread reference, above. Pretty much where I've been headed on my intended first load to try out:

Brass -- Lapua #4PH6011 65CM SR cases (same lots)
Primers -- CCI #400 SR or #450 magnum SR (same lots)
Powder -- Hodgdon H4831SC (same lots)
Bullets -- Hornady #26331 140gr ELD-M bullets (same lots)

Will be using Redding bushing-type dies for neck tension control, and Redding competition micrometer seater die. With a range of accuracy-oriented measurement tools and gauges. (COAL/CBTO gauge; pocket uniforming; flash hole deburring; neck diam check; concentricity. Ought to do for starters. Though, I don't imagine the Lapua brass will have many flaws.)

Am currently getting the rifle+scope set up properly. Components are all in, so almost ready to go. Just looking to nail the first load or two to attempt.

For somewhat lighter bullets (say, the Hornady 130gr ELD-M or the Hornady 135gr A-Tip match), I'll have to think about an appropriate powder for those as well. Might be interesting, to get velocity to stay in the high-BC range longer, even if going down in bullet weight a tad. (Somewhat like a 6 CM versus 6.5 CM comparison ends up being, with certain bullets.)

I'll review each of the suggestions. Much appreciated.


Great comments, everyone. Thank you. Keep 'em coming, if you've got 'em.

Have shot a few rifles, but it's been more than a decade. Got fairly capable with a Rem 700 .243 26", back when; Jewell trigger and custom bedded fiberglass stock. Was regularly doing 0.75" groups at 300yds and did a best of 0.625". Not bad, considering I had a marginal scope at the time without good optical clarity.

Have dabbled with reloading, but never gone "all-in" on a full setup or dealt all the accuracy details (beyond assisting buddies).

So, we'll see how this all goes.

 

[BlueWater]

Shot F class and hunted with 6.5 creedmoor.
1) H4350, Federal 210M and 130 Berger VLD.
2) Both barrels custom Bartlein on "700" actions. Both upgraded triggers - Jewel.
4) ~ 24" barrel (3b contour) Manners stock on hunting rig. Finished ~ 29" straight contour McMillian stock on F class. Can't compared apples to oranges.

Love the Jewell trigger. Did a Jewell HVR on a Rem 700 .243, and it was simply stellar. Cut groups in half, just doing that. A custom, bedded fiberglass stock cut them in half again. I'm sure going to a "proper" scope for distance would have knocked off another good percentage. As would reloading, had I been doing reloading.


How did your 700-action w/ 29" Bartlein do in terms of accuracy and velocity? Did you have a great "accuracy" load that you relied on with that longer barrel? This was in the 6.5mm Creedmoor, yes?

 

[BlueWater]

Have three 6.5CM's at present. Two for general hunting/varmint and one 110 Tactical for whatever.

Best overall load I have fired so far in any 6.5CM was with 140gr Nosler RDF's and 6.5 StaBall powder. Hornady brass, Federal 210M Primers, 41-43gr StaBall....42.5gr did best. COL was important with the RDF's in all the Savages. COL of 2.850" was the "magic" number for the Savage 110T.

COL being a "magic" factor, in the Savages ... what, in terms of allowing reasonable case capacity?

Of course, everyone's CBTO is going to differ, but may I ask what was yours in that Savage 110T?

I've been considering the Win StaBall 6.5 powder, though I haven't seen many loads with them nor people mentioning that powder for the Creedmoor caliber. I'm thinking it might be about the right speed.

 

[BlueWater]

Dont discount RL26 with the heavier (140gr +) bullets.

Reloder 26 is fairly slow burning, is it not, for a 6.5 Creedmoor load? Certainly as compared to nearly all of the load suggestions put out by the powder manufacturers.

For RL26 the heavier bullet the better and the longer barrel the better, I'd suspect. (Though, I don't know.)

 

[Breakshunter]

Mine is loving RL26 and 143eldx bullets, 2970fps and .5 moa or under. Trued rem 700 action with a 27" Lilja barrel and a Jewell trigger in a B&C sporter stock. Hornady brass and federal 210m primers. Now if I could just find more powder and bullets!

 

[JB10]

My browning xbolt eclipse likes h4350 and 140 berger vld hunting.
My savage 110 tactical likes r16 with 140eldm
Both using hornady brass untill i destroy all the primer pockets, then i will switch brands. Both shoot just under 1/4 moa if i can hold still. The savage i was able to get a 3 inch group at 1,025 yards. I was impressed by a $590 rifle with no modifications done to it.

 

[Juppe12]

Lapua brass SRP, Vihtavuori N150 or N555, Lapua 8g (123gr) OTM Scenar works best for my rifle, Sako S20 precision.
Also Vihtavuori N550 and 140gr SMK, but this load is temperature sensitive.

Edit:
Using Redding S-type full die.
And accuracy is below 0.5MOA 200m, using ordinary bipod.

