223 Powder help

[squirrelsnpr]

I have been loading for my 223 Savage, 9 twist Kreiger, using 75 A-Max's and Benchmark powder. I seem to be getting inconsistent groupings. One day, it's lights out, the next it OK. I have been doing everything the same, and weather has been consistant. Even FPS (right at 3K), ES(low 30s) and SD(15ish) are consistant. I read the 223 info page again, just for fun, and noticed Benchmark was listed for the lighter bullets only. Is Benchmark too fast a powder for this load combo? I have H322, Benchmark, H4895, Varget, H4350, RL15 and RL9 on hand to try. I dont want to use my Varget for the 223, it's being saved for the 6.5x47L. Suggestions?
Thanks,
Mitch

 

[fivering]

Try about 23.5 gr H4895 behind that 75 gr bullet. I got better groups with 4895 than Varget.
I use molyed bullets, so if you shoot them naked you might want to start at 23 gr and work up.

 

[1000yardstare]

I too have switched to H4895 for the .223 because AMax bullets deform over compressed loads of slower powders. Use 24.0 gr under 75 AMax moly, CCI 450 primers, Win brass, COAL 2.430 which kisses the lands. Chronos at 2930 out of a 30 inch 8 twist MacLennon barrel, Wylde chamber.

Have put five shots into 1 5/8 inch (0.49 moa) at 300 metres (330 yds) off a bench with this load.

Use it mainly for Sierra 300 metre events. Have shot it at 1000 yards in F Class competition but would be the first to admit there are better 1000 yard cartridges.

 

[25AI260]

yesterday in the wind i tested a sierra 77gr #1477 bullet in front W748 an 7 1/2 rem primer... its hot but Very accurate

Edit : this a Rem. 700 pss 26"Hb 1~9tw

 

[ronemus]

The 75 gr A-Max is too long to stabilize properly in a 1:9 twist - you're right on the ragged edge of stability and a cool day at low altitude with low humidity will destabilize it. The A-Max will usually work in a 1:8 and 1:7.5 is probably ideal. With a 1:9 twist, you'd be much better off using the Hornady 75 gr BTHP; it's the highest BC bullet that will reliably stabilize in that twist.

I shoot both bullets in NRA Highpower and Long Range, the BTHP up to 300 yards (magazine length) and the A-Max at 500-1000 yards (seated long for single-loading). Both have shot well in every barrel and chamber (4 of each) that I've used. I started with a 1:7.7 twist (optimum for the 80 gr SMK), but switched to 1:7 because the A-Max was marginally stable at 1000 yards on a cold day. A 1:7.3-1:7.5 twist would be ideal, but is not a stock twist from any of the barrel makers; some could produce one on a custom basis, but it probably isn't worth the hassle.

 

[SS427]

I think you are right on the edge of stability too. Anything over 70 grains will get edgy, and if you do get them to work I would think you would have to use a hot load.

My 1:9 twist Savage shoots 69 and 68 grain bullets okay. H322 powder is what works best with the 69s, as crazy as that sounds. H322 is similar in burn rate to Benchmark, however Benchmark was all over the place. Varget works best with the 68s. I get really good results with 55 grain Hornady V-max and Nosler Ballistic tips, and while I've never tried them, I think 60 grain V-max bullets might really work good. When I get some I'm going to try Varget, N133 and N135.

 

[white121]

Varget will make you real happy!

 

[Johnboy]

hey my 1:9 like's the 75gn berger vld's.even the 77 NCC's shoot really good out of it.but the one thing I use no one else is IMR 4007.and boy does it work for me.the last group with the 77gn bullet was a .111 group at 100.

but again 4895,varget, are what most guys are shooting.

 

[moorepower]

I would try the 4895 and Varget. Some of the 1-9 guns will shoot the 75 A-max.

 

[30378]

Use the Varget. It is getting much easier to find in the shops. Benchmark will work and provide the accuracy but at lower velocities.

