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223 brass life

DLT

Silver $$ Contributor
I have a 223 wylde chambering shooting 80gr match kings at 2685fps out of a 26” barrel. I have a small supply of lapua brass I developed the load with. Question is, if I decide to speed it up where is the speed limit where brass life will be short lived ? I work it very minimal during the sizing process I just don’t want to get into loose primer pockets after a couple firings as this brass is hard to get ahold of. Thanks guys
 
Speed is proportional to pressure, and we can use math models to estimate the pressure by matching the velocity. It is the pressure that ruins brass, not the velocity.

Internal ballistics is full of nonlinear relationships and the math isn't always simple even if the programs like QL and GRT are simple. If you want to learn to estimate the pressure, give GRT a look, otherwise....

If you can accommodate loading at the range, you can either run ladder tests to watch for pressure signs and estimate your pressure, or you can just load a small number of cases over and over at your preferred load and see how many cycles you get.

The brass in your 223 design has two big buckets of standards, the SAAMI and the NATO. I'll show the SAAMI pressure table below.

1709142023629.png

There is no hard limit on brass life in terms of how many cycles you should be able to get. Some folks go over 55,300 PSI and accept a shorter life, others stay lower and get more than 15 cycles. You can read the pressure section of the standard to fill in your background. YMMV

https://saami.org/technical-information/ansi-saami-standards/

ETA: I had to run when I posted earlier and didn't mention a concept. Your case prep habits also play into your brass life. You can arrive at a case prep that minimizes the cold work to achieve the same case prep that can have excess cold working to get to the same place. When the failure mode is in the body or neck, the minimized case prep will give more cycles.

A different failure mode for pressure can be where the primer pockets expand and become too loose. This one can also depend on your chamber as well as your choice in pressure (charge). Keeping the pressure at or below 55.3 KSI and you will watch the necks and bodies. Go into the 65 KSI range and your primer pockets will fail in short order even if everything else is still good.
 
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My first consideration for selecting a load is safety. Is the load safe.

Second consideration is the load reliable. Does the load feed and extract without issues.

The Third consideration is performance. Does the load do what I need it to do.

I never considered case life a factor in selecting a load. I do minimize working the brass by careful sizing using a bump gauge and caliper to obtain optimum sizing.

I have never had loose primer pockets and I have loaded and shot literally thousands of cases (308, 243, 22 250, 223, and others) 15 to 18 times. The necks split before anything else. I do not load to max or near max pressure. I am not an expert, but I suspect that loose primer pockets are a result of excessive case head expansion due to high pressure loads. There may be other causes for loose primer pockets that I am not aware of but one of the common effects of high-pressure loads is loose primer pockets.
 
From my own experience, I would estimate that you could get another 100 - 150 fps without seriously shortening the number of firings before the primer pockets loosen too much.
But, it all depends on your specific barrel.

A way to get an estimate of the pressure of your load in your rifle would be to enter the specifics into QL or GRT, fire 7-10 rounds across a chrono, enter the observed results. GRT will calculate the pressure.
 
I purchased factory AAC 5.56 77gn, sierra mk. measured 2.240 COAL. Shot them through a 26in, 1/7 twist PVA barrel with a magneto speed chrono, they averaged 2920-2950 fps.
 
I would suggest purchasing a copy of QuickLoad, or downloading Gordon's Reloading Tool:



You can inut your specific load data and see where the pressure estimates fall with respect to SAAMI MAX value. In my hands, F-TR loads with heavies predicted by QuickLoad to have pressure slightly in excess of 57K psi would kill the primer pockets in 2-3 firings (i.e. 90 VLDs @2850 fps froma 30" barrel). Loads with 80.5 Bergers at approximately the same velocity (2860 fps) in a 26" barrel were predicted to be close to MAX pressure, maybe 54.5K psi, and the brass was good for at least 4-5 firings. I'm guessing you probably run the 80 SMKs at somewhere in the 2750 to 2800 fps velocity range without trashing the primer pockets too quickly. Predicted pressure would probably be somewhere in the 50-53K psi range, but you'd have to run the program with your specific load data to know for sure.

There are many variables that can affect pressure. Powder and primer choice are obvious ones, as well as internal brass case volume. It may also be possible to increase velocity simply by changing to a different powder. The velocity at which a given load actually tunes in in your specific setup will also be a big part of the equation. However, it is generally not easy to increase velocity with a lighter, lower BC bullet to the point where one can obtain external ballistics comparable to the next higher weight class of bullets. So one alternative might be to consider using an 85-90 gr bullet with a much higher BC. Obviously, the rifle setup itself may be the limiting factor there. But another possibility would be to use an 80 gr bullet with a much higher BC than the 80 SMK. I have recently been using Hornady's 80 gr ELDM to lap in a couple new 28" barrels I had cut for an F-TR rifle. The 80 ELDMs are shooting extremely well in my hands. They have a G7 BC of approximately 0.258 versus 0.221 for the 80 SMK (Litz, Ballistic Performance of Rifle Bullets, 3rd Ed.), which is an increase of almost 17%. A 17% increase in BC at the same bullet weight is HUGE, and would provide a noticeable benefit in terms of wind deflection and drop, even at the same velocity you're currently running the 80 SMKs. Again, the question here would be whether your rifle is set up to shoot the 80 ELDMs. A 7-twist barrel would be necessary, and perhaps a little longer freebore than might be optimal for the 80 SMK as the 80 ELDMs have a fairly long bearing surface. Nonetheless, using a more modern bullet design with a higher BC would something to think about.