 

[STOMP442]

The Creedmoor is honestly one of the easiest calibers to tune. As you can see by the responses in this thread there are multiple bullets and powders being used with great results. Pick a bullet and powder combo you think will work good and give it go. Chances are you will find a happy spot somewhere. For me personally R16 or H4350 have always given me the best results with 140 Bergers being my preferred projectile.

 

[CNC-Dude]

I use Superformance with Hornady brass and 147g ELD-M projectiles. I've shot consistent 3/8 MOA's at 1000 years in my RPR. I now am shooting Lapua brass with 144g Bergers with Superformance and have gotten consistent 1/4 MOA's at that same distance with a best of .19 MOA.

 

[wbm]

The Nosler 140 RDF is on the lands at 2.810" in my Savage 110T. My best groups came at a COAL of 2.750".

 

[358WCF]

Reloder 26 is fairly slow burning, is it not, for a 6.5 Creedmoor load? Certainly as compared to nearly all of the load suggestions put out by the powder manufacturers.

For RL26 the heavier bullet the better and the longer barrel the better, I'd suspect. (Though, I don't know.)

Like you, I'm shooting a box stock factory rifle. I picked up a cheapo Ruger Predator in 6.5CM with a low end Vortex scope just to see what all the Creedmoor hub-bub was about. The 22" bbl. safely produces a tad over 2900fps with 140s & a caseful of RL26. A grain higher showed almost 3000fps with a little more bolt lift than usual so was backed down. RL26 really is pretty amazing stuff.

RE OAL: I generally shoot 4 shot groups while developing loads & there was *always* a wild flyer. No set pattern, but always 3 & 1. A longer OAL brought the flyers closer into the group by a significant amount & the rifle will consistently shoot around 1/2" now. Starting with backing down a little on the powder charge & jamming about a square into the lands then going shorter in .020" increments was the trick. Hard jam not smart on a field gun, but it gave test results that were notably better than anything tried previously at the bench. Fine tuning in .005" increments around the happy spot from the prior test & the final OAL is at touch plus about .005". There's still a hint of 3 & 1, but just a little bit. For what it is, it's not worth messing with any more. I prefer my wood stocked 6.5x55.

FWIW H4895 & RL15 worked pretty well for me accuracy & velocitywise with 120s.

 

[CharlieNC]

I fear you risk creating more variability by attempting to improve the primer pocket and flash holes on the Lapua brass than you can improve. Try the 123 Scenar, the higher velocity offsets it's lower bc in terms of vertical with some sacrifice in wind sensitivity. But it is the most accurate I have tried.

 

[BlueWater]

I fear you risk creating more variability by attempting to improve the primer pocket and flash holes on the Lapua brass than you can improve. Try the 123 Scenar, the higher velocity offsets it's lower bc in terms of vertical with some sacrifice in wind sensitivity. But it is the most accurate I have tried.

Oh, I understand. The Lapua cases ought to be pretty darned great to begin with. Definitely don't want to foul up good cases.

But double-checking on the primer pockets and flash holes in the event accuracy's wonky is one of those things I'm prepared to do if need be. Starting with the Lapuas and starting with several 100rds from same-lot boxes ought to negate much of that risk.

I'm open to the 120-136gr stuff. But will be starting, at least initially, with the Hornady 140gr ELD-M. A friend who reloads has the same rifle, those ELD-M bullets, and we can check each other. So, not a bad place to start. But yeah, taking advantage of a fairly-good BC with the 123gr Lapua Scenar (as opposed to great BC) sound great, if the higher velocity yields greater time in the high-BC realm. I'll definitely be exploring, as I'm working up loads. Since the goal is to do 500-1000yd much of the time, I'd prefer the somewhat higher-weight bullets, but whatever works.

What load have you found seems to work best for you, with the Lapua 123gr Scenar bullet?

 

[CharlieNC]

Oh, I understand. The Lapua cases ought to be pretty darned great to begin with. Definitely don't want to foul up good cases.

But double-checking on the primer pockets and flash holes in the event accuracy's wonky is one of those things I'm prepared to do if need be. Starting with the Lapuas and starting with several 100rds from same-lot boxes ought to negate much of that risk.

I'm open to the 120-136gr stuff. But will be starting, at least initially, with the Hornady 140gr ELD-M. A friend who reloads has the same rifle, those ELD-M bullets, and we can check each other. So, not a bad place to start. But yeah, taking advantage of a fairly-good BC with the 123gr Lapua Scenar (as opposed to great BC) sound great, if the higher velocity yields greater time in the high-BC realm. I'll definitely be exploring, as I'm working up loads. Since the goal is to do 500-1000yd much of the time, I'd prefer the somewhat higher-weight bullets, but whatever works.

What load have you found seems to work best for you, with the Lapua 123gr Scenar bullet?

I like Power Pro 2000MR which many think is too temperature sensitive, but I haven't had any problems when developing the max load in the summer.