30-06 Tactical??????????

[treetux]

I am new to this so forgive my ignorance. I want to build a tactical rifle in 30-06 and have a few questions.

1. What is the shortest barrel you could use with a 30-06 and still be able to get to the 1000 yard line and retain some respectable power (by respectable I mean more than a .308)

2. I would like to keep my options open with bullet weight (168-190) what twist rate if any would work for these?

Any help with this would be great.

 

[Kenny474]

German Salazar is probably the guy to answer this for you, you may even find something in his blog at riflemansjournal.com. He seems to be quite fond of the 06 and seems to do quite well with it. You may also want to check out his gun of the week postings (week 98 and 91) as they are a 40x copy in 30-06 and an Elisio tube gun in 30-06 as well.

 

[Steve Blair]

26" is a pretty typical max length for tactical rifles, that is what I have on my .308 Pierce. My Springfield '03 National Match .30-'06 has a 24" barrel and has no problem at 1000 yards.

All my .308s are 10" twist but I like heavy bullets. I have a Brux 11.25 twist in the closet that I have not used, yet. a 12" twist should stabilize a 190 Sierra in reasonable temperatures. If you intend to shoot in cold temps, I would suggest both a 10" twist and a chrome-moly barrel.

The link to German's article that Kenny referenced is below.

http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2010/06/ballistics-heavy-bullets-in-113-twist.html

 

[GermanS1]

Thanks for thinking of my articles! The one that might be most useful is "The Logical .30-06" which is here: http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2009/11/cartridges-logical-30-06.html

I use 28" barrels but since I don't have to move around with them, I don't worry about weight and length too much. The .30-06 will always have more MV than a .308 if both have the same barrel length, but there comes a point at which you just aren't getting the full benefit of shooting the '06. I'd sure be hesitant to go below 26", although, as sleepygator pointed out, the 24" 1903 has done well at 1000 for 107 years so maybe I'm too cautious on length.

I normally use a 1:11" twist, though I also have a 1:10" and a 1:13". The 1:11" twist shoots everything through 200 Sierra very well. I haven't tried the 210 Berger in it but hope to do that this fall at 1000.

For long range, you're always better off with a heavier bullet and the .30-06 gives you the means to make it work well. Of course, range estimation becomes crucial as the trajectory steepens, but that's going to be the case with any cartridge and bullet combination. I don't know a great deal about that since all my shooting is known distance.

Best of luck with the project!

 

[treetux]

Thanks for the help guys,

Since I am married and singlehandedly trying to repopulate the world (five children and counting) this is going to be a budget build. I got out of the Marines back in 94 and have been trying to put together a rifle since then. I tried my hand with a remington PSS DM but it would never feed and homemade rounds would not fit the magazine when loaded for top accuracy. Remington could not even get it to feed out of the magazine so I gave up on it. Now I am gathering parts for a custom build. A buddy of mine is going to do all of the gunsmithing "gratis". I am gathering parts and this is what I am thinking of so far. Any comments would be welcome.

Used remington 700 long action ???
Broughton 5c 1:11 twist #8 heavy bull 26" barrel $335.
Bell and Carlson Medalist A5 stock $407.
Tubbs heavy duty Recoil lug $25.
Super Sniper 16x Scope $299
Ken Ferrel Scope and rings $266

All of this will run around $1350 not counting the price of the action

Bedding, Trigger Job, Lapping lugs, trueing the action, chambering, Headspacing, and crown will be done by my buddy. I am still undecided on the scope, mounts and rings. Does anyone see any way of reducing these costs and still having decent equipment? I figure by the time i get everything including the scope, mount and rings I will have a little more into the rifle than what a new Remington 700 Target tactical .308 vtr costs $1695.00 here locally.

 

[GermanS1]

Consider buying a used 40X stock (wood). There's plenty of them out there for well under $100 and they can be reinletted for the long action without much hassle.

I put a used Palma barrel on my "40XL" that's why it's a 1:13" twist. By the time the old threads were cut off and the .30-06 chamber reamed in place of the old .308, there was no erosion to speak of in the new throat area. I got the barrel for free from a friend who was rebarelling his Palma rifle, that happens more often than you might think. At least place an ad here, you might get a good deal from someone. The 1:13" shoots 175's great and 190's pretty darn good too.

 

[Kenny474]

As far as reducing cost, you could use a Pac-Nor chrome-moly barrel and shave about $80 off. They aren't the best barrel ever made, but I have had excellent results with my stainless super match as well as my father with his. I don't think you would notice any significant loss of accuracy in a tactical rifle, though I could be wrong.

Do you have the action already, or are you going to acquire one?

Also keep an eye on the classifieds here, you can find some sweet deals on really good equipment. Finding a used stock could also cut off a sizable chuck of change as well.

One place I would go all out (within your budget) is optics. A tactical rifle is bound to get knocked around a bit, and sub-par optics are bound to fail. I have never used the scope you are planning on, so I have no idea of it's quality, so that doesn't reflect on your choice.

 

[treetux]

I am still looking for an action.

 

[Kenny474]

Have you considered a Savage? Easier barrel replacement, and they don't require excessive machining to be accurate. The floating bolt head offers many advantages, like being able to change bolt face diameter without machining or buying a whole bolt.

You can buy a whole Steven's rifle for $300, replace the trigger with a SSS unit, swap stock and barrel and be ready to go. (you still need to bed the action) And you can sell the extra Steven's parts off to recoup some of the initial investment. And if the need ever arose, you can buy a prechambered barrel and swap it out with minimal tools.