The quest for velocity is not a new one. Further, I agree with you that a load pushing the 80 SMK at 2685 fps from a 26" barrel is slightly anemic and could be juiced up a bit without destroying the brass in a single firing. However, as an exercise you might consider running some external ballistics predictions using something like JBM Ballistics (https://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmtraj_simp-5.1.cgi) to determine exactly how much difference in drop and wind deflection an additional 50 or 100 fps velocity will buy. It's usually nearly not as much as one would think.

In the past, I have run the high node using 90 VLDs in F-TR rifles with 30" barrels. The primary reason for doing that was not specifically to increase velocity, but rather to hit a really nice fat accuracy node at about 2850 fps. Several years of killing the primer pockets of Lapua brass in 2-3 firings [largely] cured me of doing that. It also led me to my final suggestion, which pertains to the brass itself. Due to the expense of Lapua .223 Rem brass and the high rate at which I went through it running those loads, I am always on the lookout for a brand of brass that shoots with the same precision as Lapua, but that lasts a bit longer and isn't quite so expensive. To date, I have had pretty good luck in terms of the precision aspect with Norma brass. It doesn't last any longer than Lapua, but it shoots just as well in my hands and it costs half as much. Starline is another manufacturer that may be worth consideration, and they have gained a following among F-TR shooters using .223 Rem. I have both the .223 Rem and 5.56 NATO Starline brass, but haven't really used it enough at this point to draw any conclusions regarding precision relative to Lapua. However, Starline's reputation is that the primer pockets seem to outlast many other brands, and again, the cost is significantly lower than Lapua. By using a different brand of brass, it may thus be possible to achieve the same precision under conditions where brass life is less of a concern due to the lower cost of the brass, OR the brass may actually last longer (i.e. Starline).
 
I purchased factory AAC 5.56 77gn, sierra mk. measured 2.240 COAL. Shot them through a 26in, 1/7 twist PVA barrel with a magneto speed chrono, they averaged 2920-2950 fps.
You're lucky you got a sane lot. I had to pull down almost 1k of that crap. We were getting insane velocities. Plus the brass has thin rims which allow the extractor to skip over them.
 
I don't compete, but we shoot a lot of "precision" .223 ammo. I've never found Lapua brass (in .223) to make a significant difference.

I'd just load a same lot of LC or some good kind of brass, and brass life be damned. Many of my loads are 2 and done for the primer pockets.
 
My loads run around 2900 FPS depending on the rifle in which they are fired, and cases are good for 8-10 loadings without annealing. Primer pockets have not been a problem on most brands.

When the case neck splits, it is converted to 7.62x25 as long as the rest of the case is okay.
 
Well, I know if you shoot an 80g @ 2850 from a 20 inch barrel the brass lasts one firing. :) But damn it shoots good.
I had some 88 ELDM over 2850 in a +2" gas tube, 24" gas gun with an insane amount of 8208 in LC brass. I didn't even bother to bring the brass home. straight into the recycle bin. It hammered at 800-1000 yards. I may have a few pieces somewhere - I should check and see how stretched it really was.

Typical mag length gas gun loads for 77 gr bullets going 2700-2750 I can get 4-5 loadings from LC without annealing before I start to see loose primer pockets or neck splits. some lots better some lots worse. I had a non NATO cross stamped LC-10 that had loose pockets after 2 firings. I had one set of old Winchester brass that I finally scrapped but it was holding up after 12 reloads in gas gun.
 
I had some 88 ELDM over 2850 in a +2" gas tube, 24" gas gun with an insane amount of 8208 in LC brass. I didn't even bother to bring the brass home. straight into the recycle bin. It hammered at 800-1000 yards. I may have a few pieces somewhere - I should check and see how stretched it really was.

Typical mag length gas gun loads for 77 gr bullets going 2700-2750 I can get 4-5 loadings from LC without annealing before I start to see loose primer pockets or neck splits. some lots better some lots worse. I had a non NATO cross stamped LC-10 that had loose pockets after 2 firings. I had one set of old Winchester brass that I finally scrapped but it was holding up after 12 reloads in gas gun.
Maybe I just need to load up using lake city and see how the rifle does then I won’t care as much
 

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