257 Roberts shooters - Please help!

[Scrumbag]

Hi folks,

I have a bit a quandry. I have been working up a non-tox load for my 257 Roberts.

My current choices are 100 gr Nosler E-Tip and 100gr Peregrine VLR4.

Well I did some el rapido load development before heading out last weekend and I lucked out on a load with the Peregrines that gave a group of 17mm centre to centre with 4 shots so stuck with that. Anyway, I had some poor on game performance with the Peregrines so I have decided to persist with the E-Tips.

Now, I shot a not bad group with one predicted node for the E-Tips (42.5 gr RS60)

But given the smutty cases,

I left the E-tips at home.

So, what do I do to tighten that group up?

I can:

Try a different powder charge (tried next predicted node up but was about a 3" group, lots of dispersion)
I could try a different powder - I have Viht N150 and Ramshot Hunter on hand
I could keep the RS60 powder and use a magnum rifle primer

Advice welcomed.

Scrummy

 

[Adam in WI]

I personally wouldn't lose to much sleep over that amount of residue if the rifle shoots well enough

 

[Scrumbag]

Thanks. I shall certainly reload a few more of that load and see if the group tightens (Not sure if that was slower velocity causing the flyer or me).

Scrummy

 

[centershot]

My Ackly soots onto the shoulder. Have tried everything to remedy the problem. Many that I shoot with said "don't worry about it." Still bothers me though.

 

[SeabeeKen]

My 257 gets some soot on it also. Seems to vary with different powders so if it really bothers you try different powders. Also, keep an eye via borescope on the throat and front of chamber for carbon buildup. I tested E-tip in my 280AI a few years ago and didn't like them. I went to Barnes and used them with great success until they became hard to get. I went with Hammers and haven't looked back. The copper solids being softer seem to expand better than the gilding metal bullets like GMX and Etip. I did have a failure to expand with a GMX on a deer and never used them again. YMMV

 

[Scrumbag]

My 257 gets some soot on it also. Seems to vary with different powders so if it really bothers you try different powders. Also, keep an eye via borescope on the throat and front of chamber for carbon buildup. I tested E-tip in my 280AI a few years ago and didn't like them. I went to Barnes and used them with great success until they became hard to get. I went with Hammers and haven't looked back. The copper solids being softer seem to expand better than the gilding metal bullets like GMX and Etip. I did have a failure to expand with a GMX on a deer and never used them again. YMMV

Thanks. It was just that load (tried a 44.0 gr load and clean cases but horrible accuracy. So much for OBT load prediction...)

I will try a few with mag primers as have a box and a bit. See if the flyer was me, the ammo or a mag primer cleans things up.

If not, back the the drawing board with a faster powder.

Interesting your experience with a the GMX. I have a 7x64 that for accuracy likes the 139gr GMX but not tried it on a deer yet. Wonder what it will be like.

Scrummy

 

[david12601]

Try imr8028 xbr ......... I had the same problem .....not anymore since switch

37.8 gr 13k jump

 

[SeabeeKen]

Thanks. It was just that load (tried a 44.0 gr load and clean cases but horrible accuracy. So much for OBT load prediction...)

I will try a few with mag primers as have a box and a bit. See if the flyer was me, the ammo or a mag primer cleans things up.

If not, back the the drawing board with a faster powder.

Interesting your experience with a the GMX. I have a 7x64 that for accuracy likes the 139gr GMX but not tried it on a deer yet. Wonder what it will be like.

Scrummy

My GMX problem was not accuracy, the bullet did not expand. Soot can also be caused by low pressure. Hope you get it working.

 

[PigButtons]

What seating depth testing have you done. It may surprise you how effective it is. What I've been doing is start just off the lands and do the powder ladder. Once i find something "good enough", I start increasing the jump .001" until I find "the right one". Has changed my experience bigly.

 

[Adam in WI]

What seating depth testing have you done. It may surprise you how effective it is. What I've been doing is start just off the lands and do the powder ladder. Once i find something "good enough", I start increasing the jump .001" until I find "the right one". Has changed my experience bigly.

Are you finding major improvements in .001" increments in sporting rifles?

 

[PigButtons]

Are you finding major improvements in .001" increments in sporting rifles?

In short, yes. But it may be 0.012" jump or 0.030" jump, but from 0.001" to 0.011" it can be a 1/2 MOA tune that at 0.012" goes to 1/4 MOA or better. I don't usually keep looking to see how wide the seating node is because I'm confident I can hit my number well enough for my satisfaction. I may go another thousandth or two to see if it gets even better, but if I'm getting 1/4 MOA or better I stop.

In fact I did it just last week with a T/C Encore in 22-250 that was shooting 1/2 MOA @ 100 to putting them into a single hole barely wider than the bullet.

 

[Scrumbag]

My GMX problem was not accuracy, the bullet did not expand. Soot can also be caused by low pressure. Hope you get it working.

No, I understood that it was an expansion issue. What sort of range and speeds?

 

[Scrumbag]

Try imr8028 xbr ......... I had the same problem .....not anymore since switch

Seems kinda fast?

 

[Homerange]

Seems kinda fast?

It's not.

Data – Rifle

Whenever practicable, avoid loading to maximum possible velocity. Safety Data Sheets include all information relating to product composition, safety, handling and storage.

www.adiworldclass.com.au

 

[Scrumbag]

Thanks!

 

[Ggmac]

What range is your targets, and how large ? I've had great success with bullets of older design, say 110-120 gr flat base . I've got numerous 257 and 257 Ackley s , the older slow 1-10 twist love varmit weight bt but only flat base hunting. The new fast twist rifle really hasn't had enough trigger time to properly evaluate.

 

[std7mag]

All my 25 caliber rifles have the 1:10 twist and shoot up to the 120gr Sierra HPBT GameKing just fine.

I don't know what twist Scrumbag is shooting.
If indeed a 1:10 twist, then the 100gr mono may be the issue.

Cutting Edge limits me to their 90gr mono bullet for a 1:10.

I don't know what RS60 is.
I've been using Hodgdon Hybrid 100V with 100-115gr bullets from my Roberts.
H414 with lighter weight bullets.
And i get neck soot with both powders.

Something else that may help tighten up the mono's is a crimp.
People argue with me about this, but i've seen it help.

 

[Scrumbag]

What range is your targets, and how large ? I've had great success with bullets of older design, say 110-120 gr flat base . I've got numerous 257 and 257 Ackley s , the older slow 1-10 twist love varmit weight bt but only flat base hunting. The new fast twist rifle really hasn't had enough trigger time to properly evaluate.

My usual load is the 120gr Speer SPBT and that does very well for accuracy and is quite a long bullet so don't think that's the issue.

 

[Scrumbag]

All my 25 caliber rifles have the 1:10 twist and shoot up to the 120gr Sierra HPBT GameKing just fine.

I don't know what twist Scrumbag is shooting.
If indeed a 1:10 twist, then the 100gr mono may be the issue.

Cutting Edge limits me to their 90gr mono bullet for a 1:10.

I don't know what RS60 is.
I've been using Hodgdon Hybrid 100V with 100-115gr bullets from my Roberts.
H414 with lighter weight bullets.
And i get neck soot with both powders.

Something else that may help tighten up the mono's is a crimp.
People argue with me about this, but i've seen it help.

Thanks @std7mag

RS60 is Reload Swiss RS60 and is rated as basically RL17.

 

[SeabeeKen]

No, I understood that it was an expansion issue. What sort of range and speeds?

The range was about 75 yds. Speed was around 3000. I dont recall the exact speed. Cant find it in my data.