You could possibly end up with around $300 in action and trigger after selling off the stock parts. Just a thought about a possible way to save yourself some cash.

Sharp Shooter Supply also sells pre-inletted stocks as well. I paid around $325 for mine.

 

[treetux]

I have considered a Savage, and I just can't bring myself to do it. Don't get me wrong I have nothing against the Savage and I will probably end up with one in the future. I carried an M40A1 in the Marines in 90-94 and the M24 in Iraq with the army about 5 years ago so it is more of a sentimental move to stick with the Remington action. I just finished building a 20" gong I have had setting around for 12 years. The plan is to go out to the desert with my buddies drop the gong drive away and see who can hit it with the first shot. Thats about all the competition shooting I can afford right now and the longest public range we have is 300 yards. So it's out to the desert for unkown distance for us.

 

[Kenny474]

That is completely understandable. Once you have used something and gained trust in it, it can be hard to change. I know, as I have several friends who are ex-military who feel that if Stoner didn't design it than it's not worth shooting.

Good luck and happy shooting.

 

[nhm16]

I would buy a long action Remington clone action like a Stiller TAC300 for $800. Lots of people make 700 clones, not just Stiller, I just happen to have a Stiller TAC30 (short action) being built into a tactical rifle as we speak. These 700 clone actions will generally drop into any stock inletted for a 700.

In addition to not requiring truing/blueprinting, the Stiller comes with a quality PT&G bolt and a nice durable finish. If you buy a Remington action, it'll end up costing almost as much once you have it trued/blueprinted, and maybe more if you put in a new bolt and have it refinished.

 

[cliffy]

Not liking the severe recoil of a .30/06 with stout loads, I limit myself to .308 Winchester 165 grain loads. Some would say, "There's not much difference," but I beg to differ. Yes, if you're a young buck, on the BUBBA size, a .30/06 Springfield with 165 to 180 grain fare might be perfect for you. So you know where I'm coming from, I think a .243 Winchester with 100 grainers is my maximum accuracy tolerence recoilwise. What does "TACTICAL" mean to you? Could any human stand tall against the sheer power of a .30/06 full-boat load? NO, and NO again. Is this much brute force required? No, and double NO. Since a .243 Winchester would knock the living snot from any sized-human, why abuse your shoulder and possibly FLINCH at a vital moment? .300 Winchester Magnums are readily available to SUPER-MACHO SWATTERS, so why downgrade this super-power into a .30/06 Springfield? Yes, a .30/06 makes a much more practical firearm for hunting than a .300 MAGNUM, but . . . damn, Cliffy Consider the available options.

 

[Kenny474]

Cliffy, I have been shooting an -06 since I was 14. I have personally never had any issue with it's recoil, and I am not a big guy by any stretch.(5'9"180lbs) Besides, cartridges other than the .243 do exist, and more powerful ones to boot. Having some raw horsepower to throw downrange never hurt, and it's better to have more than not enough. Especially if you should ever truly need it. Anyway, "required" brute force is a matter of personal preference.

Remember, the 30-06 is probably the most popular rifle round ever produced, so it has a reasonable following. The OP is also a Marine with plenty of experience, I'm sure he knows what he's getting into.

 

[wapiti25]

I think you will be very happy with the 06. I would look around for used parts as stated by German. A used 1:12 tw .308 could be re-chambered to the 06. You might also ask around as people will give you mil. brass which you would do the sorting/ preping but it will do ok for now. You can shoot MOA or better with mil brass then put your money into powder and bullets. A lot of people will give you the brass. You might look at a Douglas, E. R. Shaw as barrel sources, I shot a Douglas barrel in a matchcourse rifle that was given to me because it had gotten some rust inside. I shot my first 1000yd match and came in 17th out of 34 with that barrel and I was a marksman class shooter at that time. Start shooting then upgrade latter. Good luck with your build.

 

[Steve Blair]

Cliffy - I, like Kenny, am not a big guy. I am 5' 10" and 170 pounds. Not only does .30-'06 recoil not bother me, I have fired over 6500 rounds of caliber .50 BMG through rifles and still have a shoulder. Managing recoil is an exercise of proper butt placement and shooting position, firm shoulder hold, good stock design and, if necessary, a shooting coat or butt pad. It is not magic. I have seen men and women, smaller than me, shoot lightweight magnum rifles that would give me pause. They suffered no apparent ill effects.

 

[GermanS1]

I use military brass all the time in matches and find no disadvantage of any sort. Uncle Sam knows how to make brass as well as anyone!

Here's a short piece on processing military brass: http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2010/05/basics-prepping-military-brass-for.html

 

[boltman13]

Here in western Colorado long action Rem 700's are common in the pawn shops. They are almost all hunting rifles, but you don't want the barrel anyway. Some are in suprisingly good shape, having been fired very little and only with factory rounds. A lot of them have cheep scopes and mounts as well. It is usually impossable to get the pawn shop to lower the price and keep the scope and mounts, as they have no market for them. Try the pawn shops in your area, you may be suprised at how little it costs to pick up a good Rem 700 long action.

 

[treetux]

Thanks Guys,

I am trying to pick up a long action Rem 700 off a local auction right now. I just found a Bell and Carlson medalist stock for $160 at the local Cabellas, I am thinking about picking that up also. Next Question is, what is the best reamer to use for a tactical rifle in 30-06 and where would a person rent or borrow one?

 

[Steve Blair]

German knows more about this than me, but I believe that it is called a "Serengeti" reamer. It is largely a .30-'06 match reamer that features a 1½° throat like a .308. It is print #9685 from Pacific Tool & Gauge.