30PPC or 6PPC or 30Grendel

[harv50]

I'm wanting to take a rifle I have and rebarrel it for my Grandson to get into the sport...
I was going to build a 30BR. I have one and they are super easy to tune AND keep in tune where as my 6PPC is lets say, not so easy.. The problem I have is a PPC Reminton bolt face. I talked to GreTan and with the Sako extractor he said he couldn't open it up for a BR face...
So I'll rebarrel it to 6PPC again I guess, but I thought maybe a 30PPC would be easier for him to work with if they are anything like the 30BR for tuning--keeping i tune--and long barrel life..
What do you think???

 

[Tim Singleton]

Re: 30PPC or 6PPC

I have been thinking of an improved 30 ppc for a while. The 30 major in particular.
Greg J.(GSPV) and Mike Ezell (gunsandgunsmithing)on this site
Post info about it quite a bit. Now with the new powder LT30 coming out first of 2015 I've been thinking of it a lot more.
Finding 30 cal match bullets have been a concern for me.
Maybe these guys will post if it is in deed easier to keep in tune
Would it be for group shooting?

 

[harv50]

Re: 30PPC or 6PPC

Hi Tim, Informal to start with both group and score... after I posted the above I went searching and found out some about the 30 Grendel / Major.. sounds interesting and probably the way I'll go... It's in a Rem 700, bolt has been bushed, Jewel trigger and a good bedding job so it might get him interested (he's really into archery)
but maybe if I get something that he doesn't have to keep messing with alot to keep in tune it will get him started..
let's have some jump on board and tell me about the 30Grendel......

 

[Tim Singleton]

I'm pretty excited about the LT30 coming out.
One of the hold ups for me was trying to find H4198. If they produce as much of the 30 as they have 32 it will be a big help

 

[butchlambert]

harv50,
I shoot a 30BR with a rebated rim. Very easy to do. My second choice would be the 30 Major.
This is the tool I use.

Results below

The third from the left is the rebated to PPC and the 4th is rebated to 223 size.

 

[harv50]

Butch thanks for the reply, where did you get tool to rebate the rim's? And one other thing...how well do the cases hold up..

 

[butchlambert]

Rebating the case rims has no effect on case life at all. I took a piece of tool steel to a tool grinding shop and the cut it with a wire EDM. My Buddy,Jay Lynn Gore, ground his tool free hand in his shop. I think you are only taking about .015 per side.

 

[5spd]

There is now a 30 cal based on the 6.8 spc case.
American 30 its called.
Not sure how that would fit into your build though.

 

[GSPV]

If you are shooting group or UBR, I'd just cut to the chase and build a PPC for your grandson.

Now, if you are shooting IBS rules, a 30 BR with a rebated rim or a 30 Major would both be good choices.

I've been shooting a 30 Major for quite some time and am super happy. It's very easy to make brass. Just run over the 30 mandrel, turn for your neck diameter, load and go shoot.

 

[Catfur]

There is now a 30 cal based on the 6.8 spc case.

Uh, given that the 6.8 SPC is based on the 100 year old 30 Remington, isn't "now" a bit of a stretch?

 

[harv50]

Thanks for the reply Greg,
Now ... is the 30Major as easy to tune and keep in tune as the 30BR?
I'd just like to get something where he can get interested with out having to keep tuning, that can come later..

 

[GSPV]

The only downside of the 30 Major vs the 30 BR is the availability of the top shelf powder for it, N120.

I've gotten around that by using LT-32. It is everything that you can do to get enough in the case. I'd recommend careful attention to bullet selection and freebore if that's the route that you go. You can do the same with H4198, too, depending.

I'm looking forward to the LT-30. Should be perfect.

If you happen to be in the Cinci/Dayton area, I'd be happy to sell you a bunch of N-120. It's awesome, I just like the LT-32 better as I shoot it in my PPC, my 220 Beggs and my 30 Major.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Thanks for the reply Greg,
Now ... is the 30Major as easy to tune and keep in tune as the 30BR?
I'd just like to get something where he can get interested with out having to keep tuning, that can come later..

In short, yes, it's every bit as easy to tune as the br. That said, it likes powders that are a bit faster than h4198. It'll shoot 4198, rl7, n130, norma 200, aa1680, lt32 and the list goes on...but the magic pixie dust for me, has been n120, which has become hard to find and expensive. I'm not made of money, but powder cost is a very small consideration when you break it down and factor in all the other costs of the sport, but availability is a whole different story. I'm very anxious to try the new lt30 as it should be pretty ideal for the 30 Major case. If it works out, there is simply no reason, IMHO, to rebate rims or any of that. The case just plain works and it fits a ppc bolt face, brass is available from Lapua that uses small primers and small flash holes. It's super easy to neck up and dies are simple to make by just opening the shelf inside of a type s redding bushing die....or you can go with custom dies.


I like easy...when it works. The 30 Major is easy and it works! This is coming from someone who has built, owned and shot a bunch of both. My honest opinion is that the decision should be based on your bolt face. Aside from that...flip a coin, because the best barrel and bullets wins between the 30 Major and 30 BR. I feel safe in saying that I have more experience with the 30 Major than anyone. Feel free to contact me if I can be of any help. There are no significant pro's or cons vs one another from a performance standpoint. What small differences I've seen, likely favor the the 30 Major, slightly, such as noticeably lighter felt recoil and lower muzzle pressures with the right powders. They are both very good. I would wait until the lt30 gets out there. I'll try it as soon as possible and will report my findings about it. That said, I believe the new world record was shot using h4198, so it's not like you're tied to the lt30, it's just too promising to not try in it.--Mike Ezell

 

[harv50]

Thanks Greg & Mike... I already have all the stuff (15lbs 4198..BR cases.. Whidden dies.. & preped cases for the BR) so I went to a friends house and did the tooling to rebate the rims..did a half a dozen and they seemed to work fine in the bolt so I'm going to go that route...
Butch thanks for the picture.. I'll get a barrel now, order the reamer and see how it works out..
again Thanks everyone..
Harv

 

[butchlambert]

Keep us in the loop as you progress with it.

 

[harv50]

Will do..... Now to decide which reamer.. I think Randys..

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Will do..... Now to decide which reamer.. I think Randys..

It's hard to go wrong with it. .330 neck and zero freebore works very well. Some have been going longer on the freebore but I don't see much gain, myself. Good luck! I'm sure it'll be great.

 

[harv50]

Greg, what tuner are you using? Evidently you see some benefit in it or it wouldn't be on there.

 

[butchlambert]

Mike offers a line of tuners and they work.

 

[GSPV]

I have two kinds of tuners: ShadeTree and Bukys. Both work. All were installed by Mike before he created his own.

When I get my next tuner, it will be one of Mike's. A friend has been helping with University-type research on Mike's tuner and I've seen preliminary results.

My 30 Major, btw, is based on an action from my very first CF BR rifle. I bought it used from a well-known gunsmith in TX. It was a well-used LV 6 PPC. Mike put on 30 Major barrel and weighted it up to balance. I shot some good scores with it just like that. It has evolved over time with Mike's help. Nothing of the original gun is left but the action body. It is still my best shooting 100-200 yard gun.