300 Blk / subsonic Load info

[markT]

I have a Rem 700 in 300 blk. 1:7 twist. I will use a "can." My application is deer and hogs no further than 75 yds ( max). I have the reloading dies and Brass.
What is the best booolit and powder and primer? ( subsonic) Any input would be appreciated.
I will also load for my buddy's ruger when he buys it. Thanks

 

[XTR]

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/



There is a lot of experience out there that says hunting at any range with a 300BO and subs is not a good idea. I'm sure you'll try it and decide for yourself.

 

[orbitup]

https://www.blackoutbullets.com/

I haven't hunted with them but in my unscientific testing they expand well. He used to make a roundnose version that I really liked.

 

[markT]

Thanks orbitup. I really appreciate that.
I will contact them.

 

[spife7980]

The biggest you can, the 220 sierra round nose is a obvious candidate as is the new nosler 220 ballistic tip. They dont expand very much though at these low speeds. There are more expensive bullets that should expand at low velocities but they are pricey, lehigh and makers.

For hunting Ive moved away from subsonics to 150 gr supersonics, basically 30-30 performance instead of throwing a rock which is essentially what the subsonics are.
The pigs will still scramble at the first subsonic shot in the same way they do at a supersonic so I figure I might as well have them fall where they get hit instead of watching them run off with pin holes in them.

 

[markT]

Good info spife i've thought about that.. I might get some supersonics and see how loud they are with a "can."
I did shoot a SYP 2"x 8" from ~55 yds and and the sub went right thru with a very nasty exit hole.. Well enough energy for head shot on a hog or deer.

 

[spife7980]

Good info spife i've thought about that.. I might get some supersonics and see how loud they are with a "can."
I did shoot a SYP 2"x 8" from ~55 yds and and the sub went right thru with a very nasty exit hole.. Well enough energy for head shot on a hog or deer.

Oh yeah, dont get me wrong, they can still put a deer or pig down, it just better be a good shot.
I hit a doe that was bedded down 2 season ago, oriented straight towards me. The 220 sierra round nose went into the neck about 1/2 way up but then somehow rode along inside of the backstrap all the way back to its ass.
I couldnt find an exit hole or the bullet even with it skinned out but once I started to butcher the strap, cutting it into steaks, I noticed there was a weird hole running right through the middle of it and found the bullet about 3" away from where the muscle pinches out. It took the lead tip off and barely deformed the copper jacket. I still have that bullet, Ill try to get a pic this weekend if I could ever remember.



Heres a quick vid of subs. The first pig takes the hit and runs off. The second pig gets hit and keeps running, the second shot on it puts it down. The third pig is actually the first that ran off but came back around the trees. So two pigs but each had two sets of holes in it. I havent had a single one keep running since switching away from subs

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10209122948340953

Subsonics are cool , fun to play with. My 150 game king will put a hurting on the pigs though. This is my first pig after transitioning to the supers, I was elated compared to the subsonics that never bled.

Edit: uploading the doe bullet

 

[dellet]

With a 700 you can move away from the traditional powders and use fast pistol powders. This will have a true suppressed load that will be as quiet as any air rifle out there. You will have complete burn of the powder so no muzzle flash and low muzzle pressure so much less pop on bullet exit. The impact on the hog will be louder than the shot.

A lot of people have trouble with the cartridge because they get bullets that will expand to 3X diameter and then try and drive them through a shoulder and it just does not work.

Something like an Amax or Matchking will go through both shoulders without a bunch of trauma in between.

Then there's cast

265 grains, 3" five shot groups at 200 yards is reasonably obtainable. I use 7 grains of N105. They will plow through a shoulder, deform and tumble.
http://www.acmebullet.com/bullets-reloading-brass/Black Out/Black-Out

The trick with subs is to understand how the bullet works and place a shot accordingly. Don't shoot at bone with a bullet designed to expand with hydraulics.

Plenty of good bullets designed to work at subsonic speeds. Lots of animals taken by folks that understand shot placement is more important than bullet design.

Maker bullets has been mentioned they are another proven performer as are the Lehigh's. The Maker holds up better against bone because its not as fragile and you can get a heavier bullet.

Lot's of subsonic success stories here, hunting threads
http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=145

 

[Knotwild]

These might work, they are designed to expand. I haven't ordered any yet though.

https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/rifle/300-blackout-190-gr-sub-x-subsonic#!/

 

[rebel]

I know someone is going to come in and start up with "is sub hunting ethical" so I may as well post this. As with all hunting, shot placement is the key. OP stated 75 yards which is a very reasonable range as the holdovers or dope gets complicated quick. Zeroed at 200, a 220 MK will be around 18" high at 100 yards. Believe it or not, 20 MOA rails are a real help to sub shooters that want to lob them in on paper. The ideal sub bullet breaks bone and passes through, leaving 2 holes. Quick expansion bullets won't do that at those impact velocities. Outlaw State seems to be popular and has a good reputation among the the few that sub hunt. The one dellet describes above is great. Heavy enough for bone, will make two holes and accurate. Being poly coated means it is suppressor safe.

 

[cheek9075]

https://palmettoprojectiles.com/products/300-blackout-projectiles

If you want lead coated, they work well, load data and brass also available.

