260 Rem with Nosler's new 140 RDF. Input requested!

[savageboy]

I am dialing in my new 260 Rem for shooting steel out to 1200 yds. I stumbled on what has been the most accurate load to date by accident just wanting to break in the barrel with 140 Amax's at 41 gr. of XMR 4350 that I had on hand. I am planning to switch to H4831SC that I used to shoot out of my 260AI with alot of success as I'm now very pleased with initial results, the barrel is broken in and I am doing load development.

Here's my question, I've searched the forum here and found some good info, but I am really still struggling with getting the accuracy out of the new 140 Nosler RDF as I really like the BC numbers, would like to standardize on it for competition and its a sexy bullet!

I need to feed these out of a magazine so the OAL is somewhat set by that. Its a Factory Savage 12 LRP. So, does anyone have any guidelines for a starting point for these? The few loads I've tried- 41gr- 42 gr. of XMR 4350 at 2.80" oal have been very disapointing to say the least. Where do I go from here? I haven't checked the OAL of the bullet into the lands like I would on a single shot rifle as I am limited by the magazine and that bullet way crunches down into the case at that 2.80" oal. I saw some recommendations of jumping 10-70 thou? I am switching to H4831 SC now that I am starting load development and have alot of that on hand.

Anyone have any recommendations to point me in the right direction? The A- max were amazing and I had several hundred already on hand.

Round#'s 10-15 out of the barrel with that A-max load were a wonderful tite 3/8" group at 110yds where as the Nosler RDF's were all over the place and the groups REALLY opened up.

The thought of jamming that already long bullet down into that short case go against what I'd like to do, so??

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated as I'd love to use that new bullet as my "go to" load for competition. If the rifle won't shoot them, then so be it, but I won't go down without a fight!

 

[Lightload]

Try the Nosler accuracy load of 44grs H4831SC. Doesn't quite fill the case so it may fit to mag length.

 

[savageboy]

Try the Nosler accuracy load of 44grs H4831SC. Doesn't quite fill the case so it may fit to mag length.

Do you have any "seating off the lands" or seating depth advice? I just guessed at the SAMMI 2.80" mag length as this will be in a DBM mode for 99% of its life vs my F class rifles. Like, where to start? Dismal results with initial testing and 2.80" oal -I had to start somewhere!

 

[Kurz]

Try the Nosler accuracy load of 44grs H4831SC. Doesn't quite fill the case so it may fit to mag length.

This is only true when using one of the bullets listed at the top of the profile reloading page. None of these bullets are as long as the RDF bullets so using a slower burning powder and filling the case up past the base of the bullet will lead to the same problem, maybe...

Where do I go from here? I haven't checked the OAL of the bullet into the lands like I would on a single shot rifle as I am limited by the magazine and that bullet way crunches down into the case at that 2.80" oal.

I suggest casting the chamber and doing some measurements before making any more decisions. Know what you have first then decide how to tackle the reloading.

I think that you're headed in the wrong direction based on your comments. You need a slightly faster powder in order to leave a little space in the case below the base of the bullet. However, there are many reloaders here that believe in overly full cases and compressed loads, who seem to have good success with this concept.

Accurate Mag makes DBM bottom metal and magazines for the Savage rifles which have an internal length of 3.050", adding 0.250" to your reloading data if you want, depending on what the chamber cast turn up.

Regards.

 

[jimbo88mm]

Even though you are loading for magazine length you should still find out where your lands are. Having that reference point is still important.

I'm developing a load with these bullets in my 260. I started with 15 thou from the lands, coal is 2.88".

Just narrowed my powder charge today (42grs of RL-16 @ 2820 fps). Next time out I'm going to test different seating depths. Based on what i've read on other forums, all RDFs seem to like 30 thou off the lands. We'll see how it goes, hoping to get out next weekend.

 

[KMart]

Make yourself some dummy rounds and see just how far out you can seat and still mag feed. So far, It looks like you are limiting yourself to 2.800". The follower on a Savage short action DBM measures 2.980 and I have loaded some 260 loads to a little over 3.00" and still feed through the magazine.

 

[sbhooper]

My .260 has the standard Remington magazine length. I can seat bullets out to 2.848 as a max and still work them through the magazine. The Criterion barrel would allow quite a bit more, but it doesn't matter, as I am not going to single feed the rounds. This is a hunting rifle. I get incredible accuracy from it at that max OAL and have no problems, even with the Hornady 147 Eld-m.

 

[watercam]

The advice I received via Nosler was to jump "at least .030". I tried .015 - .025 off the lands before and so jumped to .030 and .035 off the .035 was the best by far. That said I have not seen the BC numbers on paper that are claimed for this bullet out to 600 yds.. Will try some at 1000 at the next LR match but I am still shooting the 142 SMKs for now.

 

[rardoin]

I have tried from 0.020" in the lands to 0.030" off the lands in a 6.5 x55 Imp and the best groups by far were at 0.010" off. I have seen reports of best groups at 0.020" in and well over 0.030" off so you will have to take max magazine COAL and work back up to 0.080" or more to find the best depth.