 

[Ksmirk]

I shoot the 75gr. A-Max from my stock Savage barrel but I use RL-15 and so far have had no ill effects, I have good groups out to 500 on targets and have shot much further on p-dogs but I also seat the bullets out so they will not fit in the mag. Later,

Kirk

 

[ChuckMiller]

I shoot the 75gr amax out of a 1-9 Rem 700 PSS using RL15. I loaned it to my friends wife and it shot well enough to outshoot a bunch of guys and their 3000.00 dollar rifles at the LSSO last year at 400yds. It's probably not the optimum twist for the 75's but there are a lot of guys shooting them with no problems. My load is 24.2 grs RL15, 7 1/2 primer, seated on the lands.

 

[squirrelsnpr]

what kind of velocity are you guys getting with RL-15 and the 75 A-Max?

 

[Ksmirk]

I'll have to check this evening, I don't load these up a bunch so I'll have to check the log book but I'll get back with the data. Later,

Kirk

 

[white121]

Ksmirk,

I to am waiting to hear you data as I have 800 75gr a-maxes sitting here along side 5lbs of RL-15. I have been using 70gr berger vlds with varget with extreme accuaccy and hope to find the same with the a-max and RL-15 cant seem to find any good starting loads or max loads online so I was hoping you could steer me in the direction of the golden land.

Shaun White

 

[Ksmirk]

Ok I finally got things settled down around the house so here's what info I have on the 75gr. A-Max and RL-15. These were pretty mild but the high BC on these bullets just seem to make them float, I'm sure you could get higher velocity but hey I just likem' to hit where they are supposed too. Sorry but all I have in my log is the one loading! the others I didn't have any chrony readings written down.

LC brass
Federal 205 primer
RL-15 powder 23.0gr
Hornady 75gr. A-Max
COL 2.500" (.030 off the lands)
24" 1-8 twist AR-15
2785fps

Savage 1-9 twist 26" with the same load was not AS accurate but still good enough to hit pennies @ 100 yards each shot and it clocked across the chrony at 2805fps. Like I said nothing screaming but it shot well. The Alliant website said well here's the link http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=2&weight=77&shellid=46&bulletid=92 Hope this helps you out a little! not a mess of info but a good place to start, I went up to 23.5gr and had no ill effects and truth I could have gone further but well I went back to the 55gr. V-Max bullets and stopped load development. Later,

Kirk

 

[ForneyRider]

I can hit .6in 5shot 100 yard groups with the 75gr BTHP. I use Varget, AA2230, and R15. Benchmark I have been using for 36-55gr bullets, but Hornady has load data for some of the heavier bullets. My rifle is 1:9tw 20in DPMS AR. I get a light scratch on the bullet with 2.28in COL. The 50,52,55gr bullets are tighter in this rifle.

 

[dreever]

AA2520 works great in the 223 with 69 gr Sierras. Side benefit is it goes through the powder measure like water. I threw and weighed fifty rounds and they didn't vary more than a tenth. Varget works great, but you got to weigh every charge.

Danny

 

[squirrelsnpr]

Finally had some time to try some Varget with the 75 A-Maxs. I ended up getting good velocity using 25.5 grains. FPS was right at 2940, and SD of roughly 13 for 5 shots. Accuracy was good with the 75 A-Maxs seated about 25 thous from the lands. I haven't been able to adjust seating depth yet, but did shoot a sub 1/2 MOA at 100 yards.

So far the only issue I see is: I really have to stuff 25.5 grains of Varget in the .223 with the long 75 A-Maxs. It is a compressed load, which I'm not too fond of (it leaves a round dent around the top of the bullet where it meets the seating stem). I'm going to try to get away from the compressed load by adjusting OAL. If I can't get away from the compressed load, I'll try the H4895 I have.

 

[Ksmirk]

If you have a Hornady die you can call them up and they make special seater stems for the A-Max bullets, I've got one for my 284 and 308 no little rings from those compressed loads. Later,

Kirk