 

[P1ZombieKiller]

I like Lehigh at ranges under 100 yards. I have taken several deer with my Remington 700 bolt in 300 black out (mine is many years old and is actually called the 300/221 since 300BO was even discussed when I had mine made).

I choose to shoot mine in heart and lungs area like I would with any rifle. My kids use this caliber, and have for years. My littlest one does not like the loud noise of rifles so he wouldn't go hunting with me until I got it.

Here is the Lehigh 199 grain maximum expansion.
I use 8.5 grins Lil Gun with wolf SRM primer. 16.5" barrel and OAL of 2.262" right at 1050 fps in my rifle.

 

[markT]

P1Z.. thank you very much. I went to Midway usa to look for these boolits and they offer Lehigh Defense Max Exp 194 gr. I could not find the 199 gr. They also had a note said not to use in Rem 700 due to many rifle were stamped 1:7 but we're actually 1:10.
Any thoughts? Thanks so much!

 

[dellet]

P1Z.. thank you very much. I went to Midway usa to look for these boolits and they offer Lehigh Defense Max Exp 194 gr. I could not find the 199 gr. They also had a note said not to use in Rem 700 due to many rifle were stamped 1:7 but we're actually 1:10.
Any thoughts? Thanks so much!

That was a huge problem for Remington on that rifle. You said yours was 1/8 so I assumed it was a custom build.

Flag a cleaning rod and tight patch, count the turns. Should be two turns.

Remington knows about the problem and will replace it if you call them. I know of at least 10 people who have done that. One guy needed three before they got it right.

I was one of the ones that got a 1/10. Great with supers, and subs up to about 1.25” long. Above that it depends on the bullet. Sometimes the wobble doesn’t show up until 50+ yards.
I actually still shoot a 1/10 with no problems, just need to pay attention to bullets more for subs.

 

[markT]

Looks like the Wolf SRM Primers are discontinued. Any suggestions on a replacement for those? Thanks.
Also, I made mistake on my OP about my twist.(since edited) I said it was 1:8 but checked it and it is stamped 1:7 twist and I ran tight patch and confirmed 1:7..

 

[P1ZombieKiller]

P1Z.. thank you very much. I went to Midway usa to look for these boolits and they offer Lehigh Defense Max Exp 194 gr. I could not find the 199 gr. They also had a note said not to use in Rem 700 due to many rifle were stamped 1:7 but we're actually 1:10.
Any thoughts? Thanks so much!

Mine is a custom built. Built before the work "BLACK OUT" was adopted. My barrel is a douglas in 1:7.5. I have an older box of them. I bought a couple boxes back in the day. Only have 1 box left. This is what I have.

I thought they were the 194... but I see they are the 200's.

As far as the primers go... I only use those cause I bought a bazillion of them right after the first primer shortage I went through. I vowed that would never happen to me again. My assumption is any decent primer will do.

 

[Dogsdown]

Also have Remington 700 in 300 blk, 16.5” barrel, shooting with suppressor. Currently my go to load is 194g Lehigh Max Expansion over 8.5g VV N110, Rem 7.5 primer with light crimp on bullet. 2.21” OAL. This load showed very little vertical out to 150yds.

 

[HomeSlice]

Is it necessary to bell the case mouth when using the coated cast bullets? If there a die for this, or some other process/tool?

Where might a guy find some load data? Those 265gn slugs have caught my interest.

 

[gary0529]

Mine is a custom built. Built before the work "BLACK OUT" was adopted. My barrel is a douglas in 1:7.5. I have an older box of them. I bought a couple boxes back in the day. Only have 1 box left. This is what I have.

I thought they were the 194... but I see they are the 200's.

As far as the primers go... I only use those cause I bought a bazillion of them right after the first primer shortage I went through. I vowed that would never happen to me again. My assumption is any decent primer will do.

To the OP:
I am like P1 in that I have been using the subsonic rounds in a 300 Whisper-custom made with a 1:8 twist for well over 10 or 12 years now-long before any mention of the word Blackout.
As to conventional bullets-they will NOT expand at 1050fps and if you use them on game, not recommended unless you are a good enough marksman to take a head shot at close range or like to track wounded game.
I wholeheartedly can recommend either Lehigh or Outlaw States bullets for sub work--have used both effectively by keeping the range under 100 yards and take chest shots where the round can and will open effectively. I use subs with a can because of encroaching suburbia- yes I can go loud but it is being a better neighbor and fewer complaints if there is no loud report. Have yet to lose a deer with the proper bullet and correct placement and by that I mean I don't shoot unless I can guarantee it.
Early on I contacted all the major manufacturers of bullets and to a man they highly recommended I NOT use theirs for game at subsonic velocities- good advice in general.
Try a few 200, 220 and 240's in wet newsprint or stacked milk jugs filled with water and all you get is a "pencil through"
Can you kill the deer-no doubt but is it the quick one shot kill we all aim for. Don't think that will usually be the case.

Pick the right gun and bullet for the application and go forth.

Just my humble opinion based on my experience--YMMV


Gary

 

[markT]

Appreciate all the info guys!! Update: I bought (200) of the Lehigh 194 gr bullets.
I found a 1lb jug of the LilGun at Cabelas. Purchased (100) Hornady Brass. Plan on using some CCI primers. I think I have BR 4 and another.. Anyway. I should be able to load up a few and see how they do. Will post results.. thanks again!!