 

[savageboy]

Great Information! Thank you all for taking the time to respond. I gained some valuable knowledge

 

[savageboy]

I've never used RL 16. Seems like alot of you are using it. I've only really shot 4350/ 4831SC in any of my 6.5's. What is the benefit of that powder? Its a little faster Im guessing than the RL 17. Kurtz suggested to use a faster powder than what I was using, my brain - and this could be the issue!! lol- says to use a slower powder with a heavier bullet??

 

[Kurz]

Kurtz suggested to use a faster powder than what I was using

I suggest using a slightly faster or slightly hotter burning powder to keep from having to use a compressed load and potentially wasting powder for no benefit. This is the basic difference between Re-16 (slightly cooler burning needing more powder) and Re-17 (slightly hotter needing less powder). While I have demonstrated some better than decent accuracy with the Re-16, I usually prefer the Re-17 for many cartridges. It's a personal opinion, not necessarily a generalized 'rule of thumb' as some might want to state. I can get nearly 3,000 fps. from my Re-17 cartridge while the other 5 or 6 powders are between 2875 and 2930 fps. Yes, I'll probably have a shorter barrel life but I believe that barrels are expendable or what we often refer to as perishable tooling. Sometimes performance trumps longevity.

My perception though is that I am getting better performance from the 6.5 Creedmoor than any of the .260 Rem. I've shot. I think the case and now the smaller flash hole from Lapua lend a better base for that performance. No offense, the .260 Rem. will certainly do what you want it to achieve but so will a couple of other cartridges in that same category.

Enjoy the process!

 

[savageboy]

Kurtz- thank you for your input. I was going to go with the 6.5 CM- not because its the latest and greatest, but because it "looks right" straight body, min taper, sharp shoulders, etc. I am a 260 AI guy but budget determined my choice and I had 260 Dies, brass, etc. So, 260 it was. When this barrel goes, I am prob doing the 260 Terminator- a 260 AI with 35 deg shoulders for better feeding vs the 40 deg of the AI.
Just a souped up 6.5 CM.
S0 basically you are recommending Re-17 in my 260 w the long RDF bullets?

 

[Kurz]

I have a lot of time and material vested in the powders that I choose to use. Sometimes I have to be a little more flexible when a particular barrel/chamber/rifle combination doesn't seem to be going in the direction I would like it to. Sometimes I have to 'grudgingly' move off of a favorite to let another powder be the one to work with.

The .260 Rem. paired with the 140 gr. RDF bullets seems to be working with the Re-17, albeit without having an absolutely full case. There I suggest running any of the 4350 powders which WILL get you a full case but slightly less velocity. Of those, Accurate 4350 has been better in my set up. But this can be a difference of lot number also. That's why we shoot tests. I've also had success with Ramshot Hunter although I think it is suffering from a recall right now. My batch is not a part of that recall so I can continue to test with it.

If you don't have any Re-17 and funds aren't being nice, shoot the 4350's and enjoy, dance with who you brung! Reloading is fraught with hundreds of variables, a few of which can't be controlled, like lot numbers. Most of us agree that accuracy tops velocity but I maintain that occasionally, there is another node at a higher velocity than what is being touted currently. In switchy or stronger winds, I'll take all the velocity and high BC I can muster in order to keep my bullets on my targets.

Let us know what you come up with, we're all interested.

Regards.

 

[Shynloco]

savageboy,
It sounds to me like you are "searching" for a load that your particular Savage likes shooting a very specific bullet. Here's what I'd do, open up every Reloading Manual you have under 260 Rem and find what powders each manufacturer recommends for the weight (or near weight) of bullet you are trying to make work. Pay particular attention to the "Accuracy Load" and see if you are close or if there are powders they have made work for that bullet weight, but you haven't tried or thought of. As for AOL, IGNORE that 2.800 OAL and find out what OAL/Ojive makes contact with the lands/grooves. Of course you may have to live with the magazine restriction if you have one. But hang in there and keep testing. My .260 Rem has a custom chamber and won't even allow me to get to 2.800 OAL, but is .010 off that and I'm touching the rifling. And the Berger 140's fly true and get me to where I wanna be. But I didn't get there by NOT testing many of the powders recommended in the reloading manuals. Good luck and hope you find magic again.

Alex

 

[savageboy]

Ok, so I am working on this now as most of my A maxes are about gone.... Will advise once I get results. It may help someone else !

 

[B_Thomas]

Ok, so I am working on this now as most of my A maxes are about gone.... Will advise once I get results. It may help someone else !

If you barrel likes the A-max's....It will probably like the 139g Lupua Scenars. My Savage LRP .260 had to two great nodes with the 139's. 40.7g H4350(.3" GROUPS) & 42.8g H4350(.5" GROUPS). Both @ 2.840"

 

[savageboy]

If you barrel likes the A-max's....It will probably like the 139g Lupua Scenars. My Savage LRP .260 had to two great nodes with the 139's. 40.7g H4350(.3" GROUPS) & 42.8g H4350(.5" GROUPS). Both @ 2.840"

Thank you for this input! My 260 AI Loved them. I was hoping to be able to shoot the less expensive Nosler 2nds but you are right, I need to try the Lapua's.